Schneider waived

I'm stunned that he cleared, absolutely stunned. It is definitely a huge contract though...so in a way, it makes sense that he cleared...We now have a chance to get him for much cheaper...unless somebody makes a move, it's very possible...

Teams ahead of us:

1.Montreal - has 1 million in cap space and just blew the load on Lang. They probably couldn't and don't want to clear the requisite space to sign a 2.8 million D-man (unless it's to stop us)

2.Pittsburgh - same as Montreal - although they'll get cap relief from Whitney's injury.

3.New Jersey wants him really, really badly, but they have very little (1.3 million) to spend. They might be the ones who clear space to claim him.

4.Minny - they have 466 D-men already, would they take another? Probably not.

5.Colorado has Liles as it is, but I could see they going for him. They have enough cap space to sink a ship - even if they bring Forsberg back.

6.Ottawa - we can do this in a walk. :D

PKC wrote:

I don't think they will move Giguere. He has a NTC, for one. And his son has a certain medical condition that can only be treated at one of the local University campuses, I believe it maybe UCLA.

The NTC could hurt Burke's chances of moving him - but as we've seen, it hasn't really stopped him from waiving dudes left, right and center.

BigRig77 wrote:

504Heater wrote:

WhamBamCam wrote:thats amazing...he is gonna be recalled and claimed on re-entry for sure...i would love for Boston to snag him for 2.8 or so..worth it then...

Beep beep my Boston friend! Us first.

how does that work? Is Boston not ahead of us? or does it go in reverse order in the re-entry?

I think it goes reverse order now, from 1st to 30th. If I'm wrong, I did that list for nothin. :x

Yep, it appears he's cleared:

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/hockey/comments/schneider_clears_waivers/

That is pretty stunning in my books. When I look at the D for teams like LA, ATL, and CBJ, I think they desperately need a guy like Schneider.

Anyway, again, this DOES NOT MEAN that Schneider is now on recall waivers. Burke would have to recall him to the team for that to happen; that would be a last, last, last resort. I think they're likely to try other route before that happens -- i.e., trades that involve taking on minor salary or giving up a draft pick. I believe that a buyout is still an option, too, because they still have an unsigned RFA, and that I think that that might give them a small window to buy players out.

rooneypoo wrote:Yep, it appears he's cleared:

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/hockey/comments/schneider_clears_waivers/

That is pretty stunning in my books. When I look at the D for teams like LA, ATL, and CBJ, I think they desperately need a guy like Schneider.

Anyway, again, this DOES NOT MEAN that Schneider is now on recall waivers. Burke would have to recall him to the team for that to happen; that would be a last, last, last resort. I think they're likely to try other route before that happens -- i.e., trades that involve taking on minor salary or giving up a draft pick. I believe that a buyout is still an option, too, because they still have an unsigned RFA, and that I think that that might give them a small window to buy players out.

Internal caps are a Wing Dang Doodle.

How do you trade someone that has to clear waivers? If he was traded to say...Ottawa for a 3rd rounder, wouldn't Ottawa have to recall him through re-entry waivers?

If he's gonna buy him out, do it today please, so Murray can chat with him this afternoon. :D

PKC wrote:

I don't think they will move Giguere. He has a NTC, for one. And his son has a certain medical condition that can only be treated at one of the local University campuses, I believe it maybe UCLA.

I've even heard that due to his sons condition he has considered retiring and spending time with his wife and son.

504Heater wrote:

PKC wrote:

I don't think they will move Giguere. He has a NTC, for one. And his son has a certain medical condition that can only be treated at one of the local University campuses, I believe it maybe UCLA.

The NTC could hurt Burke's chances of moving him - but as we've seen, it hasn't really stopped him from waiving dudes left, right and center.

Man, if LA pass up on him, you could be just right on this one. Let's say it gets down to us, who goes?

Also, I'm under the impression there are no re-entry waivers until the season starts. Is this true?

rooneypoo wrote:Yep, it appears he's cleared:

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/hockey/comments/schneider_clears_waivers/

That is pretty stunning in my books. When I look at the D for teams like LA, ATL, and CBJ, I think they desperately need a guy like Schneider.

