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Senators: Neil and Fisher doubtful for Thursday

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dennycrane
jamvan
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rooneypoo
mattshock
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COLLAR UP
PTFlea
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shabbs
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rooneypoo


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Neely4Life wrote:
The fact you think Thornton and Spezza are the same player is laughable.

The only reason Boston could make those moves is because Thornton was gone. If you think BOyes is all that great, he isnt, McDonald was the guy that turned him into the 40 goal guy, nothing else. Boyes wouldnt come close to doing that alone.

Boston built their team from the blueline out, the way it should be done and they way teams win. You basically said because they did the smart thing for their organization and made good choices, they were lucky... If only you guys knew what kind of person and team mate Spezza really was, and what the opinons of the players in the NHL were about him. Ive told ya, but you guys wouldnt believe me, just like I said a lot of things last year that actually happend.... Ive proved I know what Im talkng about and people I talk to. Say what you want, you can think Spezza is the greatest player in the world, the Sens will NEVER win with him here.

This is totally re-visionist history.

Boston got the room to sign Savard (in 2006) and Chara (also in July 2006) because the cap ballooned that year from $39 mil to about $45 mil. Thornton was only making $6.5 mil at the time, and only had a 1 1/2 left on his deal. The Savard signing was to replace Thornton. The Chara signing was done with the money opened up by the increase in the cap, not the money Thornton's leaving freed up -- especially when you consider that the Bruins took back something like $5 mil in salary (Sturm = $2 mil, Stuart = $2 mil, and Primeau = $1) in that deal, which means they really only freed up about $1.5 mil in cap space, and had to turn around and sign Savard to replace him.

In short, Boston didn't need to dump Thornton to make room for Chara. Plain and simple. The math doesn't lie.

In any event, history shows us that a) Thornton always was and is a great player, and any team with him on it is a better team for it, b) the only way to replace that kind of talent (as with the Savard signing) is to spend big on July 1, and c) that the Sens have never, ever spent big on July 1, so the scenario doesn't really apply to us.

People said, btw, the same stuff about Yzerman when he was young -- that he lacked heart, that he'd never win, etc., etc. The point is NOT that Spezza is just like Yzerman was AT HIS PRIME, but rather that there are startling similarities between the situations of Spezza NOW and young Yzerman THEN. Don't try and twist that into a "Spezza's not Yzerman" argument, because that's not what I'm saying.

Finally, I simply can't take at face value your comment that "if only us guys knew what Spezza is really like...," because that statement suggests that YOU do while the rest of us don't. Sorry, but I trust his coach's and his GM's and his teamates' opinion on him over that of any fan claiming to have insider knowledge. You're not talking to Spezza on a daily basis or subjecting him to monthly psychological reviews or sitting on the bench with him game in and game out, so don't pretend that you about these things any better than the rest of us do.

shabbs


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I'm having HBuzz flashbacks...

smash88


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shabbs wrote:I'm having HBuzz flashbacks...

LOL... Smile

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I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.

rooneypoo

rooneypoo
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Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.

What? You said the Thornton trade freed up money for BOS to sign Savard and Chara. I demonstrated how that's a pile of BS by pointing to the numbers. It doesn't get any more objective than the straight numbers.

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rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.

What? You said the Thornton trade freed up money for BOS to sign Savard and Chara. I demonstrated how that's a pile of BS by pointing to the numbers. It doesn't get any more objective than the straight numbers.

Where did I say "free up money" I said Boston could make those moves because Thornton was gone.

rooneypoo

rooneypoo
All-Star
All-Star

Neely4Life wrote:
rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.

What? You said the Thornton trade freed up money for BOS to sign Savard and Chara. I demonstrated how that's a pile of BS by pointing to the numbers. It doesn't get any more objective than the straight numbers.

Where did I say "free up money" I said Boston could make those moves because Thornton was gone.

Please explain to us all what you mean by that. You've already told me privately, of course, but I don't want to spoil your fun.

Guest


Guest

rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.

What? You said the Thornton trade freed up money for BOS to sign Savard and Chara. I demonstrated how that's a pile of BS by pointing to the numbers. It doesn't get any more objective than the straight numbers.

Where did I say "free up money" I said Boston could make those moves because Thornton was gone.

Please explain to us all what you mean by that. You've already told me privately, of course, but I don't want to spoil your fun.

Chara wasnt going to sign there if Thornton was there. Plain and simple.

rooneypoo

rooneypoo
All-Star
All-Star

Neely4Life wrote:
rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.

What? You said the Thornton trade freed up money for BOS to sign Savard and Chara. I demonstrated how that's a pile of BS by pointing to the numbers. It doesn't get any more objective than the straight numbers.

Where did I say "free up money" I said Boston could make those moves because Thornton was gone.

Please explain to us all what you mean by that. You've already told me privately, of course, but I don't want to spoil your fun.

Chara wasnt going to sign there if Thornton was there. Plain and simple.

And you know this because? Come on, tell one, tell all!

shabbs

shabbs
Hall of Famer
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Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.
Gang mentality? I'm seeing a good debate between you and rooneypoo... no ganging up here.

Guest


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haha, ive already discussed this with people in the chat room, Ive said I know the guy.

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shabbs wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.
Gang mentality? I'm seeing a good debate between you and rooneypoo... no ganging up here.

Nah, Heater, Tukker, buddy here, they all share the same brain and stat sheet.

Guest


Guest

rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.

What? You said the Thornton trade freed up money for BOS to sign Savard and Chara. I demonstrated how that's a pile of BS by pointing to the numbers. It doesn't get any more objective than the straight numbers.

