GAME DAY: Columbus Blue Jackets @ Ottawa Senators :: 1:00pm ET :: Sun. Nov. 17th, 2013

If it keeps going like this Spezza will ask for one... AGAIN.

Pretty  much the whole team is playing like Dung, you can't blame it on the captain or the goalie.

Murray will make the trade to shake things up and appease the fanbase/season ticket holders but the team will have to figure this out on their own.

Murray resigned Cowen and Wiercioch to fairly big money thinking they'll progress and improve, that has proven to be a mistake so far.

NEELY wrote:If it keeps going like this Spezza will ask for one... AGAIN.

he hasn't been boo'd yet, even then I doubt he'd do it.  He'll ruin what little reputation he has with the NHL and Team Canada.  Somehow I don't think he's that selfish.

He'll just mentally check out and wait for his contract to expire.  After Heatley I don't think he'll go down that road.

I think the Alfie departure is what is hurting them. I think they gave it all last year knowing he was most likely gone in the offseason.

There's no real motivation left, no one will bleed on the ice for Spezza and certainly not for Melnyk.

Hoags wrote:Pretty  much the whole team is playing like Dung, you can't blame it on the captain or the goalie.

Murray will make the trade to shake things up and appease the fanbase/season ticket holders but the team will have to figure this out on their own.

Murray resigned Cowen and Wiercioch to fairly big money thinking they'll progress and improve, that has proven to be a mistake so far.

There is no one player or thing to blame entirely but you can absolutely look at this team and draw parallels to Spezza's play. This team is centered and focused around Spezza, that's a fact. It isn't working. Until that changes this team will be very much the same.

NEELY wrote:
There is no one player or thing to blame entirely but you can absolutely look at this team and draw parallels to Spezza's play.  This team is centered and focused around Spezza, that's a fact.  It isn't working.  Until that changes this team will be very much the same.

The team was focused on and centered by Spezza when he finished #4 in NHL scoring and they took the Rangers to 7 games. Alfie was on the 2nd line then and Turris is the most important centre on the team now in terms of role and ice time.

Hoags wrote:Pretty  much the whole team is playing like Dung, you can't blame it on the captain or the goalie.

Murray will make the trade to shake things up and appease the fanbase/season ticket holders but the team will have to figure this out on their own.

Murray resigned Cowen and Wiercioch to fairly big money thinking they'll progress and improve, that has proven to be a mistake so far.

NEELY wrote:If it keeps going like this Spezza will ask for one... AGAIN.

he hasn't been boo'd yet, even then I doubt he'd do it.  He'll ruin what little reputation he has with the NHL and Team Canada.  Somehow I don't think he's that selfish.

He'll just mentally check out and wait for his contract to expire.  After Heatley I don't think he'll go down that road.

They were chanting "Alfie" lol, even I thought that was low haha. As for Team Canada, he could save the Team Canada plane from crashing and they still wouldn't give him a second look. There is a reason they want no part of him and he's not even considered for the World Championship teams, lol. He doesn't know how to compete, he is slow, and he is still extremely immature player for being a 10 year vet. He doesn't get it.

Rip the "C" off him at seasons end if things keep going this way... he'll want out, no question.

Hoags wrote:

NEELY wrote:
There is no one player or thing to blame entirely but you can absolutely look at this team and draw parallels to Spezza's play.  This team is centered and focused around Spezza, that's a fact.  It isn't working.  Until that changes this team will be very much the same.

The team was focused on and centered by Spezza when he finished #4 in NHL scoring and they took the Rangers to 7 games.  Alfie was on the 2nd line then and Turris is the most important centre on the team now in terms of role and ice time.

The team this year was built around Spezza, there is no question about that. Ryan was brought in for Spezza, part of the reason Alfie left is because they believed in Spezza... Spezza is still the center of this team, he's still the captain, and yes he is the biggest reason this team is struggling. Players look to him for an answer, look at him for the extra gear, look at him to set an example. He gives nothing except what he wants to give and doesn't know how to play the game at such a level where he can make a difference night in and night out. He doesn't need to fight, he doesn't need to lay guys out, he doesn't need to scream and shout, but he needs to do something.

NEELY wrote:
The team this year was built around Spezza, there is no question about that.  Ryan was brought in for Spezza, part of the reason Alfie left is because they believed in Spezza... Spezza is still the center of this team, he's still the captain, and yes he is the biggest reason this team is struggling.  Players look to him for an answer, look at him for the extra gear, look at him to set an example.  He gives nothing except what he wants to give and doesn't know how to play the game at such a level where he can make a difference night in and night out.  He doesn't need to fight, he doesn't need to lay guys out, he doesn't need to scream and shout, but he needs to do something.

Well if Murray thought that, he needs to give his head a shake.  Him of all people knows what kind of player/person Spezza is.
He's never really been that kind of player.  He's an opportunistic player, he's not a Ryan Callahan type.

I think the organization took a risk giving him the C and thinking he will take it to the next level with Ryan, I read they had reservations about doing so.  They didn't really have much of a choice, Phillips is no better.

The team defence is Dung. Few of them can play MacLean's system effectively. They can either wait til they develop more or make a trade.

It's been 20 games.  Let's chill and let this play out.  It may not be Spezza being captain so much as Alfie not being captain.  Give 'em time.  If the season keeps going like this, re-evaluate in the off-season.

You had to give it to Spezza for sure, there was no other choice. After his last full season there were plenty of reasons to believe that he might very well be ok in the spot he is in now. But like a lot of other times he resorts back to his old ways because he believes the way he plays the game is fine. it isn't.

