Who do you draft?

As it stands right now, looking at only the Fisher trade, anyone that thinks the rebuild will be quick, is seriously misguided IMO.

SpezDispenser and I agree that when the other trades roll in there will be faces to attach to the new players; but not currently.

Currently, 3-5 years is when the playoffs will be in reach.

CockRoche wrote:As it stands right now, looking at only the Fisher trade, anyone that thinks the rebuild will be quick, is seriously misguided IMO.

SpezDispenser and I agree that when the other trades roll in there will be faces to attach to the new players; but not currently.

Currently, 3-5 years is when the playoffs will be in reach.

Misguided?!?!

Like a FOX!!!

SeawaySensFan wrote:

CockRoche wrote:As it stands right now, looking at only the Fisher trade, anyone that thinks the rebuild will be quick, is seriously misguided IMO.

SpezDispenser and I agree that when the other trades roll in there will be faces to attach to the new players; but not currently.

Currently, 3-5 years is when the playoffs will be in reach.

Misguided?!?!

Like a FOX!!!

That is of the few jokes or sarcastic innuendos that I don't understand. It must stem from something before my arrival at GMHockey.

Meh.

CockRoche wrote:As it stands right now, looking at only the Fisher trade, anyone that thinks the rebuild will be quick, is seriously misguided IMO.

SpezDispenser and I agree that when the other trades roll in there will be faces to attach to the new players; but not currently.

Currently, 3-5 years is when the playoffs will be in reach.

There has to be some astute work done though. Whoever is GMing this team desperately needs to put an elite level goalie in net. There's the possibility of there being two rookie defenders on this squad next year in Rundblad and Cowen, coupled with a 2nd year player in Karlsson. If we can't unload Kuba, then that's another player with a penchant for huge mistakes - ditto Gonchar, although I think he'll be a heck of a lot better under a more experienced coach next year.

All that to say that there will be some horrific breakdowns around the net for the Sens next year. As we all agree on here, Lehner's simply not at the right place in his development to be a starting goalie in the NHL - and he needs starts, so the AHL is where he needs to be. Re-signing Elliott is I'm sure something that'll get done, but unfortunately, he hasn't shown any signs of being a consistent starting goalie in this league. Which breaks down to: we have some $$ to spend, but we don't want to spend it on just anyone. Spending 6+ million on an elite level goalie would further accelerate the rebuilding in that the kids can make mistakes and know that not every single time they make one, it results in a goal.

Further, after the draft, the Sens will know where they're at in terms of forwards. If they draft Landeskog or Couturier, it sounds like they can make the jump to the NHL, while I've heard many conflicting reports about RNH being able to make it right away. So they Sens will absolutely need a winger for Spezza if that ends up being the case. Sure, it could be Michalek + Butler, but that still leaves a hole on line 2 - and a free agent signing or trade would make a work of difference.

I see them following the Carolina Hurricanes trend, where they're okay next year until the latter half of the year, then they plummet and land another top 10 pick. The year after, I would expect us to be pretty much exactly where the Canes are right now, in 9th, but with a shot at getting 8th. Then the year after, I see us getting into the playoffs late in the year and losing, but gaining confidence. Then after that, we'll start to look like a pretty well-balanced team.

SDH89 wrote:

wprager wrote:

sandysensfan wrote:

wprager wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:Landeskog for me. He's the most NHL ready and has all the atributes in terms of two way play and being a real character guy that can play in all situations.

Sure, as many have said, his ceiling, in terms of potential isn't as high as RNH but I'll take a bird in hand over two in the bush.

Here's an off-the-board pick, though. Let's say we get the 1st overall. Trade that to Edmonton for a top prospect and their 1st (as already suggested in another thread), then trade Edmonton's pick to whoever is picking 9-10 for another prospect, and take Seth Ambroz -- 6'3", 208 lbs power forward playing in the USHL (Omaha).

