Trade Proposal - Would Sens fans do this?

HowieMorenz wrote:here are some 1 for 1 forward names, one from each team:

Anaheim - Getzlaf
Atlanta - Little
Boston - Bergeron
Buffalo - Vanek
Calagary - Iginla
Carolina - Staal
Chicago - Kane
Colorado - Hedjuk
Columbus - Brassard
Dallas - Morrow
Detroit - Datsuk
Edmonton - Hemsky
Florida - Horton
LA - Kopitar
Minne - Gaborik
Montreal - Higgins
Nash - Legwand
Isls - Bailey
Rangers - Dubinski
Philli - Carter
Phoenix - Handzal
Pitts - Malkin
SJ - Thornton
STL - Backes
Tampa - St louis
Toronto - Kulemin
Vancouver -Burrows


Out of all these players, and more that would slide in, could we not swing heatley in there.

Mathematically heatley makes more than these players, so it shouldn't be a problem right?

Something doesn't equate .......

So many of those players are either miles behind Heatley or better than he is.

A 1 for 1 is not happening. We need an elite piece, yes, but if the failings with the CASH line of the past couple of years has taught us anything, it's that depth is key.

asq2 wrote:

HowieMorenz wrote:here are some 1 for 1 forward names, one from each team:

Anaheim - Getzlaf
Atlanta - Little
Boston - Bergeron
Buffalo - Vanek
Calagary - Iginla
Carolina - Staal
Chicago - Kane
Colorado - Hedjuk
Columbus - Brassard
Dallas - Morrow
Detroit - Datsuk
Edmonton - Hemsky
Florida - Horton
LA - Kopitar
Minne - Gaborik
Montreal - Higgins
Nash - Legwand
Isls - Bailey
Rangers - Dubinski
Philli - Carter
Phoenix - Handzal
Pitts - Malkin
SJ - Thornton
STL - Backes
Tampa - St louis
Toronto - Kulemin
Vancouver -Burrows


Out of all these players, and more that would slide in, could we not swing heatley in there.

Mathematically heatley makes more than these players, so it shouldn't be a problem right?

Something doesn't equate .......

So many of those players are either miles behind Heatley or better than he is.

A 1 for 1 is not happening. We need an elite piece, yes, but if the failings with the CASH line of the past couple of years has taught us anything, it's that depth is key.

Well they'res an old saying, the team who ends up with the bigger player always gets the better deal, and that would be heatley for the other team ....

HowieMorenz wrote:
Well they'res an old saying, the team who ends up with the bigger player always gets the better deal, and that would be heatley for the other team ....

So Philadelphia won the Lindros trade?

And to a lesser degree, SJ won the Thornton trade?

HowieMorenz wrote:Well they'res an old saying, the team who ends up with the bigger player always gets the better deal, and that would be heatley for the other team ....

So if Ottawa were to trade Spezza, Alfredsson and Karlsson for Iginla, would they get the better deal? I don't think so. Iginla's the best player, but the value from Ottawa's side is certainly higher.

Okay I'm starting to get sick of trade rumours. Just give me Brent Burns and that 1st rounder for Heatley and whoever they want from Lee/Picard/Zubov bla bla bla.

asq2 wrote:

HowieMorenz wrote:Well they'res an old saying, the team who ends up with the bigger player always gets the better deal, and that would be heatley for the other team ....

So if Ottawa were to trade its entire team, all prospects and all future picks for Jarome Iginla, they would have won the deal?

We're talking Spezza, Heatley, Alfredsson, Foligno, Karlsson, Volchenkov, the 9th over-all pick, Leclaire, etc. etc. etc.

For Iginla.

Ignoring the inevitable comments about the cap, who wins this deal?

You know he meant in an actual hockey trade, not this ridiculous attempt at being clever asq2.

PKC wrote:

asq2 wrote:

HowieMorenz wrote:Well they'res an old saying, the team who ends up with the bigger player always gets the better deal, and that would be heatley for the other team ....

