Alfie about to sign four year deal!!!!!!

It was also grandfathered because his salary was over the maximum allowed for a single player (under the new CBA)

504Heater wrote:

That was just bad management though. Any deals signed before the cap hit goes down would be subject to the grandfather rule, no?

As far as I'm aware, there's no grandfathering or flexibility when it comes to these things. If the salary cap dropped to $40 mil next year (unlikely, but just by way of example), we'd have to become cap compliant by moving salary, no ifs, ands, or buts.

That's why some of these ridiculously long, expensive contracts are so irresponsible. If the cap drops significantly for an extended period of time, there literally might not be a market for guys like Brian Campbell, who, good as he is, is not worth $7+ mil dollars. Same goes for Briere and Drury. I really hope the NHL looks at re-tooling aspects of the CBA; specifically, I hope they make it so that two teams can pay parts of one player's salary. That would help prevent a number of potential problems down the road.

We're going to learn a lot of new things about how to, and how not to, sign players in the next couple of years if the cap goes down significantly. Bad signings will rise to the top quickly because they will cripple teams, forcing them to move cheaper players because no one can accommodate the more expensive salary and still ice a competitive team (imagine having close to a 1/3rd of your team's salary invested in Huet and Campbell?). Hopefully, if that happens, it will teach GMs not to sign players for ridiculous amounts for long terms. Of course, that was what the salary cap was supposed to do in the first place...

Laker wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:As far as I know the only grandfathering was with deals like Jagr's. I think now that the Cap CBA is in place you are stuck figuring out how to make it work. I think the problem comes with players making the Cap player Max (Are there any) that would then be over the percentage of the Cap if it drops.

Yashin's too... who you ask is that, he used to play for the Senators and we traded him for Chara, Spezza, and Mckault(sp) At this point, Mckault would have been fair trade haha.

I don't think Yashin's contract was grandfathered ... the buyout hits their cap. Jagr's contract was grandfathered because Washington was paying half his salary ... something no longer allowed.

The league max was 7 mil when the new CBA was signed, and even with the roll back in salary of 24%, Yashin was still making 7.8 mil I believe. If I'm wrong, then, well I'm wrong, haha, but thats why his contract was granfathered in.

A few points/questions/rants:

1. Doesn't the CBA have provisions for the "final year must be half the first year" rule only for players under 35? i.e. Alfie would be exempt anyhow.
   
2. Given his recent injuries, Alfie may not end up playing in the fourth year of his contract (thus the lack of bonus that year); he an Melnyk may already be aware of this, and may be ready for him to go on LTIR, thus taking his salary off the cap after three years, but using the rules to effectively get $7.2M/y for a $5.5M cap hit. I didn't do the math, but it may be even more lucrative for Alfie if he goes out after two years.
   
3. From what I understand, the CBA included the escrow component to account for reductions in the cap - if the cap drops, then for that one year, the effective player salary ends up being less than the negotiated amount (of course next year, the team is still up the creek...) If GMs/owners are comfortable that this is just a "blip", then they may not learn or change anything, hoping to ride it out.
   
4. Boo-boo is an idiot. For a so-called "local expert" on hockey and the Sens, you'd think he'd have worded it better. Kudos to those that did, on behalf of those that were confused by the media.
   
5. Alfie is a hero for doing this. As was said, it will be hard for anybody to walk into Murray's office and claim with a straight face that they deserve more. Somebody should tell Dany and Jason that if they don't kick it up a notch, perhaps they should consider repaying some of what they get.
   
6. Boo-boo is an idiot. This was so bad a screw-up, it bore repeating.
   

Thanks for letting me vent.

Acrobat wrote:A few points/questions/rants:

1. Doesn't the CBA have provisions for the "final year must be half the first year" rule only for players under 35? i.e. Alfie would be exempt anyhow.
   
2. Given his recent injuries, Alfie may not end up playing in the fourth year of his contract (thus the lack of bonus that year); he an Melnyk may already be aware of this, and may be ready for him to go on LTIR, thus taking his salary off the cap after three years, but using the rules to effectively get $7.2M/y for a $5.5M cap hit. I didn't do the math, but it may be even more lucrative for Alfie if he goes out after two years.
   
3. From what I understand, the CBA included the escrow component to account for reductions in the cap - if the cap drops, then for that one year, the effective player salary ends up being less than the negotiated amount (of course next year, the team is still up the creek...) If GMs/owners are comfortable that this is just a "blip", then they may not learn or change anything, hoping to ride it out.
   
4. Boo-boo is an idiot. For a so-called "local expert" on hockey and the Sens, you'd think he'd have worded it better. Kudos to those that did, on behalf of those that were confused by the media.
   
5. Alfie is a hero for doing this. As was said, it will be hard for anybody to walk into Murray's office and claim with a straight face that they deserve more. Somebody should tell Dany and Jason that if they don't kick it up a notch, perhaps they should consider repaying some of what they get.
   
6. Boo-boo is an idiot. This was so bad a screw-up, it bore repeating.
   

Thanks for letting me vent.

Garrioch's glaring mistakes in his article are inexcusable. How can anyone take this guy seriously? Sun media actually pays for this?

http://www.globesports.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20081030.walfie1030/GSStory/GlobeSportsHockey/home

Wait though, there's more to this than actually meets the eye I think.

This is going to go down as a 21.6/4 year thing (5.4 million) I'm pretty sure. But it clearly states that 2.1 million of it is a bonus for buying out Alfie's option years. They've closed the loophole that allows guys over 35 to be paid bonuses that don't count against the cap - but this 'option buyout' is a strange bird. No one can seem to get a true handle on it yet.