6'3" and 208 lbs in highschool, loves to hit and has some skill. A power-forward who shoots right. He will take a few years to develop, so at leas one of the two prospects has to be NHL-ready. Fill the rest of the roster (forwards) with free agents.

Do you think Ambroz could fall to where the Sens draft with the Nashville pick? Don't know much about any other players in the draft other than the top 5. But also if the Sens by some miracle could pick up another 1st round pick with maybe dealing Gonchar... then that would be 3 picks in the 1st round which would be huge irregardless as to where they draft. Then the 2nd round pick will be the 32 pick overall. This could be the most important draft in Sens history as to adding 4 top picks to the stable of prospects they already have. Where is Ambroz ranked by the 'experts'.

Ambroz was ranked 9th, so I don't think Nashville's pick gets him. However Nashville's plus our 2nd or something like that -- who knows.

I've actually read several rankings lists/mock drafts that don't include Ambroz at all in the 1st round - I guess you never know.

To be fair, is there a *single* source of draft ranking info? I doubt it. And beyond the top-five there's probably almost no consensus anyway.

SpezDispenser wrote:

CockRoche wrote:As it stands right now, looking at only the Fisher trade, anyone that thinks the rebuild will be quick, is seriously misguided IMO.

SpezDispenser and I agree that when the other trades roll in there will be faces to attach to the new players; but not currently.

Currently, 3-5 years is when the playoffs will be in reach.

There has to be some astute work done though. Whoever is GMing this team desperately needs to put an elite level goalie in net. There's the possibility of there being two rookie defenders on this squad next year in Rundblad and Cowen, coupled with a 2nd year player in Karlsson. If we can't unload Kuba, then that's another player with a penchant for huge mistakes - ditto Gonchar, although I think he'll be a heck of a lot better under a more experienced coach next year.

All that to say that there will be some horrific breakdowns around the net for the Sens next year. As we all agree on here, Lehner's simply not at the right place in his development to be a starting goalie in the NHL - and he needs starts, so the AHL is where he needs to be. Re-signing Elliott is I'm sure something that'll get done, but unfortunately, he hasn't shown any signs of being a consistent starting goalie in this league. Which breaks down to: we have some $$ to spend, but we don't want to spend it on just anyone. Spending 6+ million on an elite level goalie would further accelerate the rebuilding in that the kids can make mistakes and know that not every single time they make one, it results in a goal.

Further, after the draft, the Sens will know where they're at in terms of forwards. If they draft Landeskog or Couturier, it sounds like they can make the jump to the NHL, while I've heard many conflicting reports about RNH being able to make it right away. So they Sens will absolutely need a winger for Spezza if that ends up being the case. Sure, it could be Michalek + Butler, but that still leaves a hole on line 2 - and a free agent signing or trade would make a work of difference.

I see them following the Carolina Hurricanes trend, where they're okay next year until the latter half of the year, then they plummet and land another top 10 pick. The year after, I would expect us to be pretty much exactly where the Canes are right now, in 9th, but with a shot at getting 8th. Then the year after, I see us getting into the playoffs late in the year and losing, but gaining confidence. Then after that, we'll start to look like a pretty well-balanced team.

Very well thought out and constructed.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I'd still like to see us package the Nashville first in order to move up the draft. That's not totally unheard of either right?

Not at all, trading up happens enough to be considered a viable option. The most talked about trade when it comes to this, happened in 2002; when Columbus traded up and Florida moved down.

The Jackets poised to pick 3rd, surprised everyone by convincing the Florida Panthers, winners of the lottery, to swap draft picks with them, allowing Columbus to take Rick Nash first overall. The trade with Columbus was contingent on the Panthers receiving a guarantee from the Thrashers, who had the 2nd overall selection, that they would not take the projected and highly-touted 1st overall defenceman Jay Bouwmeester with their second pick. The Thrashers agreed and chose Kari Lehtonen. Florida received in compensation, for moving down 2 spots in the draft, the option to flip 1st round picks with Columbus the following year, 2003.