So if Ottawa were to trade its entire team, all prospects and all future picks for Jarome Iginla, they would have won the deal?

We're talking Spezza, Heatley, Alfredsson, Foligno, Karlsson, Volchenkov, the 9th over-all pick, Leclaire, etc. etc. etc.

For Iginla.

Ignoring the inevitable comments about the cap, who wins this deal?

You know he meant in an actual hockey trade, not this ridiculous attempt at being clever asq2.

Yeah, but I just don't agree. This was my attempt, however absurd, at an illustration of why.

Obviously, it doesn't work the other way either. You can't put 5 players together and necessarily justify their value being higher than Ovechkin's because their point totals were more than Ovechkin's.

I don't think you can so easily judge a winner of a trade. And, I'll repeat that our eperiences with Heatley, Spezza and Alfredsson and then nothing else should be a warning sign that depth is important. Make sure that at least one part of the package for him is elite/has the potential to be elite, but keep in mind lines other than just line 1.

I can see now that I came off a bit of a jerk in that post, though.

asq2 wrote:

PKC wrote:

asq2 wrote:

HowieMorenz wrote:Well they'res an old saying, the team who ends up with the bigger player always gets the better deal, and that would be heatley for the other team ....

So if Ottawa were to trade its entire team, all prospects and all future picks for Jarome Iginla, they would have won the deal?

We're talking Spezza, Heatley, Alfredsson, Foligno, Karlsson, Volchenkov, the 9th over-all pick, Leclaire, etc. etc. etc.

For Iginla.

Ignoring the inevitable comments about the cap, who wins this deal?

You know he meant in an actual hockey trade, not this ridiculous attempt at being clever asq2.

Yeah, but I just don't agree. This was my attempt, however absurd, at an illustration of why.

Obviously, it doesn't work the other way either. You put 5 players together and necessarily justify their value being higher than Ovechkin's because their point totals were more than Ovechkin's.

I don't think you can so easily judge a winner of a trade. And, I'll repeat that our eperiences with Heatley, Spezza and Alfredsson and then nothing else should be a warning sign that depth is important. Make sure that at least one part of the package for him is elite/has the potential to be elite, but keep in mind lines other than just line 1.

I can see now that I came off a bit of a jerk in that post, though.

I agree with the point you're trying to make. And furthermore, I believe you can't really say a team ever wins a trade because the purpose of the trade is to fulfill the independent and unique needs of the two trading teams. Depending on how the traded assets perform, it's safe to say that both teams might consider themselves winners.

For instance:

Dany Heatley is a known quantity in terms of his on-ice production. But a team might also trade for him with considerations for his marketability, merchandising opportunity, star power, all-star appearance(s) which raises the profile of the franchise, etc...

Whereas the Ottawa Senators might receive a package of players that might help us win a Stanley Cup by either providing either now or in the future a player with Dany Heatley's on-ice production or a group of players that contribute all in their unique ways to obtain a Stanley Cup.

I think the point Howie was trying to make was that when you trade for a group of players with the potential but not with the current same production or elite status, and that group of players doesn't produce one player with that production or status that you lose the trade...hence, the team trading for the best player always wins the trade. Essentially, known quantity vs. unknown quantity.

marakh wrote:Okay I'm starting to get sick of trade rumours. Just give me Brent Burns and that 1st rounder for Heatley and whoever they want from Lee/Picard/Zubov bla bla bla.

Yes please!

Sorry guys, I've kinda skipped through the middle pages of this thread- but by FAR the best deal that could be done for us right now would be to trade Heatley for Teubert, Moller, and the 5th overall. In my opinion, this works great for both sides. If need be, we could throw in Schubert or Brian Lee as a sweetener for the deal.

Teubert is an absolute monster, and he's the big body we'll need to support Karlsson down the stretch. Those two are going to be our Pronger/Neidermayer combo. I can't say enough great things about this kid's potential.

