GAME DAY: Columbus Blue Jackets @ Ottawa Senators :: 1:00pm ET :: Sun. Nov. 17th, 2013

How about that Johansen breakaway where Cowen just moved out of the way?  
Not sure how leadership can solve that

And Coling Greening... jeez did the guy have a single scoring opportunity this season?

LeKing wrote:How about that Johansen breakaway where Cowen just moved out of the way?  
Not sure how leadership can solve that

And Coling Greening... jeez did the guy have a single scoring opportunity this season?

Potvin mentioned that Cowen has a tendency to back in rather than go after attacking forwards.

LeKing wrote:How about that Johansen breakaway where Cowen just moved out of the way?  
Not sure how leadership can solve that

And Coling Greening... jeez did the guy have a single scoring opportunity this season?

There just needs to simply be a shift in the guys running that room. So many great pieces in Ottawa, Ryan, Turris, Lehner, obviously Karlsson, Methot, Borowiecki, these guys all bring something different and special to the table. Until they start to really focus around those guys this team will be in for a long road.

SeawaySensFan wrote:

LeKing wrote:How about that Johansen breakaway where Cowen just moved out of the way?  
Not sure how leadership can solve that

And Coling Greening... jeez did the guy have a single scoring opportunity this season?

Potvin mentioned that Cowen has a tendency to back in rather than go after attacking forwards.

It's pretty clear Cowen is playing with zero confidence in his own zone right now and at this point there isn't a good RH D man to play with him full time. You have Gryba and Corvo switching in and out and when Wiercioch comes in he's playing with Phillips who struggles on if off side.

In all seriousness if you are talking about what type of player is needed in Ottawa from a pure on ice stand point, it's a RH D man who can play top 4 mins and right now they do not want to give that to Ceci. You can bring in Campbell, Kulikov, whoever but if there is a guy going spare like Petry in Edmonton that might be a guy you can try and snag.

Um Corvo isn't playing much at all, and frankly of the 4 Gryba, Wiercioch, Cowen and Corvo he's been the best. I don't know if that's a testament to him or not, but I can't believe that they've let Cowen continue to play during this mess. It's clear not being here for training camp was a big mistake we all knew it would be.

Now they want him to have his training camp while the team struggles, rather than send him down to Bingo. I can only guess it's because they don't want to piss him off and he'll stay when his contract is up.

Mac is making too making coaching mistakes with the roster.

The D was like this last year too to be honest. Perhaps not as bad with the Man of Suck Cowen back there, but pretty close with the giveaways and cluster****s in their own zone.

What saved them last year? A save % by Anderson that could never be sustained, then lights out performances by Lehner and Bishop. Lehner I could see fighting through this and performing, but with this filthy D it might be hard to stop the bleeding anytime soon.

Two big pieces are crap - one from last year - Cowen and Gryba. Wiercioch looks worse, Benoit is gone, Gonchar is gone, we don't play Corvo when we SHOULD...it's a cluster**** right now.

Cowen and Gryba together is at least entertaining in how many giveaways can they make. Sometimes they try to pass it to each other several times and give it away every time. Ridiculous.

Then you have Guy X and Guy Y with Spezza - which is a shame, because when all else fails Spezza can pass the puck with precision, but these guys can't do anything with it - looking at you Greening and Conacher.

Diddle you Melnyk, allow us to get a top 4 D and a top six forward bunghole.

SpezDispenser wrote:The D was like this last year too to be honest.  Perhaps not as bad with the Man of Suck Cowen back there, but pretty close with the giveaways and cluster****s in their own zone.

What saved them last year?  A save % by Anderson that could never be sustained, then lights out performances by Lehner and Bishop.  Lehner I could see fighting through this and performing, but with this filthy D it might be hard to stop the bleeding anytime soon.  

Two big pieces are crap - one from last year - Cowen and Gryba.  Wiercioch looks worse, Benoit is gone, Gonchar is gone, we don't play Corvo when we SHOULD...it's a cluster**** right now.