I'm SURE he didn't, but imagine if Murray found that one little loophole and used it here? That would be a pretty handy 4.88 million cap hit.

504Heater wrote:http://www.globesports.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20081030.walfie1030/GSStory/GlobeSportsHockey/home

Wait though, there's more to this than actually meets the eye I think.

This is going to go down as a 21.6/4 year thing (5.4 million) I'm pretty sure. But it clearly states that 2.1 million of it is a bonus for buying out Alfie's option years. They've closed the loophole that allows guys over 35 to be paid bonuses that don't count against the cap - but this 'option buyout' is a strange bird. No one can seem to get a true handle on it yet.

I'm SURE he didn't, but imagine if Murray found that one little loophole and used it here? That would be a pretty handy 4.88 million cap hit.

Well his option years were grandfathered into the new CBA weren't they? I don't believe there are option years anymore, although, I could be completely wrong. Perhaps there is something in the CBA that allows for buying out these options.

The loophole you are referring to is the cushion that applies to bonuses for over 35 and entry level guys where the bonuses can be carried over until the next season, at least it's worked this way up until this season, but with the player's holding the right to reopen the CBA the league has has to enforce every dollar of bonuses hard against the cap this year, which is why Chicago got into cap trouble before the season started. (well that and the Brinks truck they gave to Campbell).

Kudos to Murray though if he stole a page of Burke's guide to cap scamming management.

hemlock34 wrote:
Well his option years were grandfathered into the new CBA weren't they? I don't believe there are option years anymore, although, I could be completely wrong. Perhaps there is something in the CBA that allows for buying out these options.

The loophole you are referring to is the cushion that applies to bonuses for over 35 and entry level guys where the bonuses can be carried over until the next season, at least it's worked this way up until this season, but with the player's holding the right to reopen the CBA the league has has to enforce every dollar of bonuses hard against the cap this year, which is why Chicago got into cap trouble before the season started. (well that and the Brinks truck they gave to Campbell).

Kudos to Murray though if he stole a page of Burke's guide to cap scamming management.

In this case, because the options were agreed to before the new CBA, the buyout of the options becomes part of the inital 'grandfathering', and thus is voided from counting against the cap. That was my inital understanding of what is an ubelievably complex contract apparently.

It helps that Alfie was one of the - if not the - president of the PA when the inital CBA was struck...leads me to believe that he might know what's going on.

Probably nothing, but there is an air of 'what the ****' going on out there tonight. I'm sure we'll find out tomorrow (NOT from Boo-boo) if there's anything more to this.

Here's some more info on the break down:

From: http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/Senators/2008/10/31/7258681-sun.html

For now, the cap hit to the Senators will be $4.875 million per year because the league hasn't decided how to account for a $2.1-million bonus Ottawa included next year to buy out the option years on Alfredsson's contract.

How Daniel Alfredsson's new four-year, $21.6-million (all terms US) deal breaks down:

2009-10: $4-million salary, $3-million signing bonus, plus $2.1-million buyout from the option years of his old contract. Total: $9.1 million

2010-11: $4-million salary, $3-million signing bonus. Total: $7 million

2011-12: $2-million salary, $2.5-million signing bonus. Total: $4.5 million

2012-13: $1 million salary.

Interesting.

Points for Murray if that doesn't count against the cap!!

Good quote from Spezza in the Sun today:

Alfredsson will have the unique ability to play his career in one uniform and Senators centre Jason Spezza hopes to follow suit.
"I'm still early in my career, but I hope so," said Spezza. "I'm signed here for a long time and that's my intention. I want to be here, I've built roots here, but I don't make that decision. I think it's realistic. Hopefully, I can be one of those (players)."

That's what I want to hear from our players. I don't hear Kovalchuk giving these sorts of quotes...

Murray is a beast. Look at the contracts he's locked up our players to. Look at the amount of money we have for next year, the players coming down the pipe in the farm system, the draft picks we have for next year's draft.

Anybody who panics and calls for this guy's head should have their head called for.

I'm glad to hear it from Spezza but I would have rather heard something more from Alfie stating clearly that one reason he signed this deal is to play along side Spezza, Heatley, Fisher and Phillips for the duration of his contract knowing they'll be competitive.

PKC wrote:Murray is a beast. Look at the contracts he's locked up our players to. Look at the amount of money we have for next year, the players coming down the pipe in the farm system, the draft picks we have for next year's draft.

Anybody who panics and calls for this guy's head should have their head called for.

One of the best, no doubt. And he does it in a market where the fans are fickle, the media invasive, and the demands for results are huge. Hard to keep a cool head, but the man does it time and time again.

Glad he's on our side, that's for Diddle sure. And if there is anyone I'd want up there figuring out our goalie situation, it would be him. He could probably make gatorade from lemons.

Couldn't agree more. Good on Muckler for trying, but Murray is absolutely the brains behind our organization.

I gotta say this again. I like the players Murray obtained this season.

Smith - A+ signing

Ruutu - A+ signing

Auld - A+ for the role he was meant to fill

I never took issue with those and I think they're great. Being that I'm very impatient, I want all deficient areas filled now but I understand it's a process and Murray is working his magic I have no doubt.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I gotta say this again. I like the players Murray obtained this season.

Smith - A+ signing

Ruutu - A+ signing

Auld - A+ for the role he was meant to fill

I never took issue with those and I think they're great. Being that I'm very impatient, I want all deficient areas filled now but I understand it's a process and Murray is working his magic I have no doubt.

Agreed. The Kuba acquisition has worked out well and Picard seems to be improving his play each game.