Anyway, again, this DOES NOT MEAN that Schneider is now on recall waivers. Burke would have to recall him to the team for that to happen; that would be a last, last, last resort. I think they're likely to try other route before that happens -- i.e., trades that involve taking on minor salary or giving up a draft pick. I believe that a buyout is still an option, too, because they still have an unsigned RFA, and that I think that that might give them a small window to buy players out.

In the Columbus papers they already said they have no interest in bringing him in though.

jamvan wrote:
Man, if LA pass up on him, you could be just right on this one. Let's say it gets down to us, who goes?

Also, I'm under the impression there are no re-entry waivers until the season starts. Is this true?

No, I don't believe that's true.

What order does re-entry go in? That's the question right now.

504Heater wrote:

jamvan wrote:
Man, if LA pass up on him, you could be just right on this one. Let's say it gets down to us, who goes?

Also, I'm under the impression there are no re-entry waivers until the season starts. Is this true?

No, I don't believe that's true.

What order does re-entry go in? That's the question right now.

Garrioch had an update 18 minutes ago quoting Murray saying he will pass on Schneider...http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/Senators/2008/09/17/6791796.html

504Heater wrote:

Internal caps are a Wing Dang Doodle.

How do you trade someone that has to clear waivers? If he was traded to say...Ottawa for a 3rd rounder, wouldn't Ottawa have to recall him through re-entry waivers?

If he's gonna buy him out, do it today please, so Murray can chat with him this afternoon. :D

Ooh, yea, you may be right about that. I mean, when you waive a guy and he goes unclaimed, you retain his rights, so hypothetically you could trade him -- but I'm not sure what happens after that. If he'd have to pass back through re-entry waivers, then no one would trade for him.

Anyone remember the details of what happened with Mark Recchi last year? He was waivered and I believe he cleared (I think?), and then he ended up in ATL. His situation might help us understand Schneider's.

Anyway, if a trade is not an option nor a buyout (I'm looking in to the CBA for this right now), then re-entry waivers would indeed be the only solution... and if re-entry waivers work in reverse order, as you suggest Heater, we actually might have a chance to pick him up....

A potentially stunning turn of events....

jamvan wrote:

504Heater wrote:

jamvan wrote:
Man, if LA pass up on him, you could be just right on this one. Let's say it gets down to us, who goes?

Also, I'm under the impression there are no re-entry waivers until the season starts. Is this true?

No, I don't believe that's true.

What order does re-entry go in? That's the question right now.

Garrioch had an update 18 minutes ago quoting Murray saying he will pass on Schneider...http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/Senators/2008/09/17/6791796.html

Murray only commented on taking Schneider off of waivers...it has nothing to do with rentry waivers.

I'm curious why Murray is publically stating that they would move players to bring Sundin in, but then saying they can't afford the one thing he's publically stating they need, a puck moving defenseman.

Something smells at the scotiabank place.

jamvan wrote:
Garrioch had an update 18 minutes ago quoting Murray saying he will pass on Schneider...http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/Senators/2008/09/17/6791796.html

Bull Dung.

rooneypoo wrote:
Ooh, yea, you may be right about that. I mean, when you waive a guy and he goes unclaimed, you retain his rights, so hypothetically you could trade him -- but I'm not sure what happens after that. If he'd have to pass back through re-entry waivers, then no one would trade for him.

Anyone remember the details of what happened with Mark Recchi last year? He was waivered and I believe he cleared (I think?), and then he ended up in ATL. His situation might help us understand Schneider's.

Anyway, if a trade is not an option nor a buyout (I'm looking in to the CBA for this right now), then re-entry waivers would indeed be the only solution... and if re-entry waivers work in reverse order, as you suggest Heater, we actually might have a chance to pick him up....

A potentially stunning turn of events....

Here's another stunning turn of events:

Burke hasn't 'designated Schneider for assignment' apparently, so there's no recall waiver Dung yet.

He's looking to trade Schneider and potentially a high pick or high prospect and take someone's 2 million dollar mistake to get rid of him. He'd then waive the player he acquired and shed the entire salary.

What the hell is happening with Anaheim. Selanne is good...but...this is a lot of trouble.