Later in the round, Florida made another deal and traded up this time. The Panthers gave Calgary the 10th pick overall, along with their fourth-round pick, to move up into Calgary's spot ninth overall choosing Petr Taticek.

It happens.

CockRoche wrote:
Not at all, trading up happens enough to be considered a viable option. The most talked about trade when it comes to this, happened in 2002; when Columbus traded up and Florida moved down.

The Jackets poised to pick 3rd, surprised everyone by convincing the Florida Panthers, winners of the lottery, to swap draft picks with them, allowing Columbus to take Rick Nash first overall. The trade with Columbus was contingent on the Panthers receiving a guarantee from the Thrashers, who had the 2nd overall selection, that they would not take the projected and highly-touted 1st overall defenceman Jay Bouwmeester with their second pick. The Thrashers agreed and chose Kari Lehtonen. Florida received in compensation, for moving down 2 spots in the draft, the option to flip 1st round picks with Columbus the following year, 2003.

Later in the round, Florida made another deal and traded up this time. The Panthers gave Calgary the 10th pick overall, along with their fourth-round pick, to move up into Calgary's spot ninth overall choosing Petr Taticek.

It happens.

Very interesting, I didn't follow it as closely back then, so I didn't notice that.

Another huge move was Ottawa flipping Nashville a 3rd (I think), to move ahead of Anaheim and grab Karlsson.

wprager wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:Landeskog for me. He's the most NHL ready and has all the atributes in terms of two way play and being a real character guy that can play in all situations.

Sure, as many have said, his ceiling, in terms of potential isn't as high as RNH but I'll take a bird in hand over two in the bush.

Here's an off-the-board pick, though. Let's say we get the 1st overall. Trade that to Edmonton for a top prospect and their 1st (as already suggested in another thread), then trade Edmonton's pick to whoever is picking 9-10 for another prospect, and take Seth Ambroz -- 6'3", 208 lbs power forward playing in the USHL (Omaha).

6'3" and 208 lbs in highschool, loves to hit and has some skill. A power-forward who shoots right. He will take a few years to develop, so at leas one of the two prospects has to be NHL-ready. Fill the rest of the roster (forwards) with free agents.

That's literally impossible. No one trades a top 3 pick to draft a risky player projected in the 2nd half of the 1st round.
If that doesn't work out you basically set a franchise back for several years. That's Kessel trade even more awful territory.
Also, Edmonton is not trading a nice prospect to get 1st overall if they are 2nd, especially in a year where the top 4 have basically the same value.

rooneypoo wrote:I can honestly see size being a factor, not so much in the minds of our scouts, etc., but in the eyes of someone like Melnyk. If the goal is to pick someone who can step into the lineup immediately (to help get fans excited about this team again & to help sell more tickets), then Couturier & Landeskog make more sense than Nugent-Hopkins.

I'm not saying I agree with that thought-process. What I'm saying is that Melnyk is a guy who wants to win and to sell tickets, and who seems to put his oar in on a rather frequent basis. I'm not sure if he, or the city, has the patience to go through a long rebuild.

You may be totally right, but I will disagree.
One thing I've learned about Melnyk the last few years is that he will always favour winning over tickets sales.
Everytime this team has sucked, he has always been on the radio saying that the fans are great, always supportive etc.
He spends to the cap every single year, even if the ticket sales have been declining the last couple of years.
He wants the cup, he is a fan first, businessman 2nd. THat's what stands out to me everytime he is addressing the media. Great owner IMO.
One thing that is helping him next year even if the team sucks: THe new scoreboard will be in place, and he has the All Star game.

CockRoche wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I'd still like to see us package the Nashville first in order to move up the draft. That's not totally unheard of either right?

Not at all, trading up happens enough to be considered a viable option. The most talked about trade when it comes to this, happened in 2002; when Columbus traded up and Florida moved down.

