Regin and Campoli file for arbitration

I wouldn't say it's research out the window, that was an interesting list that spanned back through the years a bit.

wprager wrote:While I agree with what you're saying if it is the team that files, when it's the player, I feel quite differently. It *is* a move aimed at getting more than the team is willing to offer -- the side-effect of the player not being threatened by an offer sheet is nice, but if he really was on someone's radar, why has he not gotten one yet? And, yes, you're right, 80% (or some-such) of the time it ends outside the arbiter's office, but 100% o those times it costs the team higher than the initial offer (which, granted, was only a QO).

I'm not surprised at Campoli, but I was hoping that Regin would have chosen to *not* go down this path.

Players never, ever get a big payout from the arbiter. Again, look at the history. Cammalleri got $3.5 mil. Avery got under $2 mil. Vermette got $2.5 mil or so. All of these are guys who produced WAY more than either Regin or Campoli, and who mostly all had upsides, and who played far more central roles on their teams.

Most of the time, too, the GM for the team in question simply hasn't yet had the time to deal with his RFAs -- or hasn't made re-signing his RFAs his top priority -- before the arbitration filing date passes. RFAs file for arbitration and then sign after the arbitration filing date, in most instances because their GMs haven't really talked to them much or had the time (what with the draft, free agency, and dealing with the team's UFAs) to hammer out a deal with them.

Arbitration-eligible players file for arbitration 100 times out of 100. It's no big deal, and it's nothing to worry about. No need for drama here.

I stand to be corrected because I'm not 100% sure on this, but I recall in 2004 there being a large number of players who filed for arbitration. Some players received increases in the 2 million range, and one player, my beloved Scott Niedermayer went from 4 million, to 7 Million.

As I said I could be wrong, but I believe my memory is correct.

Now with that said, 2004 was a crazy time for arbitration and that is the only year that I ever recall the players benefiting at all.

Take that year out of the picture, ergo since then, and Rooney is right, large jumps in Salary just don't happy especially to players in the 2nd or 3rd year.

Large jumps *should not* happen to 2nd/3rd year players.

The biggest issue with arbitration is it tries to level a playing field that is never level, while comparing apples to oranges but a person who, usually, knows little about hockey.

What one player is worth to a particular team is not always indicative of the market as a whole, but just one, specific regional area. What a player does to the community, how the payer attracts new fans -- that is never taken into consideration because all the arbiter does is look at stats and other numbers (like age, height, weight, etc.) There are many, many other reasons that go into deciding what a particular player is worth to a specific organization in a given time frame, and most of those are tossed out the window in arbitration.

Here's another comparable for Regin: S. Kostitsyn had 18 points in 48 games, which works out to 28 points had he played the same number of games as Regin (who got 29). In previous seasons, he tallied 27 and 23 points in 52 and 56 games, respectively. He signed for $550K.

Them's the comparables. I'm in no way suggesting that Kostitsyn and Regin are equitable in any other way.

haha I hope that comparable is used! that's even less than what Regin earned last year!

My prediction: If it goes to arbitration process, I think Regin gets a 2-year, $3M contract. If Murray works his magic, he'll sign Regin to a 3-year $4.5M

time to get this thread going again....

what do you guys think about Campoli? He's not been discussed that much, but senschirp has speculated that the sens aren't focusing too much on him (rather focusing more on Regin).

What will happen with Campoli? Cowen is emerging, and doesn't look like Kuba is going anywhere soooo....if arbitration award is high, do they just let him walk? Or sign and trade? or trade someone else...decisions decisions.

Enough tumbleweeds! Time to get this discussion going again

Michallica wrote:time to get this thread going again....

what do you guys think about Campoli? He's not been discussed that much, but senschirp has speculated that the sens aren't focusing too much on him (rather focusing more on Regin).

What will happen with Campoli? Cowen is emerging, and doesn't look like Kuba is going anywhere soooo....if arbitration award is high, do they just let him walk? Or sign and trade? or trade someone else...decisions decisions.

