Game Day - Rangers @ Ottawa, 7:30PM, Wednesday, Movember 9, 2011

rooneypoo wrote:
^ Yep, that's what I'm talking about, and what I was getting at with the "$7 mil Kovalev" comment.

All I can say is that right now, when Alfie is out, this is when the team needs Spezza the most. This is the time for him to step up, to perform, to lead. But he's not -- he's disappearing. This is our future captain? Guy is a model of inconsistency.

I don't want to debate his work ethic/consistency...this is a debate that has raged on since the dawn of time.

Someone was mentioning on Team 1200 the other day (maybe Gary Galley), that when Spezza is "on" it looks like he's skating fluidly, and when he's struggling, it looks like his skating his laboured...almost like he always has a nagging injury that feels better on some nights, worse on others.

I don't want to make excuses for him, but it is a possibility, especially given his injury history.

All I can say is, thank god Alfie is coming back tomorrow

Also, do you want ot know who I think is deserving of the C once Alfie retires? Nick Foligno. He is all heart, is constantly motivating everyone, and is really picking his game up this season.

I thought Spezza should get it - and he probably will - but I would like Foligno to get consideration.

NEELY wrote:I agree with everythign there ROoney but I wouldn't compare Spezza and Kovalev either... just a really wrong approch to the discussion, people get their backs up right away.

Meh, there are guys here who will defend Spezza until the end, & swear that black is white & up is down for him. Those same people are going to get their backs up the moment I tell them Spezza doesn't Dung gold or barf up happy meals.

I'm just using Kovalev as a shorthand for an apathetic, disengaged, inconsistent forward. And that's what Spezza has looked like since Alfie went down, when it was, precisely, his moment to step up. The only people not seeing that are the people I describe above.

rooneypoo wrote:

NEELY wrote:I agree with everythign there ROoney but I wouldn't compare Spezza and Kovalev either... just a really wrong approch to the discussion, people get their backs up right away.

Meh, there are guys here who will defend Spezza until the end, & swear that black is white & up is down for him. Those same people are going to get their backs up the moment I tell them Spezza doesn't Dung gold or barf up happy meals.

I'm just using Kovalev as a shorthand for an apathetic, disengaged, inconsistent forward. And that's what Spezza has looked like since Alfie went down, when it was, precisely, his moment to step up. The only people not seeing that are the people I describe above.

I think that's just one guy though. Wprager.

Peggy wrote:Also, do you want ot know who I think is deserving of the C once Alfie retires? Nick Foligno. He is all heart, is constantly motivating everyone, and is really picking his game up this season.

I thought Spezza should get it - and he probably will - but I would like Foligno to get consideration.

I'm not willing to make a decision on 1+ months of play, but Michalek is looking like the obvious successor to Alfie at this point, to me. Love what I'm seeing from that guy. If he can stay healthy & continue doing what he's doing, then he ought to earn serious consideration. But too early to call that now.

What is apparent is that when Alfie drops out of the mix, Spezza quickly gets lost & overwhelmed. I don't know if it's because he feels the pressure more or whatever, but it's pretty apparent that his game went to the Dung the moment Alfie got hurt.

rooneypoo wrote:

Peggy wrote:Also, do you want ot know who I think is deserving of the C once Alfie retires? Nick Foligno. He is all heart, is constantly motivating everyone, and is really picking his game up this season.

I thought Spezza should get it - and he probably will - but I would like Foligno to get consideration.

I'm not willing to make a decision on 1+ months of play, but Michalek is looking like the obvious successor to Alfie at this point, to me. Love what I'm seeing from that guy. If he can stay healthy & continue doing what he's doing, then he ought to earn serious consideration. But too early to call that now.

What is apparent is that when Alfie drops out of the mix, Spezza quickly gets lost & overwhelmed. I don't know if it's because he feels the pressure more or whatever, but it's pretty apparent that his game went to the Dung the moment Alfie got hurt.

'

Him too, I just like Foligno's leadership, heart, hustle, and presence in the community. I'm really becoming a big fan. Reminds me of Ryan Callahan a bit.

