(1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

Check this:

Carkner's time on ice last night: 39 seconds. Same as his #.

Hilarious.

Carkner realistically probably should be suspended. Although what will go in his favour is that the incident happened early in the game, and he was kicked out. Shanahan will see Carkner as a nobody, who punched someone in the face twice (on the ground he punches Boyle in the ribs). I think Carkner will get 1 game to try and calm the series a bit. His intent seemed to be to fight Boyle. He confronted him from the front. If he wanted to cheap shot him, he could have todd bertuzzied Boyle from behind.

Hagelin, unfortunately, I think will only be given one game. I believe they will mirror the two suspensions. Hagelin clearly lifted his elbow and went for Alfie's head. I think his intent for the hit was to go for the head. It's a travesty that Hagelin was allowed to return to the game, after such a blatant attempt to injure.

I hope I'm wrong and Carkner gets nothing, and Hagelin gets multiple games.

Game 3 will be unreal, and this better pump up our fans. I'll be there and yelling my lungs dry. Interesting to see what comes of the suspensions.

Hopefully Alfie is ok... Sens will need to continue to bring it in Game 3... the bar has been raised...

SpezDispenser wrote:Joy Lindsay ‏ @PSBJoyOnTheSens Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
#Sens' Black Aces being called up from #BSens: Lehner; Borowiecki, Gryba, Wiercioch; Da Costa, Dziurzynski, Hoffman, Petersson, Zibanejad.

If Alfie is concussed, you dress that guy for 1 shift against Callahan / Richards / Gaborik. Take a piece out of whichever guy is closest to him.

Let 'em know that, if you take out one of our best players, we're going to take out one of your best players.

My prediction for today's Shanabananas:

1 game for Carkner
1 game for Hagelin

All hail The Alfie.

Not sure there's any point in dressing a skilled black ace. None of what's available comes close to replacing Alfie. Consider that with the fact that skill has not got us a goal in this series, you gotta go with a guy that can throw his weight around. The Rangers do a very nice job of clogging everything up. Michalek and Spezza have yet to show up and it's not because they aren't trying...there's just no room.

Much rather see Klinkhammer over Butler.

shabbs wrote:My prediction for today's Shanabananas:

1 game for Carkner
1 game for Hagelin

All hail The Alfie.

I think Hagelin gets more than Carkner. Carkner got a major and got tossed from the game. Hagelin had the 5 min major but then was back.

At this point, I don't think Carkner should get suspended at all, but Shanahan might want to calm things down a bit. And if you allow Hagelin back on the ice, you know Dung is going to hit the fan, so I think he'll get 2 or more.

I would still dress a goon to take out one of NYR's top players if Alfie is out. Diddle 'em. High deliberate hit on a guy with a concussion history, that Dung is unacceptable. Let 'em know why you can't do that.

Vandelay wrote:Not sure there's any point in dressing a skilled black ace. None of what's available comes close to replacing Alfie. Consider that with the fact that skill has not got us a goal in this series, you gotta go with a guy that can throw his weight around. The Rangers do a very nice job of clogging everything up. Michalek and Spezza have yet to show up and it's not because they aren't trying...there's just no room.

Much rather see Klinkhammer over Butler.

Definitely. Based on the type game he plays -- aggressive, up tempo, hard hitting -- I'd easily go with him over Butler.

rooneypoo wrote:

shabbs wrote:My prediction for today's Shanabananas:

1 game for Carkner
1 game for Hagelin

All hail The Alfie.

I think Hagelin gets more than Carkner. Carkner got a major and got tossed from the game. Hagelin had the 5 min major but then was back.

At this point, I don't think Carkner should get suspended at all, but Shanahan might want to calm things down a bit. And if you allow Hagelin back on the ice, you know Dung is going to hit the fan, so I think he'll get 2 or more.

I would still dress a goon to take out one of NYR's top players if Alfie is out. Diddle 'em. High deliberate hit on a guy with a concussion history, that Dung is unacceptable. Let 'em know why you can't do that.