504Heater wrote:

rooneypoo wrote:
Ooh, yea, you may be right about that. I mean, when you waive a guy and he goes unclaimed, you retain his rights, so hypothetically you could trade him -- but I'm not sure what happens after that. If he'd have to pass back through re-entry waivers, then no one would trade for him.

Anyone remember the details of what happened with Mark Recchi last year? He was waivered and I believe he cleared (I think?), and then he ended up in ATL. His situation might help us understand Schneider's.

Anyway, if a trade is not an option nor a buyout (I'm looking in to the CBA for this right now), then re-entry waivers would indeed be the only solution... and if re-entry waivers work in reverse order, as you suggest Heater, we actually might have a chance to pick him up....

A potentially stunning turn of events....

Here's another stunning turn of events:

Burke hasn't 'designated Schneider for assignment' apparently, so there's no recall waiver Dung yet.

He's looking to trade Schneider and potentially a high pick or high prospect and take someone's 2 million dollar mistake to get rid of him. He'd then waive the player he acquired and shed the entire salary.

What the hell is happening with Anaheim. Selanne is good...but...this is a lot of trouble.

WOW! Will wonders never cease. I think we got rid of all our $2 million mistakes. Hmmm

I've found the relevant passage on buyouts in the CBA. Turns out I was confusing "RFAs with arbitration rights" with plain old "RFAs."

This means that Schneider is not a candidate for a buyout, and nor would any team be in a position to buy him out (all arbitration hearing having come to an end).

So, the options are

1) trade him with a high pick / prospect to a team who will then bring him through re-entry waivers -- either he clears and they keep him and his full salary, or they lose him and are left with half of his salary. In this scenario, you're basically paying someone else a pick/prospect to absorb the costs / cap hit of Schneider's salary / half salary.

2) bring him back through re-entry waivers, at which point he'll certainly be claimed by another team and ANA will be stuck with half of his salary on the books.

Looking at those options, the first seems more likely. Looking at the list of teams in line to put in a claim on Schneider whenever he is eventually brought back through re-entry waivers (and provided that Heater is right about the order of precedence changing from 30-1 to 1-30, the only teams in front of us who might claim him would be NJ (who could certainly use him, but who are very tight against the cap as it is), MIN (who already have Zidlicky, Burns, and MAB), and COL (who have tonnes of space).

We might actually have a shot at this, although it might take weeks for all this to happen. I can't imagine passing Schneider up if he's to be had for $2.8 mil.

rooneypoo wrote:I've found the relevant passage on buyouts in the CBA. Turns out I was confusing "RFAs with arbitration rights" with plain old "RFAs."

This means that Schneider is not a candidate for a buyout, and nor would any team be in a position to buy him out (all arbitration hearing having come to an end).

So, the options are

1) trade him with a high pick / prospect to a team who will then bring him through re-entry waivers -- either he clears and they keep him and his full salary, or they lose him and are left with half of his salary. In this scenario, you're basically paying someone else a pick/prospect to absorb the costs / cap hit of Schneider's salary / half salary.

2) bring him back through re-entry waivers, at which point he'll certainly be claimed by another team and ANA will be stuck with half of his salary on the books.

Looking at those options, the first seems more likely. Looking at the list of teams in line to put in a claim on Schneider whenever he is eventually brought back through re-entry waivers (and provided that Heater is right about the order of precedence changing from 30-1 to 1-30, the only teams in front of us who might claim him would be NJ (who could certainly use him, but who are very tight against the cap as it is), MIN (who already have Zidlicky, Burns, and MAB), and COL (who have tonnes of space).

We might actually have a shot at this, although it might take weeks for all this to happen. I can't imagine passing Schneider up if he's to be had for $2.8 mil.

I could be wrong, but I thought there was a max to how much a team could exceed the cap prior to the start of season. Every team has to be under by the start of season else face penalties, but I thought they could only be over by a certain amount prior to the start.

If that's the case, does anyone know what that amount is? This would most certainly mean that New Jersey would have to move someone prior to pulling Schneider off of re-entry waivers. Such a move would signal to Murray that he won't make it to them.