It's frustrating as hell to see Spezza do his yo-yo trick. Dominate for a few games... sulk back into oblivion the next few. I don't like the Kovalev comparison but I can see Dr. Poo's point. We need our Cap'n back.

Peggy wrote:

NEELY wrote:

Peggy wrote:I agree about Spezza but I do believe he will pick it up. He strikes me as a second-half player like Derek Roy. He has been playing like Dung, but at least the numbers are there so it's not too too terrible. Still, when he picks it up, I am curious to see how much his points will skyrocket.

Will the 2nd 1/2 matter, though? Will it be garbage time again where Spezza piles up the points? If it is, so what?

The second half will matter more than the first half. That's when teams go on runs to try to make the playoffs. That's when they will truly need Spezza - especially if the younger player/Michalek are fatigued.

You're the one who said this team will be in the race, so it will not be garbage time.

And people - even your beloved Alfie - will have stretches where they look like Dung. It's called a streak.

The games that matter most are the ones where there are a couple of guys missing and they need him to step up. You can look back on these games Alfi has been out and probably the road trip coming up and say "that's when the Sens were done".

Eevryone goes through a period where they are not at their best. Spezza hasn't been good for most of the year besides 4 or 5 games where he lit the other team up.

rooneypoo wrote:

Peggy wrote:Also, do you want ot know who I think is deserving of the C once Alfie retires? Nick Foligno. He is all heart, is constantly motivating everyone, and is really picking his game up this season.

I thought Spezza should get it - and he probably will - but I would like Foligno to get consideration.

I'm not willing to make a decision on 1+ months of play, but Michalek is looking like the obvious successor to Alfie at this point, to me. Love what I'm seeing from that guy. If he can stay healthy & continue doing what he's doing, then he ought to earn serious consideration. But too early to call that now.

What is apparent is that when Alfie drops out of the mix, Spezza quickly gets lost & overwhelmed. I don't know if it's because he feels the pressure more or whatever, but it's pretty apparent that his game went to the Dung the moment Alfie got hurt.

To be fair to Spezza, he is best suited when he has a legit sniper lining up next to him (like Dany Dbag). He is finding some chemistry with Michalek and Greening, so let's give that new #1 line some time to gel.

But yeah, I don't think anyone would argue that sometimes he looks apathetic.

rooneypoo wrote:

NEELY wrote:I agree with everythign there ROoney but I wouldn't compare Spezza and Kovalev either... just a really wrong approch to the discussion, people get their backs up right away.

Meh, there are guys here who will defend Spezza until the end, & swear that black is white & up is down for him. Those same people are going to get their backs up the moment I tell them Spezza doesn't Dung gold or barf up happy meals.

I'm just using Kovalev as a shorthand for an apathetic, disengaged, inconsistent forward. And that's what Spezza has looked like since Alfie went down, when it was, precisely, his moment to step up. The only people not seeing that are the people I describe above.

Like I said I don't disagree but brinign Kovalev up just brings the convo down from the start. 1/2 the battle in a conversation about Spezza is how you approching it.

Either way, I question whether Spezza has the mental makeup to be a captain and if he ever is, he's just going to be a guy that wears it until his contract expires.

CJam13 on HFBoards is the biggest douche out of all Sens fans.

NEELY wrote:
Cool, then look at the past 4 seasons if you want to look at "stats". If you are going based off of just that, Ribeiro has been the better player.

Of course MacLean leans of Spezza, he's a 7 million dollar frigging player and the teams number 1 center. Who else does he have? That's a pretty obvious comment by you. You want to throw Da Costa out there in key situations only having played 20 NHL games?

Also, kind of a related question, do you think the Hart Trophy should be given out for the guy who is best on faceoffs? Just curious.

Get a little more informed before you start posting nonsense, saying you were a Habs fan and talking about a player that last played for them 5 years ago is pretty lame.

Well, you claim that Spezza has been playing the same for 9 years, so it's not a stretch to say I know how Ribeiro plays having watched him play on a regular basis 5 years ago.