I agree... I think Carks should get a $2500 fine a-la-Weber.... and Hags a multi-game suspension... but I just don't see it happening. I see Shanahan cowering to whatever is above him and making things "equal".

shabbs wrote:

rooneypoo wrote:

shabbs wrote:My prediction for today's Shanabananas:

1 game for Carkner
1 game for Hagelin

All hail The Alfie.

I think Hagelin gets more than Carkner. Carkner got a major and got tossed from the game. Hagelin had the 5 min major but then was back.

At this point, I don't think Carkner should get suspended at all, but Shanahan might want to calm things down a bit. And if you allow Hagelin back on the ice, you know Dung is going to hit the fan, so I think he'll get 2 or more.

I would still dress a goon to take out one of NYR's top players if Alfie is out. Diddle 'em. High deliberate hit on a guy with a concussion history, that Dung is unacceptable. Let 'em know why you can't do that.

I agree... I think Carks should get a $2500 fine a-la-Weber.... and Hags a multi-game suspension... but I just don't see it happening. I see Shanahan cowering to whatever is above him and making things "equal".

If they put Hagelin back on the ice, I think that game starts the same way this one did, i.e., with instant retribution. Unless he's done for the entire series, there is no punishment harsh enough Hagelin can get if he has indeed taken Alfie out of the series (or the playoffs altogether).

This is the second time that Alfie has been knocked out of a game by the Rangers. I don't see how Shanahan can let this one go as well. Wolski got zip because his excuse (swallowed by Shanahan) was that he was bracing for impact, and the contact itself was incidental. No possibility of such an excuse here as Hagelin went out of his way to hit Alfie and had his elbows up. However we've had quite the history with Shanahan, with Winchester missing 40 games on a hit from behind, head-first into the boards, with *NOTHING* to Gaustad, not even a penalty.

One way to look at this is Shanahan owes us big time and eventually has to pay up; the other is that he has it in for the Sens (goes all the way back to him mocking the stationary bike interviews) and will continue to screw them over until it costs him his job.

For the record, I don't think Carkner deserves anything. Even the 2+5 was too much because Karlsson got 2 and Boyle *didn't* get the five for the same type of incident (yes, Carkner hits harder but that's not his fault); the game misconduct was ridiculous. At least with Dubinsky it's an automatic -- third guy in a fight gets tossed, no questions asked. When, exactly, did an instigator carry a game misconduct?

Another thing I don't get. Was there, or wasn't there a fight? If there was a fight then Boyle should have gotten 5. If there wasn't a fight, there is no Instigator. The two go hand in hand. They could have given Carkner a minor for roughing, even a double minor given that he punched repeatedly, but there cannot be an Instigator with a fight!

Just read the rules and this is what it was:

Carkner was deemed to be the instigator *and* the aggressor (an aggressor is someone who continues punching after either clearly winning the fight or when his opponent is unable or unwilling to fight back). In this case he is assessed a minor for instigating, a major for fighting and a game misconduct for being the aggressor. So the ref went by the book.

Same for Dubinsky's 2 for roughing and game misconduct for being third man in.

NEELY wrote:

Big Ev wrote:can't see Konopka on this team next year, though.

Not so sure now. I had that opinion 24 hours ago as well but honestly, he's the type of guy that is just good to have around. The playoffs you really find out players worth and I think Konopka showed his.

Yeah, big time showed his worth.

My prediction (of what Shanahan will do not what should happen):

Carkner - 3 games
Hagelin - 2 games

Carkner's attack was pretty well pre-meditatated and they will (unfairly) make an example out of him because they didn't have the guts to do it to Weber. Weber got off lightly and teams around the NHL increased the physicality of their play. There will be high-level (Bettman) pressure to ensure that there are no more headlines in the playoffs like what happened last night.