Cowen and Gryba together is at least entertaining in how many giveaways can they make.  Sometimes they try to pass it to each other several times and give it away every time.  Ridiculous.

Then you have Guy X and Guy Y with Spezza - which is a shame, because when all else fails Spezza can pass the puck with precision, but these guys can't do anything with it - looking at you Greening and Conacher.  

Diddle you Melnyk, allow us to get a top 4 D and a top six forward bunghole.

The D before Karlsson was injured was outstanding... the scoring chances were no where near what they are now. Also, even if the shots were up last year they at no time got hemmed into their own zone like they are now, it's unreal how bad they are right now.

NEELY wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:The D was like this last year too to be honest.  Perhaps not as bad with the Man of Suck Cowen back there, but pretty close with the giveaways and cluster****s in their own zone.

What saved them last year?  A save % by Anderson that could never be sustained, then lights out performances by Lehner and Bishop.  Lehner I could see fighting through this and performing, but with this filthy D it might be hard to stop the bleeding anytime soon.  

Two big pieces are crap - one from last year - Cowen and Gryba.  Wiercioch looks worse, Benoit is gone, Gonchar is gone, we don't play Corvo when we SHOULD...it's a cluster**** right now.

Cowen and Gryba together is at least entertaining in how many giveaways can they make.  Sometimes they try to pass it to each other several times and give it away every time.  Ridiculous.

Then you have Guy X and Guy Y with Spezza - which is a shame, because when all else fails Spezza can pass the puck with precision, but these guys can't do anything with it - looking at you Greening and Conacher.  

Diddle you Melnyk, allow us to get a top 4 D and a top six forward bunghole.

The D before Karlsson was injured was outstanding... the scoring chances were no where near what they are now.  Also, even if the shots were up last year they at no time got hemmed into their own zone like they are now, it's unreal how bad they are right now.

I agree, before he was injured in game 15. After that, we did a lot of Cussing around in our own zone. Maybe not as bad as now, but close, and our goalies bailed us out. Difference so far this year is that Anderson hasn't been unconscious thus far, only 'good'.

I think the problem with this team is that some players are still stuck between transitioning from last year's defensive style and this year's "supposed" offense minded system.
We have a unit (methot karlsson + turris line) who are clearly on the ice for puck possession style and it works, but the rest of the group don't know what to do. Maclean is trying to implement a Detroit system to guys like Cowen, Greening, Kassian, Neil, Gryba etc. Add the fact that MIchalek is completely lost, Spezza looks very slow etc.
Diddle, I can't wait until Ceci, Lazar, Hoffman etc are ready.

LeKing wrote:I think the problem with this team is that some players are still stuck between transitioning from last year's defensive style and this year's "supposed" offense minded system.
We have a unit (methot karlsson + turris line) who are clearly on the ice for puck possession style and it works, but the rest of the group don't know what to do. Maclean is trying to implement a Detroit system to guys like Cowen, Greening, Kassian, Neil, Gryba etc. Add the fact that MIchalek is completely lost, Spezza looks very slow etc.
Diddle, I can't wait until Ceci, Lazar, Hoffman etc are ready.

That's the guy that's gonna make the biggest difference in Ottawa I think. Him and perhaps Pageau.

SpezDispenser wrote:
I agree, before he was injured in game 15.  After that, we did a lot of Cussing around in our own zone.  Maybe not as bad as now, but close, and our goalies bailed us out.  Difference so far this year is that Anderson hasn't been unconscious thus far, only 'good'.

