Gonchar to Ottawa

SpezDispenser wrote:

PKC wrote:If you listen to the audio or watch the video, you'll hear Murray say that Jared Cowen has pretty much played himself onto the team.

What a wonderful replacement for Campoli.

i'd trade Kuba before i trade campoli. honestly we fared very well without kuba and campoli is half the ticket . campoli was doing pretty good at the end of last season.
we'll probably keep both i imagine.

I just watched the Gonchar presser. It was interesting to see Murray, at the end, basically give the media Dung for crapping on Kovalev AGAIN and already going after Gonchar's age and injury history.

One thing I know from the playoff encounters Ottawa has had with Gonchar, the strategy is supposed to be to go after him because "he might be injured" or whatever and it NEVER worked.

Advantage : Ottawa.

DirtyDave wrote:he has a massive head

For better to think you with.

Flo The Action wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

PKC wrote:If you listen to the audio or watch the video, you'll hear Murray say that Jared Cowen has pretty much played himself onto the team.

What a wonderful replacement for Campoli.

i'd trade Kuba before i trade campoli. honestly we fared very well without kuba and campoli is half the ticket . campoli was doing pretty good at the end of last season.
we'll probably keep both i imagine.

Totally agree with all of that. If they're going to move anyone move Kuba. Of course it's easier said than done. Campoli is probably the easier player to move because as you said he was "half the ticket".

Flo The Action wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

PKC wrote:If you listen to the audio or watch the video, you'll hear Murray say that Jared Cowen has pretty much played himself onto the team.

What a wonderful replacement for Campoli.

i'd trade Kuba before i trade campoli. honestly we fared very well without kuba and campoli is half the ticket . campoli was doing pretty good at the end of last season.
we'll probably keep both i imagine.

I would be surprised if Murray did anything concerning Campoli/kuba until the Campoli arbitration arrives to its conclusion ...

Cap'n Clutch wrote:

Flo The Action wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

PKC wrote:If you listen to the audio or watch the video, you'll hear Murray say that Jared Cowen has pretty much played himself onto the team.

What a wonderful replacement for Campoli.

i'd trade Kuba before i trade campoli. honestly we fared very well without kuba and campoli is half the ticket . campoli was doing pretty good at the end of last season.
we'll probably keep both i imagine.

Totally agree with all of that. If they're going to move anyone move Kuba. Of course it's easier said than done. Campoli is probably the easier player to move because as you said he was "half the ticket".

I don't think that Kuba is that hard to move.

TheAvatar wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:

Flo The Action wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

PKC wrote:If you listen to the audio or watch the video, you'll hear Murray say that Jared Cowen has pretty much played himself onto the team.

What a wonderful replacement for Campoli.

i'd trade Kuba before i trade campoli. honestly we fared very well without kuba and campoli is half the ticket . campoli was doing pretty good at the end of last season.
we'll probably keep both i imagine.

Totally agree with all of that. If they're going to move anyone move Kuba. Of course it's easier said than done. Campoli is probably the easier player to move because as you said he was "half the ticket".

I don't think that Kuba is that hard to move.

Maybe, maybe not but I still think Campoli would be easier to move. That's really all I was trying to say.

I wonder if Boston would have any interest in Kuba. I mean, if they want to move Savard why not take on Kuba's salary and address their defensive woes? Kuba and a mid-tier prospect for Savard doesn't seem all that bad for both sides

Kovalfie wrote:I wonder if Boston would have any interest in Kuba. I mean, if they want to move Savard why not take on Kuba's salary and address their defensive woes? Kuba and a mid-tier prospect for Savard doesn't seem all that bad for both sides

OTT needs Kuba, or a guy like him, right now, I'd say. After Gonchar and Phillips, we don't really have anyone who can clearly play 20+ minutes a night in all situations. Have we ever played Karlsson on the PK, for instance? Cowen might be a guy who can do it soon, but I don't think he's ready for it in his rookie season. Would love to be wrong on that one, tho'!

Kuba has value to us right now, and I'm not sure we should trade him. If we did, we need to turn around and sign a guy like Sutton ASAP. And I would be OK with that, honestly.