Anyways, this is blowing up in Murray's and MacLean's face as we speak and right now there is nothing you can do except ride it out. Like Ev said even if I disagree you can probably ship out anyone 30 or over and this team wouldn't miss a beat or miss that player. They need to build a team identity and Spezza prevents that.

tim1_2 wrote:It's been 20 games.  Let's chill and let this play out.  It may not be Spezza being captain so much as Alfie not being captain.  Give 'em time.  If the season keeps going like this, re-evaluate in the off-season.

25% of the season is a pretty good chunk and this team is showing no signs of turning it around.

As for it not being Alfie and not being Spezza, it's one in the same. No one is asking Spezza to be Alfie but he has to be something besides a floater that's opportunistic. The one player that needs to be consistent in some way, whether that is being physical, constantly creating scoring chances, playing a 200 foot game, or even something as small as effort... he's as inconsistent as you can possibly be as a captain.

Anyways, as much as I like him and a move that would send shockwaves through the organization would be moving a guy like Neil. I know this wouldn't be popular and it would take away more from the Sens then it would add at this point but the cord may need to be cut. He's a heart and soul player and what he does for the team won't be replaced anytime soon... that said like if Spezza was traded, you can miss the playoffs with anyone.

I dont know how much you blame on MacLean. He has to work with the roster he has. I don't think he lost the room.

This team has resolved around #11 for so long I think we're dealing with a transition at this point. I really hope how and why he left isn't a distraction.

This would be year of their "Rebuild plan" but then again rebuilding team don't trade their 1st rounder.

The team has never been good defensively under MacLean, we've been in the bottom 3rd of the league in shots allowed since he started here. Even worse now that we lost Gonchar.

Hoags wrote:I dont know how much you blame on MacLean.  He has to work with the roster he has.  I don't think he lost the room.

This team has resolved around #11 for so long I think we're dealing with a transition at this point.  I really hope how and why he left isn't a distraction.

This would be year of their "Rebuild plan" but then again rebuilding team don't trade their 1st rounder.

The team has never been good defensively under MacLean, we've been in the bottom 3rd of the league in shots allowed since he started here.  Even worse now that we lost Gonchar.

Like the Oilers? Best thing they could have done in the last 2 drafts was trade one of those damn picks. Ottawa doesn't need anymore 1st rounders to develop, they have enough and pick players out of the later rounds that make their 1st rounders a lot less valuable to them and more valuable to other organizations.

MacLean can only play the players he's given, you're right. There is nothing he can do at this point besides change goalies which doesn't really change the way the team plays, they are always poor in their own zone. He hasn't lost the room but again, he needs leaders to help him out. Last year he leaned on Gonchar, Alfie, Neil, and Phillips to drag the team along and they did a great job. This year he has Spezza along with Neil and Phillips... that's the difference right now from last year and the year before.

tim1_2 wrote:It's been 20 games.  Let's chill and let this play out.  It may not be Spezza being captain so much as Alfie not being captain.  Give 'em time.  If the season keeps going like this, re-evaluate in the off-season.

Yeah, 20, yet PMac said 30. Was he really talking about Spezza being 30 years old?  

I don't think it's entirely correct to say 25% of the season is done and this team is showing no signs. They beat the Wings; they beat the Bruins. If Lehner was in earlier they would have also beaten other teams, like the Blackhawks. A lot of this season's issues are on PMac:

1. JOB -- good PKer, certainly a better 4th liner than Kassian, better size than Conacher. Why is he collecting his NHL salary in the AHL? Murray gave him a one-way so I have to think this is something to do with PMac.
2. Sending a "message" to Zibanejad by sending him down. Could have easily sent the message by playing him. DaCosta did absolutely nothing and I think he is an AHL player; have thought that from the start.
3. Putting Neil on Spezza's wing when what he need was get Michalek out of there. Actually Michalek was skating pretty well today, so maybe he needed a "message" more than someone else.
4. Playing Pageau and Zibanejad on the 4th line with Kassian. Why??! Of course you're not going to get a rookie who almost played in the ECHL the year before producing playing with someone like Kassian, 5-6 minutes a night. Play him in the top 9 and he probably doesn't even get sent down.
5. Playing Anderson repeatedly when Lehner was playing better. Sticking with his #1 after Lehner won 3 straight and 1st star honours. Fact is Lehner didn't win the game against the Bruins, he was saved by his team (about time, but hardly a performance that generated any more confidence). I don't hate Andy, far from it, but we need wins and those are hard to come by starting down 0-2 every game.

I think Neil, Philips and Spezza just have a losers vibe that has been cultivated throughout those years that just won't change.
LIke Ev said, all three need to go to shake things off.
How many successful teams in the NHL can you think off that have had the same leadership core for this long?

How about that Johansen breakaway where Cowen just moved out of the way?  
Not sure how leadership can solve that

And Coling Greening... jeez did the guy have a single scoring opportunity this season?

LeKing wrote:How about that Johansen breakaway where Cowen just moved out of the way?  
Not sure how leadership can solve that

And Coling Greening... jeez did the guy have a single scoring opportunity this season?

Potvin mentioned that Cowen has a tendency to back in rather than go after attacking forwards.

LeKing wrote:How about that Johansen breakaway where Cowen just moved out of the way?  
Not sure how leadership can solve that

And Coling Greening... jeez did the guy have a single scoring opportunity this season?

There just needs to simply be a shift in the guys running that room. So many great pieces in Ottawa, Ryan, Turris, Lehner, obviously Karlsson, Methot, Borowiecki, these guys all bring something different and special to the table. Until they start to really focus around those guys this team will be in for a long road.