Off Season Rumours

Ev wrote:50 points is easily achievable by most players you can pick up anywhere.

and he won't hit 30 goals anyway so we won't have to replace that.

How did the Sens replace Spezza's points? They must have been doomed right? No wait, they became a Top 10 offense without him.

Someone bookmark this for future reference

SpezDispensed wrote:I don't see why he wouldn't hit 30 goals.  He was moved down the lineup a lot last season by Cameron, and for some ridiculous reason wasn't on the top PP unit.

New coach who knows what he's doing with the power play will equal more chances for Hoffman, who, if nothing else is a fantastic sniper.

Because he's almost 27, he scores a lot of goals from the perimeter with a screened goalie, and because if he gets a decent sized contract he will have zero motivation.

Ev wrote:

SpezDispensed wrote:I don't see why he wouldn't hit 30 goals.  He was moved down the lineup a lot last season by Cameron, and for some ridiculous reason wasn't on the top PP unit.

New coach who knows what he's doing with the power play will equal more chances for Hoffman, who, if nothing else is a fantastic sniper.

Because he's almost 27, he scores a lot of goals from the perimeter with a screened goalie, and because if he gets a decent sized contract he will have zero motivation.

I dunno, I think you could say the motivation thing about any player who gets a big contract. I'm not Hoffman's biggest fan, but saying he's 27 doesn't really apply, seeing as how he's a 2nd year NHL player (plus the 25 game audition he had) who's scored close to 60 goals. I think he can score more if he rounds out his game.

That said, I feel a tinge of nervousness about him as well. Certainly a tradeable asset if things go semi-south though.

Ev wrote:50 points is easily achievable by most players you can pick up anywhere.

and he won't hit 30 goals anyway so we won't have to replace that.

How did the Sens replace Spezza's points? They must have been doomed right? No wait, they became a Top 10 offense without him.

They didn't *become* they were there already. Also, they missed the playoffs this year and only made them the year before because of an unprecedented performance from an AHL backup. So, no, they did not become a better team, offensively, after losing Spezza. His production was replaced by Stone and Hoffman. Do we have another Stone to come in and put up 25/60?

And if he had 27 and 29 goals in his first two seasons (playing with 3rd liners) I don't see why you are so adamant about him not hitting 30. And even if it's 25-27 it's still a chunk of goals that need to be replaced. Don't forget, no matter what the total was, it was enough to lead the team.

You're saying it's easy to score 50 points? Really? Then why doesn't every team fill their third lines with these easy-to-find 50 point guys?

SpezDispensed wrote:

Ev wrote:

SpezDispensed wrote:I don't see why he wouldn't hit 30 goals.  He was moved down the lineup a lot last season by Cameron, and for some ridiculous reason wasn't on the top PP unit.

New coach who knows what he's doing with the power play will equal more chances for Hoffman, who, if nothing else is a fantastic sniper.

Because he's almost 27, he scores a lot of goals from the perimeter with a screened goalie, and because if he gets a decent sized contract he will have zero motivation.

I dunno, I think you could say the motivation thing about any player who gets a big contract.  I'm not Hoffman's biggest fan, but saying he's 27 doesn't really apply, seeing as how he's a 2nd year NHL player (plus the 25 game audition he had) who's scored close to 60 goals.  I think he can score more if he rounds out his game.

That said, I feel a tinge of nervousness about him as well.  Certainly a tradeable asset if things go semi-south though.

Hoffman has a chip on his shoulder. He doesn't just want a contract. He likes scoring goals. He likes leading the team in goals.

And as for contract fall offs, yeah, lots of examples -- Cowen, Greening even Smith the year before. I honestly don't think that's the way Hoffman is, though.

Hoffman is a keeper, when is the last time we produced a forward that scored that many goals? He has a killer shot and so what if it's on a screened goalie? That's how you score goals in the playoffs on a good goalie.

Both Dorion and Boucher mentioned Hoffman as a key player of the team I think they will resign him.

(Funny how $7M player Bobby Ryan wasn't mentioned in the same sentence)

Hoags wrote:Hoffman is a keeper, when is the last time we produced a forward that scored that many goals? He has a killer shot and so what if it's on a screened goalie? That's how you score goals in the playoffs on a good goalie.

Both Dorion and Boucher mentioned Hoffman as a key player of the team I think they will resign him.

(Funny how $7M player Bobby Ryan wasn't mentioned in the same sentence)

Ryan is a better player and anyone who thinks otherwise shouldn't be relied upon to give hockey opinions. The team didn't have to mention Ryan, especially when they are asked questions about Hoffman directly that have nothing to do with Ryan. Ryan will score more goals than Hoffman this season, if I had to bet today. He is obviously a huge piece of our team and will be relied upon more than a late blooming one dimensional winger.

Again I wouldn't mind signing Hoffman, but giving him a long term deal is a recipe for disaster. He has a lot of warts and isn't an elite player.

Ev wrote:

Hoags wrote:Hoffman is a keeper, when is the last time we produced a forward that scored that many goals? He has a killer shot and so what if it's on a screened goalie? That's how you score goals in the playoffs on a good goalie.

Both Dorion and Boucher mentioned Hoffman as a key player of the team I think they will resign him.

