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Melnyk stepped up once, now he needs to step up again and pay Methot whatever we need to. The guy makes this team so much better it's basically night and day. Ditto Karlsson. Get. It. Done.

SpezDispensed wrote:Melnyk stepped up once, now he needs to step up again and pay Methot whatever we need to.  The guy makes this team so much better it's basically night and day.  Ditto Karlsson.  Get.  It.  Done.

Naw get a cheaper version of him

Ev wrote:

SpezDispensed wrote:Melnyk stepped up once, now he needs to step up again and pay Methot whatever we need to.  The guy makes this team so much better it's basically night and day.  Ditto Karlsson.  Get.  It.  Done.

Naw get a cheaper version of him

As good as he is? Like who?

Yah, I wouldn't give Methot 5 or 6 years either, lol. If you are giving a guy with injury history and a bad back a 25-30 million dollar contract at 30 years old you are crazy. Imagine paying Phillips 5 million right now... that's what will happen in years 4, 5, and 6 of that deal.

There are cheaper versions of Methot like Ev said and remember who Karlsson won a Norris with. Hint: It wasn't Methot.

If Methot wants a big pay day good luck to him because other teams won't be spending big time money because the cap is not going anywhere, up, down, or otherwise.

SpezDispensed wrote:

Ev wrote:

SpezDispensed wrote:Melnyk stepped up once, now he needs to step up again and pay Methot whatever we need to.  The guy makes this team so much better it's basically night and day.  Ditto Karlsson.  Get.  It.  Done.

Naw get a cheaper version of him

As good as he is?  Like who?

i don't know, that's not my job. But I know for a fact you can get steady d-men who can handle the puck decently for less than $5 million.

They don't play the same side but I'd trade for Myers who makes less than $5 million after 15/16

I would also save the money to try to woo Mike Green who is much better and could probably be had for around that price

NEELY wrote:

wprager wrote:

NEELY wrote:And to tell you the truth I want the Sens in a position where they have no choice but to draft Konecny.  He's playing on a garbage team, targeted each and every night with little to no help at all.  He's got it all but size which is an issue but he's a kid you know is going to succeed at the next level and the exact type of talent the Sens need up front.  The only thing more impressive than his skill is his work ethic.  I like his PIM's too, show's he's willing to play chippy, hard, and with an edge... always important for a smaller guy/pittbull.

Also... he still might grow an inch or two... see Nick Paul.  Right now I think he is generously listed at 5'10 but lets say that's true, 5'10 really isn't a tiny NHL player.  It's on the smaller side of average for sure but 5'11, 6'0 is about the average size of an NHL forward.

This is five years ago, and the average NHL forward was 6'1" 202.2 lbs.  
http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2010/10/15/1751273/sizing-up-the-nhl-by-height-weight-and-age


This is from the start of this season, and the average NHLer is the same as in the earlier one (6'1-1/3") so it's possible the average forward is the same as before, too.
http://mirtle.blogspot.ca/2014/10/2014-15-nhl-teams-by-height-weight-and.html

I don't think it's a stretch that Konecny plays at 200lbs.  Remeber though I said average NHL forward, D men tend to be bigger.

I remember that you said he's "on the smaller side of average" which doesn't really say much other than he's "below average". As I indicated above the average NHL forward is 6'1". As *you* said, he's generously listed at 5'10", which is a full 3" below average. Yes, it's on the "smaller side".

Frankly, though, right now we need some high-end skill and finish. I was pulling for drafting Ceci and it worked out. There are quite a few recent 67s doing well in the NHL (not like it was back a few years). Don't think he'd be that much more of a draw being a 67 as Ceci was for being *from* Ottawa, but he certainly would feel comfortable *in* Ottawa.

SpezDispensed wrote:Melnyk stepped up once, now he needs to step up again and pay Methot whatever we need to.  The guy makes this team so much better it's basically night and day.  Ditto Karlsson.  Get.  It.  Done.

Melnyk is already paying Kaptain Karlsson to make this team better and those around him. He shouldn't have to give a guy whatever he wants to make Karlsson better.

Ev wrote:

SpezDispensed wrote:

Ev wrote:

SpezDispensed wrote:Melnyk stepped up once, now he needs to step up again and pay Methot whatever we need to.  The guy makes this team so much better it's basically night and day.  Ditto Karlsson.  Get.  It.  Done.

Naw get a cheaper version of him

As good as he is?  Like who?

i don't know, that's not my job. But I know for a fact you can get steady d-men who can handle the puck decently for less than $5 million.

They don't play the same side but I'd trade for Myers who makes less than $5 million after 15/16

I would also save the money to try to woo Mike Green who is much better and could probably be had for around that price

Myers will be expensive IMO, Green is a righty who would be a third pairing guy when the chips are down. Methot has a place on this team, is already established here and is a great partner for Karlsson. Don't see the problem in giving him money and term. Certainly he won't be getting anything resembling a full NTC after year 3, so you can assess every summer/deadline if you feel he's declining.