Similarly, Hagelin will be kept away from the Ottawa home games as there would be retribution. If he is suspended for 2 or more, retribution will have to wait until next season.

Carkner probably should get a game and Hagelin should get five. Hagelin's defense to the media was laughable.

wprager wrote:This is the second time that Alfie has been knocked out of a game by the Rangers. I don't see how Shanahan can let this one go as well. Wolski got zip because his excuse (swallowed by Shanahan) was that he was bracing for impact, and the contact itself was incidental. No possibility of such an excuse here as Hagelin went out of his way to hit Alfie and had his elbows up. However we've had quite the history with Shanahan, with Winchester missing 40 games on a hit from behind, head-first into the boards, with *NOTHING* to Gaustad, not even a penalty.

One way to look at this is Shanahan owes us big time and eventually has to pay up; the other is that he has it in for the Sens (goes all the way back to him mocking the stationary bike interviews) and will continue to screw them over until it costs him his job.

For the record, I don't think Carkner deserves anything. Even the 2+5 was too much because Karlsson got 2 and Boyle *didn't* get the five for the same type of incident (yes, Carkner hits harder but that's not his fault); the game misconduct was ridiculous. At least with Dubinsky it's an automatic -- third guy in a fight gets tossed, no questions asked. When, exactly, did an instigator carry a game misconduct?

Another thing I don't get. Was there, or wasn't there a fight? If there was a fight then Boyle should have gotten 5. If there wasn't a fight, there is no Instigator. The two go hand in hand. They could have given Carkner a minor for roughing, even a double minor given that he punched repeatedly, but there cannot be an Instigator with a fight!

Honestly, I'm willing to take the loss if that's what it takes to make the Rangers pay on this one. We may have seen the last of our captain thanks to that cheap shot elbow. I thought it was just ridiculous that Torts actually tried to justify the elbow by saying Alfie ducked to try to get out of the way. That just shows how intentional it was- Alfie saw it coming, tried to dodge it, and that little puta still managed to hit him square on the melon.

Chris Neil is such a badass, even to the ref:

Vandelay wrote:
Honestly, I'm willing to take the loss if that's what it takes to make the Rangers pay on this one. We may have seen the last of our captain thanks to that cheap shot elbow. I thought it was just ridiculous that Torts actually tried to justify the elbow by saying Alfie ducked to try to get out of the way. That just shows how intentional it was- Alfie saw it coming, tried to dodge it, and that little puta still managed to hit him square on the melon.

Torts is an idiot, gives out a $20K rant on lack of respect for players on the ice and look at the crap his team has pulled.

I just watched again and, if anything, Alfie moved *away* from the impact. He only manages to move maybe a foot or two which speaks to the speed at which Hagelin is closing in. There's no way he can argue that Alfredsson ducked to try and get out of the way from the sequence below:











You can see Hagelin being way to the left of the seam where the two panels meet, then moving right across in the direction where Alfie was trying to get away from him, ending up on the right side of the seam.

If he tries to argue that he expected Alfie to continue in his initial direction (toward the point), then his initial aim was stupid-bad -- would have missed him by 10 feet. It's clear that he adjusted his trajectory to hit Alfie, and given the position of his elbows it was an intentional hit to the head, resulting in injury.

Shanahan's disciplinary call with Carkner:

Shanaban: Hey, Matt, you know we've got to talk, right?
Carkners: Uh-huh.
Shanahan: I saw that you barely touched his face and just went for the ribs.
Carkner: Yeah, well, he's a pretty boy and looks is all he's got. Didn't want to be mean.
Shanahan: I'm just going to give you a warning this time.
Carkner: Sure, thanks. What about Hagelin.
Shanahan: I'll give him a game. He's got no priors and I can throw the book at Shaw to show I mean business. So he'll be back on the ice Wednesday. Is that a problem?
Carkner: No, no problem at all.
Shanahan: Good, I guess we'll talk again Thursday.
Carkner: Sure thing.