(Funny how $7M player Bobby Ryan wasn't mentioned in the same sentence)

Ryan is a better player and anyone who thinks otherwise shouldn't be relied upon to give hockey opinions. The team didn't have to mention Ryan, especially when they are asked questions about Hoffman directly that have nothing to do with Ryan. Ryan will score more goals than Hoffman this season, if I had to bet today. He is obviously a huge piece of our team and will be relied upon more than a late blooming one dimensional winger.

Again I wouldn't mind signing Hoffman, but giving him a long term deal is a recipe for disaster. He has a lot of warts and isn't an elite player.

I like Ryan and I think his best seasons as a Senator are ahead.

Ev wrote:50 points is easily achievable by most players you can pick up anywhere.

and he won't hit 30 goals anyway so we won't have to replace that.

Poor Hoffman. 29 goals and 59 points has forever labelled him as a 50 point player and someone who can't crack 30 goals.

He's a 50+ point player but he is certainly not a 30 goal scorer until he actually hits that makr.

Hoffman scores more goals, assists and points per minutes of icetime than "elite player" Ryan.

Hoffman is in his prime, Ryan is declining, his best years are behind him.

If anyone will improve next year with more ice time it will be Hoffman.

Hoags wrote:Hoffman scores more goals, assists and points per minutes of icetime than "elite player" Ryan.
 
Hoffman is in his prime, Ryan is declining, his best years are behind him.

If anyone will improve next year with more ice time it will be Hoffman.

Hoffman is turning 27 this fall and Ryan is turning 30 in March. BOTH are out of their primes. Prime for hockey players these days is between 24-25-26. Ryan is a lot more proven and just a better player. I also I didn't say he was elite either, but he is more elite and multidimensional than Hoffman. He just needs to have better ends to the season. His starts have been some of his best hockey ever, both stats-wise and performance wise. Hoffman also had a brutal end to the year that fanboys love to ignore.

I couldn't care less about "per minute" stats because they don't tell you what a guy will do with more ice time.

Ev wrote:

Hoags wrote:Hoffman scores more goals, assists and points per minutes of icetime than "elite player" Ryan.
 
Hoffman is in his prime, Ryan is declining, his best years are behind him.

If anyone will improve next year with more ice time it will be Hoffman.

Hoffman is turning 27 this fall and Ryan is turning 30 in March. BOTH are out of their primes. Prime for hockey players these days is between 24-25-26. Ryan is a lot more proven and just a better player. I also I didn't say he was elite either, but he is more elite and multidimensional than Hoffman. He just needs to have better ends to the season. His starts have been some of his best hockey ever, both stats-wise and performance wise. Hoffman also had a brutal end to the year that fanboys love to ignore.

I couldn't care less about "per minute" stats because they don't tell you what a guy will do with more ice time.

You don't have a "brutal end" and score 29 goals and nearly 60 points without having a fantastic start. Right?

So they both had good starts and tailed off at the end. But over the season, as a whole, Hoffman had more goals and more points, was a + player on a team that had negative goal differentiation (Ryan was -9).

So he just needs to have better ends to the season, right?

SeawaySensFan wrote:

Ev wrote:

Hoags wrote:Hoffman is a keeper, when is the last time we produced a forward that scored that many goals? He has a killer shot and so what if it's on a screened goalie? That's how you score goals in the playoffs on a good goalie.

Both Dorion and Boucher mentioned Hoffman as a key player of the team I think they will resign him.

(Funny how $7M player Bobby Ryan wasn't mentioned in the same sentence)

Ryan is a better player and anyone who thinks otherwise shouldn't be relied upon to give hockey opinions. The team didn't have to mention Ryan, especially when they are asked questions about Hoffman directly that have nothing to do with Ryan. Ryan will score more goals than Hoffman this season, if I had to bet today. He is obviously a huge piece of our team and will be relied upon more than a late blooming one dimensional winger.

Again I wouldn't mind signing Hoffman, but giving him a long term deal is a recipe for disaster. He has a lot of warts and isn't an elite player.

I like Ryan and I think his best seasons as a Senator are ahead.

I sure hope so

Ev wrote:it wouldn't leave a big hole on the top line because he has never been a top line player on this team.

Must we do this again?

Ev wrote:He's a 50+ point player but he is certainly not a 30 goal scorer until he actually hits that makr.

Sure, but even you'd agree it's pretty damn close, also considering the amount of posts the guy hit. Could easily be a 30 goal, 60 point guy. For all intents and purposes, he is and the negotiations won't be hinging on a single goal.

Another note, he may have not hit 30 goals but he's been the closest to it since Spezza in 2012 (34 goals).

He's worried that Hoffman's another spezza, in that, a guy you don't go to war with in the playoffs and spend a big dollar amount on to sign. I can see that, but there's a lot of pros too

SpezDispensed wrote:He's worried that Hoffman's another spezza, in that, a guy you don't go to war with in the playoffs and spend a big dollar amount on to sign.  I can see that, but there's a lot of pros too

If hoffman wants spezza $, then he can gtfo. He won't, and within reason he deserves to be paid much more than he is. $5M should be the ceiling on a long term deal.

As for Spezza, watching him in the playoffs this season, there was only one thought in my head: 'where the Diddle was this when he was a senator?' He figured it out under the right coach/system, and no reason to believe Hoffman can't. At this point I wouldn't go to war with bobby ryan either, but what are you going to do?