Enough tumbleweeds! Time to get this discussion going again

We can't sign and trade after the ruling, so it has to be now. I'm frankly surprised he's still a Senator. We have little to no use for him.

But yes, good call on getting this back on track. We need news!

SpezDispenser wrote:

Michallica wrote:time to get this thread going again....

what do you guys think about Campoli? He's not been discussed that much, but senschirp has speculated that the sens aren't focusing too much on him (rather focusing more on Regin).

What will happen with Campoli? Cowen is emerging, and doesn't look like Kuba is going anywhere soooo....if arbitration award is high, do they just let him walk? Or sign and trade? or trade someone else...decisions decisions.

Enough tumbleweeds! Time to get this discussion going again

We can't sign and trade after the ruling, so it has to be now. I'm frankly surprised he's still a Senator. We have little to no use for him.

But yes, good call on getting this back on track. We need news!

oh we can't sign and trade after ruling? hmm well they might as well overpay a little and get him to agree to terms and then trade him. Or they could just make life alot easier and just trade Kuba (this is if they really want Cowen to play in the NHL).

I guess we'll have to see with the abitration reward for Campoli. I'm actually starting to think that perhaps Carkner might be in danger of being the 7th d-man if Cowen really impresses (and we get rid of Lee)

But who do we have that replaces Carkner? Other than Neil, who else would step up and fight when needed? The guys you WANT fighting are guys your team can afford to lose for 5 minutes. Problem with Carkner fighting was it often put our team down to 5, sometimes 4 defenceman (when injuries or penalties struck).

Dash wrote:But who do we have that replaces Carkner? Other than Neil, who else would step up and fight when needed? The guys you WANT fighting are guys your team can afford to lose for 5 minutes. Problem with Carkner fighting was it often put our team down to 5, sometimes 4 defenceman (when injuries or penalties struck).

wait...then isn't that a reason to replace carkner? precisely because its too easy for other teams to send their enforcers out to fight carkner, and take him out for 5 mins. I'm just throwing it out there...I don't think they trade him, but maybe by the end of the year, he's the 7th dman

Michallica wrote:
oh we can't sign and trade after ruling? hmm well they might as well overpay a little and get him to agree to terms and then trade him. Or they could just make life alot easier and just trade Kuba (this is if they really want Cowen to play in the NHL).

I guess we'll have to see with the abitration reward for Campoli. I'm actually starting to think that perhaps Carkner might be in danger of being the 7th d-man if Cowen really impresses (and we get rid of Lee)

If we trade Kuba, I believe our season is in jeopardy. Is that an over-reaction? Maye, but I can't imagine Cowen or Campoli or Carkner (who plays a different side) or Lee (ditto, he plays the right side) taking over for Kuba and logging 20+ minutes a night. *maybe* Campoli, but I don't really see that personally.

The Sens can't walk away from the award if it's below a certain amount. Can't find what the amount it, but I imagine it's around 1.2 (I have no knowledge, that's a guess).

Again, I express my surprise that Campoli is still a Sen. Cowen would be better suited to play with Carkner and get his feet wet IMO.

Michallica wrote:

wait...then isn't that a reason to replace carkner? precisely because its too easy for other teams to send their enforcers out to fight carkner, and take him out for 5 mins. I'm just throwing it out there...I don't think they trade him, but maybe by the end of the year, he's the 7th dman

It's not just the fighting, frankly I couldn't really care less about fighting, it's the crease-clearing, bone-crushing D-men that we're lacking. If we get rid of Carkner, we're a tiny little team, with a tiny little D where only Phillips is physical (and maybe Cowen, but it would be his first year). Gryba could replace Carkner, but to what end?

From SensChirp:


The Curious Case of Chris Campoli
Sorry about the title...

Restricted free agent defenceman Chris Campoli has an arbitration hearing scheduled for August 4th. What happens before that hearing, or in it for that matter, is any one's guess.

The Senators have a bit of a log jam on the back end as it is. With the club hoping Jared Cowen can grab a spot in camp, there really isn't a ton of space on the Senators blue line this season.