Moller would be great to put with fellow swede Alfie on whatever role you choose to put him in (dependent on what other moves Murray makes to bring in top 6 talent). He's quick with good hands, and again comes with a rookie contract and loads of potential.

The 5th round pick would allow us to land a wide array of top talent, and imagine if MPS is available at that spot- Can you see an all swede line of Moller centering MPS and Alfie? I couldn't think of a better protege for the two young guns than Alfie.

Keep in mind, we've also essentially eliminated about 6.5 million in cap space to go out and bring in some talent.


On LA's side- They get a superstar they haven't seen since you-know-who. I'm sure Heatley would love to move to LA. I can't imagine the destruction to be caused with him getting passes from Kopitar on a nightly basis.. Not to mention they've hardly touched their lineup from last year, but added a monster goal scorer.



I think this works out best for both teams. I suppose you could swap Moller for Frolov, or Teubert for Hickey. But as mentioned before- I think Moller, Teubert and 5th would be an AMAZING deal at Ottawa's end.

Yeah, I like that one or Heatley/Lee/2nd rounder for Bouchard/Burns/first rounder (Josefson).

Or,

Heatley/Lee/1st rounder for Berglund/Pietrangelo/1st rounder?

Keep in mind MPS is probably not in the NHL next season. Not that that really matters.

At 5, though, I'm probably taking Schenn.

Burns! I want Burns!

SpezDispenser wrote:Burns! I want Burns!

Don't we all.

Man, I hope we're not disappointed when this is finally over. :^^^^:

It'll be a long summer of speculation if Heatley's not moved before the draft. The thing is it'll be of Sundin like proportions in terms of coverage. It will begin to get really annoying if it hasn't already started to.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:It'll be a long summer of speculation if Heatley's not moved before the draft. The thing is it'll be of Sundin like proportions in terms of coverage. It will begin to get really annoying if it hasn't already started to.

Yeah, I'm pretty sick of playing out all the different scenarios.

I think I'm going to try to leave this one be. Problem is, there's nothing else to talk about, and this is pretty huge as far as hockey stories go.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:It'll be a long summer of speculation if Heatley's not moved before the draft. The thing is it'll be of Sundin like proportions in terms of coverage. It will begin to get really annoying if it hasn't already started to.

Yeah no kidding, I think we're going to see a lot of movement after tonight. UFA deadline is like 2 weeks away as well .....

The senators front office is working double time right now no doubt .,...

HowieMorenz wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:It'll be a long summer of speculation if Heatley's not moved before the draft. The thing is it'll be of Sundin like proportions in terms of coverage. It will begin to get really annoying if it hasn't already started to.

Yeah no kidding, I think we're going to see a lot of movement after tonight. UFA deadline is like 2 weeks away as well .....

The senators front office is working double time right now no doubt .,...

Either that or they're intentionally keeping us in suspense.

asq2 wrote:
Yeah, I'm pretty sick of playing out all the different scenarios.

I think I'm going to try to leave this one be. Problem is, there's nothing else to talk about, and this is pretty huge as far as hockey stories go.

So I'll pipe up.

For those that are season ticket holders they are holding a special season ticket holder only Prospects camp with a chance to skate with one of 4 players. I believe I grabbed one of the last slots to skate with karlsson, but there are others O'Brien, Bass Regin, Smith. THere is a scrimmage and some interactive games for the little ones.

I'm not sure I'll be able to go, it's July 4th so if I can't, I'll send the tickets into SpezzDispenser or one of the boys and they can figure out some way to get them to the person(s) who want to go.

I wish this sort of thing was available to the public, but I'm guessing because ticket sales are down this year (I wonder why) they are pulling out all the stops to try to get people to renew now.

So with that said, rather than talk about what if's with Heatley, (I've heard just about everything under the sun), why don't we talk about the great talent that Ottawa has in their system that they are not getting credit for.