And, please, get a clue before you start telling me to get more informed. You talk about things you know very little about all the time, and when it comes to hockey I know a hell of a lot more than you may want to think. I just have a different take on it than you do.

I never nominated Spezza for the Hart. Ribeiro has had some good seasons, true, some of them recently. But he's 3 years older than Spezza so it's fair to say he's not getting better, and his career stats make him a slightly under 3 points per 4 games played, while Spezza is slightly over a point per game. And, yes, better at face offs.

Peggy wrote:CJam13 on HFBoards is the biggest douche out of all Sens fans.

Oh I know, haha. I refuse to have a convo with that guy.

wprager wrote:

NEELY wrote:
Cool, then look at the past 4 seasons if you want to look at "stats". If you are going based off of just that, Ribeiro has been the better player.

Of course MacLean leans of Spezza, he's a 7 million dollar frigging player and the teams number 1 center. Who else does he have? That's a pretty obvious comment by you. You want to throw Da Costa out there in key situations only having played 20 NHL games?

Also, kind of a related question, do you think the Hart Trophy should be given out for the guy who is best on faceoffs? Just curious.

Get a little more informed before you start posting nonsense, saying you were a Habs fan and talking about a player that last played for them 5 years ago is pretty lame.

Well, you claim that Spezza has been playing the same for 9 years, so it's not a stretch to say I know how Ribeiro plays having watched him play on a regular basis 5 years ago.

And, please, get a clue before you start telling me to get more informed. You talk about things you know very little about all the time, and when it comes to hockey I know a hell of a lot more than you may want to think. I just have a different take on it than you do.

I never nominated Spezza for the Hart. Ribeiro has had some good seasons, true, some of them recently. But he's 3 years older than Spezza so it's fair to say he's not getting better, and his career stats make him a slightly under 3 points per 4 games played, while Spezza is slightly over a point per game. And, yes, better at face offs.

I disagree 100%. Believe it or not it's kind of easy to pick it out too.

Peggy wrote:CJam13 on HFBoards is the biggest douche out of all Sens fans.

He had a different username before .... mind you he's in good company there.

Peggy wrote:

rooneypoo wrote:

NEELY wrote:I agree with everythign there ROoney but I wouldn't compare Spezza and Kovalev either... just a really wrong approch to the discussion, people get their backs up right away.

Meh, there are guys here who will defend Spezza until the end, & swear that black is white & up is down for him. Those same people are going to get their backs up the moment I tell them Spezza doesn't Dung gold or barf up happy meals.

I'm just using Kovalev as a shorthand for an apathetic, disengaged, inconsistent forward. And that's what Spezza has looked like since Alfie went down, when it was, precisely, his moment to step up. The only people not seeing that are the people I describe above.

I think that's just one guy though. Wprager.

I am *not* a Spezza apologist. He is *not* my favorite player on the Sens, and he never was. I just don't like to always compare players relative to their salaries. Murray is the one who gave him the $7M contract and he knew better than anyone, at the time, what kind of player he was.

wprager wrote:

Peggy wrote:

rooneypoo wrote:

NEELY wrote:I agree with everythign there ROoney but I wouldn't compare Spezza and Kovalev either... just a really wrong approch to the discussion, people get their backs up right away.

Meh, there are guys here who will defend Spezza until the end, & swear that black is white & up is down for him. Those same people are going to get their backs up the moment I tell them Spezza doesn't Dung gold or barf up happy meals.

I'm just using Kovalev as a shorthand for an apathetic, disengaged, inconsistent forward. And that's what Spezza has looked like since Alfie went down, when it was, precisely, his moment to step up. The only people not seeing that are the people I describe above.

I think that's just one guy though. Wprager.

I am *not* a Spezza apologist. He is *not* my favorite player on the Sens, and he never was. I just don't like to always compare players relative to their salaries. Murray is the one who gave him the $7M contract and he knew better than anyone, at the time, what kind of player he was.

Is it the same reason why Murray has tried to trade him a number of times?