Where did I say "free up money" I said Boston could make those moves because Thornton was gone.

Please explain to us all what you mean by that. You've already told me privately, of course, but I don't want to spoil your fun.

Chara wasnt going to sign there if Thornton was there. Plain and simple.

And you know this because? Come on, tell one, tell all!

Who did you say you were good friends with by the way? come on, tell on, tell all!

rooneypoo

rooneypoo
All-Star
All-Star

Neely4Life wrote:haha, ive already discussed this with people in the chat room, Ive said I know the guy.

Just so we're all clear on what's being said here: that you know that Chara wouldn't have signed in BOS if Thornton was there, because you know Chara personally, and because Chara personally told you that he has a very low opinion of Thornton and thinks he's not a winner. And that he thinks lowly of Spezza, too, and that's why he didn't re-sign with OTT.

Let's think that one through for a minute. Do we have reason to doubt you know Chara personally? I'd say yes. If not, please phone him up and tell him to get in a few fights, because I and 10,000 other poolies drafted him high in my Yahoo! league to score AND get PIMs, and he's not putting the numbers in yet. He's got 2 goals so far tonight, which is great, but still no fights... man.

Second, did Chara sign in BOS in July 2006 because he wanted to play for a winner? Hmm. Let's look that one over. BOS finished with 74 that points in 2006, last place in the Northeast division, 14th in the conference, and of course didn't make the playoffs. So, out of all the teams that he could choose, Chara chose this one because -- he wanted to win. Seriously. BOS offered him the most money and he took it and ran. Plain as f'ing day.

Third, did Chara turn down Ottawa because he hates Spezza? Absolutely not. Why do I say that. Well, for one, because I know Chara didn't sign with OTT because OTT never offered him a contract -- that fact has been widely reported, as was Chara's disappointment at not even getting an offer from OTT. The fact is that he would have signed with the team that had Yashin on it as long as they offered him the same amount of money as BOS did -- see point 2. Ask him about that one while you're ripping him for us poolies -- we want fighting majors! And misconducts! Text him ASAP.

rooneypoo

rooneypoo
All-Star
All-Star

Neely4Life wrote:
shabbs wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.
Gang mentality? I'm seeing a good debate between you and rooneypoo... no ganging up here.

Nah, Heater, Tukker, buddy here, they all share the same brain and stat sheet.

I've got a mind of my own, thanks very much.

Sometimes, there's more too it than 'gang mentality' when you find yourself facing a chorus of opposition on your perennial favourite topic -- how much Spezza sucks and how he should go. Sometimes it's that more than one person thinks you're off base. It's not that complicated.

rooneypoo

rooneypoo
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Neely4Life wrote:

Who did you say you were good friends with by the way? come on, tell on, tell all!

Alfie. I followed it up with, "LOL. This is kinda fun." Surely I don't need to tell you to read between the lines.

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rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:haha, ive already discussed this with people in the chat room, Ive said I know the guy.

Just so we're all clear on what's being said here: that you know that Chara wouldn't have signed in BOS if Thornton was there, because you know Chara personally, and because Chara personally told you that he has a very low opinion of Thornton and thinks he's not a winner. And that he thinks lowly of Spezza, too, and that's why he didn't re-sign with OTT.

Let's think that one through for a minute. Do we have reason to doubt you know Chara personally? I'd say yes. If not, please phone him up and tell him to get in a few fights, because I and 10,000 other poolies drafted him high in my Yahoo! league to score AND get PIMs, and he's not putting the numbers in yet. He's got 2 goals so far tonight, which is great, but still no fights... man.

Second, did Chara sign in BOS in July 2006 because he wanted to play for a winner? Hmm. Let's look that one over. BOS finished with 74 that points in 2006, last place in the Northeast division, 14th in the conference, and of course didn't make the playoffs. So, out of all the teams that he could choose, Chara chose this one because -- he wanted to win. Seriously. BOS offered him the most money and he took it and ran. Plain as f'ing day.

Third, did Chara turn down Ottawa because he hates Spezza? Absolutely not. Why do I say that. Well, for one, because I know Chara didn't sign with OTT because OTT never offered him a contract -- that fact has been widely reported, as was Chara's disappointment at not even getting an offer from OTT. The fact is that he would have signed with the team that had Yashin on it as long as they offered him the same amount of money as BOS did -- see point 2. Ask him about that one while you're ripping him for us poolies -- we want fighting majors! And misconducts! Text him ASAP.

LOL, so whats the point of all that? To make me look stupid? Did I say I have his digits in my phone? Did I say we r best buddies? If I wanted to contact him, could I, for sure I could.

Chara signed in Boston cuz they made a committment to him, simple as that. Did Muckler offer him a contract, nope, sure didnt, stung him too, but he could have talked to them before he left as well and he chose to just leave.

You say FACT like you can prove it, so prove it. Prove your FACTS.

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rooneypoo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
shabbs wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:I just dont get how there is absolutly no objectivity here. Real gang mentallity too.
Gang mentality? I'm seeing a good debate between you and rooneypoo... no ganging up here.

Nah, Heater, Tukker, buddy here, they all share the same brain and stat sheet.

I've got a mind of my own, thanks very much.

Sometimes, there's more too it than 'gang mentality' when you find yourself facing a chorus of opposition on your perennial favourite topic -- how much Spezza sucks and how he should go. Sometimes it's that more than one person thinks you're off base. It's not that complicated.

Hmmmm, funny, I didnt think I said Spezza sucks once. Can you go find that quote for me... Thanks.

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