The Jackets poised to pick 3rd, surprised everyone by convincing the Florida Panthers, winners of the lottery, to swap draft picks with them, allowing Columbus to take Rick Nash first overall. The trade with Columbus was contingent on the Panthers receiving a guarantee from the Thrashers, who had the 2nd overall selection, that they would not take the projected and highly-touted 1st overall defenceman Jay Bouwmeester with their second pick. The Thrashers agreed and chose Kari Lehtonen. Florida received in compensation, for moving down 2 spots in the draft, the option to flip 1st round picks with Columbus the following year, 2003.

Later in the round, Florida made another deal and traded up this time. The Panthers gave Calgary the 10th pick overall, along with their fourth-round pick, to move up into Calgary's spot ninth overall choosing Petr Taticek.

It happens.

An interesting part about the Bouwmeester/Nash swap is that those players would have probably gone to the same teams regardless and that the Florida GM regretted making the move later on because it had apparently shaken the confidence of Bouwmeester (who was supposed to be the surefire 1st overall) and the the return wasn't worth it on their end.

Completely off-topic, but I thought it was interesting when I heard it.

marakh wrote:

wprager wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:Landeskog for me. He's the most NHL ready and has all the atributes in terms of two way play and being a real character guy that can play in all situations.

Sure, as many have said, his ceiling, in terms of potential isn't as high as RNH but I'll take a bird in hand over two in the bush.

Here's an off-the-board pick, though. Let's say we get the 1st overall. Trade that to Edmonton for a top prospect and their 1st (as already suggested in another thread), then trade Edmonton's pick to whoever is picking 9-10 for another prospect, and take Seth Ambroz -- 6'3", 208 lbs power forward playing in the USHL (Omaha).

6'3" and 208 lbs in highschool, loves to hit and has some skill. A power-forward who shoots right. He will take a few years to develop, so at leas one of the two prospects has to be NHL-ready. Fill the rest of the roster (forwards) with free agents.

That's literally impossible. No one trades a top 3 pick to draft a risky player projected in the 2nd half of the 1st round.
If that doesn't work out you basically set a franchise back for several years. That's Kessel trade even more awful territory.
Also, Edmonton is not trading a nice prospect to get 1st overall if they are 2nd, especially in a year where the top 4 have basically the same value.

I should bookmark this and check back in a few years

Please do

Done Now I'll add a Calendar reminder (one for Draft Day, another one for a year from now, recurring for 4 years) Am I going overboard on this?

wprager wrote:Done Now I'll add a Calendar reminder (one for Draft Day, another one for a year from now, recurring for 4 years) Am I going overboard on this?

spader wrote:

wprager wrote:Done Now I'll add a Calendar reminder (one for Draft Day, another one for a year from now, recurring for 4 years) Am I going overboard on this?

Being in high-tech, I'm just not sure where my Calendar will be next year, let alone 4 years.

CockRoche wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

CockRoche wrote:As it stands right now, looking at only the Fisher trade, anyone that thinks the rebuild will be quick, is seriously misguided IMO.

SpezDispenser and I agree that when the other trades roll in there will be faces to attach to the new players; but not currently.

Currently, 3-5 years is when the playoffs will be in reach.

Misguided?!?!

Like a FOX!!!

That is of the few jokes or sarcastic innuendos that I don't understand. It must stem from something before my arrival at GMHockey.

Meh.

No one knows what SSF is saying at any given time.

shabbs wrote:

CockRoche wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

CockRoche wrote:As it stands right now, looking at only the Fisher trade, anyone that thinks the rebuild will be quick, is seriously misguided IMO.

SpezDispenser and I agree that when the other trades roll in there will be faces to attach to the new players; but not currently.

Currently, 3-5 years is when the playoffs will be in reach.

Misguided?!?!

Like a FOX!!!

That is of the few jokes or sarcastic innuendos that I don't understand. It must stem from something before my arrival at GMHockey.

Meh.

No one knows what SSF is saying at any given time.

Clearly a Simpsons reference:

Homer: That tree's been in Springfield since the time of our forefathers. Give it back or we'll bust in there and take it!
Shelby's Dad: Bust in here and take it? You must be stupider than you look.
Homer: Stupider like a fox!