Anyway, I don't think that deal interests BOS. They traded away Wideman for Horton, presumably because they felt comfortable with the D they had. Re-signing Seidenberg made that move possible.

I'm not so sure we need Kuba. I think the need we have is for a Sutton type of player which is why I would think they should try to move Kuba to obtain that kind of player.

rooneypoo wrote:

Kovalfie wrote:I wonder if Boston would have any interest in Kuba. I mean, if they want to move Savard why not take on Kuba's salary and address their defensive woes? Kuba and a mid-tier prospect for Savard doesn't seem all that bad for both sides

OTT needs Kuba, or a guy like him, right now, I'd say. After Gonchar and Phillips, we don't really have anyone who can clearly play 20+ minutes a night in all situations. Have we ever played Karlsson on the PK, for instance? Cowen might be a guy who can do it soon, but I don't think he's ready for it in his rookie season. Would love to be wrong on that one, tho'!

Kuba has value to us right now, and I'm not sure we should trade him. If we did, we need to turn around and sign a guy like Sutton ASAP. And I would be OK with that, honestly.

Anyway, I don't think that deal interests BOS. They traded away Wideman for Horton, presumably because they felt comfortable with the D they had. Re-signing Seidenberg made that move possible.

I'm afraid of what moving Kuba means for Karlsson and whether Erik is ready for those kinds of minutes and that kind of pressure at this stage.

Holy cow it's hard to process what to do with Kuba. He can play 20+ minutes, he can move the puck, he can play PK, PP and ES, but he's not physical at all - and it leaves our top 4 a little soft.

Sutton would cost maybe 1 million less - if lucky - but would provide a steadier physical presence. However, he can't move the puck as well as Kuba, he can't QB the 2nd PP unit and he won't account for as much offense.

Tough call, but I think this is Kuba's final year here - and after last year's write off, I think he'll be a lot better - *providing* his back is back to normal.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I'm not so sure we need Kuba. I think the need we have is for a Sutton type of player which is why I would think they should try to move Kuba to obtain that kind of player.

If you can move Kuba to add a player like Savard, and then replace Kuba with a Sutton-esque guy for about $1 mil less, then sure, do it. I just don't see BOS biting on Kuba, when everything suggests that BOS would not want much in terms of cap dollars coming back.

Savard is a big piece and won't come for cheap. Kuba is what he is -- decent, serviceable, but older and with an upside of about 35 points or so. He fills a common need, but that's it. BOS will not trade Savard for that, as other teams (including TOR) could and would offer more than that.

If OTT is serious about getting Savard, I think it would be more like Foligno+. Say, Foligno + one of our D prospects, or Foligno + our 1st next year + a lesser prospect. Something like that.

Given OTT's and BOS's cap situation and needs, I'm not sure I see a deal that works for both sides here. We don't have the room to take on $4 mil more in salary, especially once the dust settles with our RFAs, and BOS isn't about to give away the centrepiece of their offensive attack for just decent parts.

SpezDispenser wrote:Holy cow it's hard to process what to do with Kuba. He can play 20+ minutes, he can move the puck, he can play PK, PP and ES, but he's not physical at all - and it leaves our top 4 a little soft.

Sutton would cost maybe 1 million less - if lucky - but would provide a steadier physical presence. However, he can't move the puck as well as Kuba, he can't QB the 2nd PP unit and he won't account for as much offense.

Tough call, but I think this is Kuba's final year here - and after last year's write off, I think he'll be a lot better - *providing* his back is back to normal.

Barring anything unforeseen (another signing, a big trade), I think our top-4 D is set for next year:

Gonchar - Phillips
Kuba - Karlsson

And the bottom 2 is probably Campoli and Carkner, with Lee and Cowen as extras, but clearly something will have to give here if Cowen makes the team.

Anyway, we just don't have anyone else who can clearly bring what Kuba brings -- a guy who can play 20+ minutes a night in all situations. I don't think we can afford to lose him, really, at least not without getting another guy like him. Assuming that Campoli (or Cowen) can do Kuba's job is too much, too soon in my books.

Kuba stabilizes our top 4.

rooneypoo wrote:
Barring anything unforeseen (another signing, a big trade), I think our top-4 D is set for next year:

Gonchar - Phillips
Kuba - Karlsson

And the bottom 2 is probably Campoli and Carkner, with Lee and Cowen as extras, but clearly something will have to give here if Cowen makes the team.