This is the type of player Cup champs would be after to bolster, I think we need to get it done.

Methot would make any team better... in 2, 3 years that might not be the case. Bad contracts sink teams and giving Methot 5, 6 years so he can play 2, maybe 3 solid seasons is not how you build a winner.

Who knows who might come in and play with Karlsson. Is Claeson or Boroweicki capable? Is there someone you can bring in for 2, 3 seasons while other become a little more seasoned? There are better options than Methot signed for 5, 6... maybe not signed for 3. Sens would be better off paying Methot 6 mil a year for 3 years than 5 mil for 5 years.

Or 6 X 4 years. Do what you have to do, because there's no one in the system who can play with Karlsson the way Methot can. At least not yet.

Again, Kuba was with him when he won a Norris. The ability to play with Karlsson is getting beyond stupid, he was great before Methot he will be fine without him.

NEELY wrote:Again, Kuba was with him when he won a Norris.  The ability to play with Karlsson is getting beyond stupid, he was great before Methot he will be fine without him.

The fancy stats for Karlsson playing with Wiercioch are very good, albeit over a small sample size. I also would try Cowen up there (move Boro up with Ceci). And out-of-the-box idea would be to try Ceci out on his off-side.

So long as it's not Phillips I think Karlsson will be fine.

NEELY wrote:Again, Kuba was with him when he won a Norris.  The ability to play with Karlsson is getting beyond stupid, he was great before Methot he will be fine without him.

And Kuba would cost over 5M plus term in this market.

Yeah, Kuba had a great year before he declined - mostly due to age. He reminded me of Redden a bit in that he took hits, but quietly made plays, but then ultimately broke down.

Still think Methot is by far the best option on Karlsson's left, not only because of his track record there, but the fact that it gives us a really solid, young D core with Karlsson, Cowen, Ceci, Boro, Gryba and Claesson in the wings.

And there's also very few D-men who hit the market every year, less every year I'd say, so it becomes a nightmare to try to replace.

wprager wrote:

NEELY wrote:Again, Kuba was with him when he won a Norris.  The ability to play with Karlsson is getting beyond stupid, he was great before Methot he will be fine without him.

The fancy stats for Karlsson playing with Wiercioch are very good, albeit over a small sample size.  I also would try Cowen up there (move Boro up with Ceci).  And out-of-the-box idea would be to try Ceci out on his off-side.  

So long as it's not Phillips I think Karlsson will be fine.

Point is and I think Ev is saying it too, there are TONS of possible options for Karlsson. Whether that is a Scudari, Claeson, Boychuk, Boroweicki, Cowen, etc, etc, etc, you don't need a 5 million dollar guy with limited up side who has a ton of miles on him. The contract he wants will take him until he's Phillips age and I don't care what anyone says Methot at his age now was no where near the player Phillips was at the same age nor did Phillips have the miles and injuries Methot does right now.

It's absolutely ridiculous that people truly believe Karlsson can't play with anyone not named Methot or even play as well as he has in the past. Karlsson is a generational talent capable playing with anyone who has the ability to play top 4 mins. Simple as that. Again, he won his Norris with Kuba, a guy no one wanted to resign and a guy people said Karlsson made. But now, Methot, a good old Ottawa boy and Canadian makes Karlsson? Complete BS.

Karlsson has come back from a career threatening injury and it took time and fact is the Sens were lost with MacLean including Karlsson. He was back in form way before Methot returned and yah, they work as a pair, that's great but don't BS everyone (not you Prags) and say Karlsson is better with Methot... no Karlsson is better because he's worked hard on and off the ice, he's bought into Cameron, he's starting to feel comfortable as captain, and physically he is starting to look like he did when he won his Norris trophy without Methot.

SpezDispensed wrote:Yeah, Kuba had a great year before he declined - mostly due to age.  He reminded me of Redden a bit in that he took hits, but quietly made plays, but then ultimately broke down.

Still think Methot is by far the best option on Karlsson's left, not only because of his track record there, but the fact that it gives us a really solid, young D core with Karlsson, Cowen, Ceci, Boro, Gryba and Claesson in the wings.

And there's also very few D-men who hit the market every year, less every year I'd say, so it becomes a nightmare to try to replace.

Kuba was let go the year Karlsson won the Norris.

Oglethorpe wrote:

NEELY wrote:Again, Kuba was with him when he won a Norris.  The ability to play with Karlsson is getting beyond stupid, he was great before Methot he will be fine without him.

And Kuba would cost over 5M plus term in this market.

Maybe, maybe not but there would have been better options for 5 mil than Kuba, just like there are better options than Methot for 5 mil.

Methot is a top 4 D man playing with a world class player, arguably the best D man in the world. Just like Komisarek should have thanked Markov for his millions, Methot should do the same. Extremely apt comparison.

Mike green isn't a third pairing dman lol