Gonchar, Phillips, Karlsson, Kuba are all locks. After that you have a group that includes Cowen, Lee, Carkner and Chris Campoli all pushing for spots.

There have been rumblings out there suggesting that the Senators may walk away from Campoli if the ruling reaches a certain amount. As I understand it, the club can not walk away unless the award is over a particular value so this is only an option if Campoli wins his arbitration hearing.

Walking away from Campoli would be a strange move though. The team gave up a first round pick to get him in the first place and I thought Campoli looked much better in the second half of the season.

To make all this even more complicated, a contact suggested to me yesterday that Campoli turned down a 4 year extension last fall because he thought the 09/10 season would be a break out one.

Has to be kicking himself now.

How would you like to see the Sens handle the situation on the back end?

SpezDispenser wrote:

Michallica wrote:
oh we can't sign and trade after ruling? hmm well they might as well overpay a little and get him to agree to terms and then trade him. Or they could just make life alot easier and just trade Kuba (this is if they really want Cowen to play in the NHL).

I guess we'll have to see with the abitration reward for Campoli. I'm actually starting to think that perhaps Carkner might be in danger of being the 7th d-man if Cowen really impresses (and we get rid of Lee)

If we trade Kuba, I believe our season is in jeopardy. Is that an over-reaction? Maye, but I can't imagine Cowen or Campoli or Carkner (who plays a different side) or Lee (ditto, he plays the right side) taking over for Kuba and logging 20+ minutes a night. *maybe* Campoli, but I don't really see that personally.

The Sens can't walk away from the award if it's below a certain amount. Can't find what the amount it, but I imagine it's around 1.2 (I have no knowledge, that's a guess).

Again, I express my surprise that Campoli is still a Sen. Cowen would be better suited to play with Carkner and get his feet wet IMO.

I'm no hockey guru, but my guess is that they just want some security in case Cowen really isn't ready for the big leagues. This won't be known until training camp. They probably also don't want to just hand Cowen anything, so the competitive nature will be there all throughout. If Cowen is really that damn good, then I'm sure BM makes the required space for him. How does arbitration work though, can you be traded at all if you've been awarded arbitration?

Michallica wrote:
I'm no hockey guru, but my guess is that they just want some security in case Cowen really isn't ready for the big leagues. This won't be known until training camp. They probably also don't want to just hand Cowen anything, so the competitive nature will be there all throughout. If Cowen is really that damn good, then I'm sure BM makes the required space for him. How does arbitration work though, can you be traded at all if you've been awarded arbitration?

Great question.

I think you can trade a player all the way up until he gets his awarded contract through an arbitrator. Then you have to wait a minimum of one year before trading that player.

So if we were to trade Campoli for an AHL D-man (boy, do we ever need one), then the team acquiring him would still be responsible for the arbitration hearing etc. But I could be wrong.

I'll say this: the clock ticks towards Regin's hearing Friday morning. This is important, I'd like to see him get 1.2 X 2 tomorrow and avoid that Dung.

SpezDispenser wrote:

Michallica wrote:
I'm no hockey guru, but my guess is that they just want some security in case Cowen really isn't ready for the big leagues. This won't be known until training camp. They probably also don't want to just hand Cowen anything, so the competitive nature will be there all throughout. If Cowen is really that damn good, then I'm sure BM makes the required space for him. How does arbitration work though, can you be traded at all if you've been awarded arbitration?

Great question.

I think you can trade a player all the way up until he gets his awarded contract through an arbitrator. Then you have to wait a minimum of one year before trading that player.

So if we were to trade Campoli for an AHL D-man (boy, do we ever need one), then the team acquiring him would still be responsible for the arbitration hearing etc. But I could be wrong.

wow a year? okay then unless the sens walk away from the contract awarded, I don't see him going anywhere. Then the only d-men who can be traded this upcoming season are Kuba, Carkner, and Lee, out of which it just doesn't make sense to trade any of those guys. Well maybe Kuba, but he might be very useful for the sens this coming season. Tough call....and really its unnecessary to trade any of those three, so I just see Cowen being returned back to Spokane.