Anyway, we just don't have anyone else who can clearly bring what Kuba brings -- a guy who can play 20+ minutes a night in all situations. I don't think we can afford to lose him, really, at least not without getting another guy like him. Assuming that Campoli (or Cowen) can do Kuba's job is too much, too soon in my books.

Kuba stabilizes our top 4.

For sure he does, yeah. It's a case here of if it ain't broke, don't fix. Sutton is a guy you have to go out and sign - and then you have to make sure you have a new home for Kuba. It's really getting to the point where it's not worth it IMO.

When there are injuries, people are gonna get chances. We can see Cowen in a top 4 spot for a while, then Campoli, Gryba if we're getting pushed around etc. I think we're set up decently in depth for this upcoming season. Lee is serviceable as well, you can put him in there for spot duty and not be completely up the creek.

rooneypoo wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I'm not so sure we need Kuba. I think the need we have is for a Sutton type of player which is why I would think they should try to move Kuba to obtain that kind of player.

If you can move Kuba to add a player like Savard, and then replace Kuba with a Sutton-esque guy for about $1 mil less, then sure, do it. I just don't see BOS biting on Kuba, when everything suggests that BOS would not want much in terms of cap dollars coming back.

Savard is a big piece and won't come for cheap. Kuba is what he is -- decent, serviceable, but older and with an upside of about 35 points or so. He fills a common need, but that's it. BOS will not trade Savard for that, as other teams (including TOR) could and would offer more than that.

If OTT is serious about getting Savard, I think it would be more like Foligno+. Say, Foligno + one of our D prospects, or Foligno + our 1st next year + a lesser prospect. Something like that.

Given OTT's and BOS's cap situation and needs, I'm not sure I see a deal that works for both sides here. We don't have the room to take on $4 mil more in salary, especially once the dust settles with our RFAs, and BOS isn't about to give away the centrepiece of their offensive attack for just decent parts.

I didn't mean to give the impression I was advocating for the Boston proposal mentioned. All I was trying to say was we need a Sutton type D man more than we need Kuba right now.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:

rooneypoo wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I'm not so sure we need Kuba. I think the need we have is for a Sutton type of player which is why I would think they should try to move Kuba to obtain that kind of player.

If you can move Kuba to add a player like Savard, and then replace Kuba with a Sutton-esque guy for about $1 mil less, then sure, do it. I just don't see BOS biting on Kuba, when everything suggests that BOS would not want much in terms of cap dollars coming back.

Savard is a big piece and won't come for cheap. Kuba is what he is -- decent, serviceable, but older and with an upside of about 35 points or so. He fills a common need, but that's it. BOS will not trade Savard for that, as other teams (including TOR) could and would offer more than that.

If OTT is serious about getting Savard, I think it would be more like Foligno+. Say, Foligno + one of our D prospects, or Foligno + our 1st next year + a lesser prospect. Something like that.

Given OTT's and BOS's cap situation and needs, I'm not sure I see a deal that works for both sides here. We don't have the room to take on $4 mil more in salary, especially once the dust settles with our RFAs, and BOS isn't about to give away the centrepiece of their offensive attack for just decent parts.

I didn't mean to give the impression I was advocating for the Boston proposal mentioned. All I was trying to say was we need a Sutton type D man more than we need Kuba right now.

Edit: I believe that a Sutton type D can fill in for the ES minutes, 2nd unit PK minutes. Campoli can fill in for the 2nd unit PP minutes.

I think the sens will seriously look within the organization for physicality, and that would mean one of Cowen or Gryba. If we plucked out another d-man for physicality purposes, I really don't see us getting anyone under the age of 32. In free agency, its either Sutton or Willie Mitchell.

Very few teams would trade a young physical d-man, especially for Kuba. Right now, Kuba, Phillips, Gonchar are all > 30 yrs. 3 of these guys make up our top 4 right now. If we're to get someone physical, it might as well be Gryba or Cowen, and trade Kuba for pics/forwards. Just don't want any more pluggers, our management might as well start honing the skills of one of our young d-men.