Anderson hasn't been "#1" good, though. Through the first quarter of the season (and he's played 70% of the team's games) he is 36th among in GAA among the "leaders" (I believe this is based on a minimum number of games played). And before you say "Well, that's because the Sens' D give up the most shots in the league) he is also 33rd in SV% in the same crowd. So his relative position in the list is pretty similar on both of those counts (I think that's because Lehner was in for the bulk of the two games where they set new club records for shots against and a third one where they came close). I don't have the stat for goals given up on the 1st shot of the game but I know it's at least 3 times that that's happened (once with Lehner, too). So in more than 20% of his games he gives up a goal on the 1st shot. And if you increase the scope to simply giving up the first goal, I'm not sure how many games -- beside the opening game of the season -- that Anderson didn't give up the first one. And then throw in how many games the Sens were down 0-2. Ok, I know, many of those are team results and not just on the goalie, but the evidence is just mounting. .904 SV% is not only 'good'.

wprager wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:
I agree, before he was injured in game 15.  After that, we did a lot of Cussing around in our own zone.  Maybe not as bad as now, but close, and our goalies bailed us out.  Difference so far this year is that Anderson hasn't been unconscious thus far, only 'good'.

Anderson hasn't been "#1" good, though.  Through the first quarter of the season (and he's played 70% of the team's games) he is 36th among in GAA among the "leaders" (I believe this is based on a minimum number of games played).  And before you say "Well, that's because the Sens' D give up the most shots in the league) he is also 33rd in SV% in the same crowd.  So his relative position in the list is pretty similar on both of those counts (I think that's because Lehner was in for the bulk of the two games where they set new club records for shots against and a third one where they came close).  I don't have the stat for goals given up on the 1st shot of the game but I know it's at least 3 times that that's happened (once with Lehner, too).  So in more than 20% of his games he gives up a goal on the 1st shot.  And if you increase the scope to simply giving up the first goal, I'm not sure how many games -- beside the opening game of the season -- that Anderson didn't give up the first one.  And then throw in how many games the Sens were down 0-2.  Ok, I know, many of those are team results and not just on the goalie, but the evidence is just mounting.  .904 SV% is not only 'good'.

Yeah, but our defence have a competition going amongst themselves: who can give it away the most - and who can give it away right in the slot the most. Stats are there for a reason for sure, but when you give the puck up as much as our D does in the spots they do...it's just brutal on goalies. I have no idea how Lehner has the stats he has. Either he's amazing (which he is), but even then that's not enough to have those stats with this D. He must intimidate them somehow.

SpezDispenser wrote:

wprager wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:
I agree, before he was injured in game 15.  After that, we did a lot of Cussing around in our own zone.  Maybe not as bad as now, but close, and our goalies bailed us out.  Difference so far this year is that Anderson hasn't been unconscious thus far, only 'good'.

Anderson hasn't been "#1" good, though.  Through the first quarter of the season (and he's played 70% of the team's games) he is 36th among in GAA among the "leaders" (I believe this is based on a minimum number of games played).  And before you say "Well, that's because the Sens' D give up the most shots in the league) he is also 33rd in SV% in the same crowd.  So his relative position in the list is pretty similar on both of those counts (I think that's because Lehner was in for the bulk of the two games where they set new club records for shots against and a third one where they came close).  I don't have the stat for goals given up on the 1st shot of the game but I know it's at least 3 times that that's happened (once with Lehner, too).  So in more than 20% of his games he gives up a goal on the 1st shot.  And if you increase the scope to simply giving up the first goal, I'm not sure how many games -- beside the opening game of the season -- that Anderson didn't give up the first one.  And then throw in how many games the Sens were down 0-2.  Ok, I know, many of those are team results and not just on the goalie, but the evidence is just mounting.  .904 SV% is not only 'good'.

Yeah, but our defence have a competition going amongst themselves: who can give it away the most - and who can give it away right in the slot the most.  Stats are there for a reason for sure, but when you give the puck up as much as our D does in the spots they do...it's just brutal on goalies.  I have no idea how Lehner has the stats he has.  Either he's amazing (which he is), but even then that's not enough to have those stats with this D.  He must intimidate them somehow.

Hands down winner? "Karls" Karlsson.

Same D in front, Lehner has better SV% and GAA. And he'd be on a 5-game winning streak now if PMac had left him in.

Brah.