The Heatley Saga: What's in store in the next 30 days?

Sens19 wrote:

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:I dunno, I think I'd celebrate, whatever deal we get, whenever we get it. It may be a quick little celebration, followed by weveral weeks of depression, but I'll get my licks in first.

Agreed...again, I don't understand the logic behind thinking his value will increase mid-season. Honestly, GMs are thinking the same as us. They know with the olympics are coming up and Heatley wants a spot. They know what they've heard in the media, same as us. They know he's a great sniper with the potential to knotch 50 goals in a season. These things aren't going to change mid-way through the season. And teams being more willing to take him on because his salary will be less? What, so they can be stuck in the same spot as us right now, -1 year? Honestly, I'd be happy with a Dubinsky +prospects and picks trade at this point.

Murray didn't wait this long so he can settle for a bunch of prospects and picks. Plus I think any NY deal should start with Staal and not Dubinsky but that's just me

Staal is pretty close to untouchable. I would be a 2010 first would be included though. No real need to take on any D men either.

Neely4Life wrote:

wprager wrote:I dunno, I think I'd celebrate, whatever deal we get, whenever we get it. It may be a quick little celebration, followed by weveral weeks of depression, but I'll get my licks in first.

If The Sens are in 1st place, Heatley is leading the team and top 5 in the league is scoring and they deal him at the deadline, you would be happy?

I'll tell you right now, I would be losing my sh it.

Ah-ha-ha-ha-ha!!!! Thanks for giving me a lift, buddy. I love your sens of humor. 1st place, hee-hee. Top-five, bwa-ha-ha-hee-hoo-oh-my. Tears in my eyes.

It's not that big of a stretch to think Ottawa could be in 1st in their division with Heatley tearing it up. Whether you think so or not was irrelivant to my actual question.

If that were the case, would you be happy Heatley was dealt?

wprager wrote:Ah-ha-ha-ha-ha!!!! Thanks for giving me a lift, buddy. I love your sens of humor. 1st place, hee-hee. Top-five, bwa-ha-ha-hee-hoo-oh-my. Tears in my eyes.

Hilarious isn't it.
Common sense is losing its hold on this site over the last couple days.

There's nothing wrong with what Neely said. It's not that long of a stretch that we finish first in division and even if it is I don't think that was the point of the whole assumption. And i personally would be enraged if he was traded at that point

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:I dunno, I think I'd celebrate, whatever deal we get, whenever we get it. It may be a quick little celebration, followed by weveral weeks of depression, but I'll get my licks in first.

Agreed...again, I don't understand the logic behind thinking his value will increase mid-season. Honestly, GMs are thinking the same as us. They know with the olympics are coming up and Heatley wants a spot. They know what they've heard in the media, same as us. They know he's a great sniper with the potential to knotch 50 goals in a season. These things aren't going to change mid-way through the season. And teams being more willing to take him on because his salary will be less? What, so they can be stuck in the same spot as us right now, -1 year? Honestly, I'd be happy with a Dubinsky +prospects and picks trade at this point.

Some teams are in a situation where contracts are coming off the books next year, so affording his $7.5M is not a problem for the remaining 4 years. But this season they only have $4M in cap space, perhaps. So they can't afford him now (without moving contracts) but will have the cap space in March.

Not saying it will happen, but that there are situations that will make it possible for a team to take on Heatley in March, but not in October.

Sens19 wrote:There's nothing wrong with what Neely said. It's not that long of a stretch that we finish first in division and even if it is I don't think that was the point of the whole assumption. And i personally would be enraged if he was traded at that point

Exactly. It was a total hypothetical. If Heatley is in the lineup with Kovalev and Leclaire stays healthy... I would actually put us right there with Boston in our division. With the weak schedual Ottawa has as to start the year it is 100% possible that an Ottawa Senators team with Heatley in the lineup could rip it up the first 15-20 games.

Sens19 wrote:And i personally would be enraged if he was traded at that point

I personally would be enraged if I turned into Justin Timberlake today, only to find out the Jessica Biel dumps me tomorrow. For Christ sakes they have been dating for 4 years, why dump him/me now?

I don't expect a response to my question either. Some queries don't warrant ripostes.

As you can see I don't live my life in a hypothetical state. I deal with realism, hence my signature and every post I have made for the week since I found this great site.

Sens19 wrote:There's nothing wrong with what Neely said. It's not that long of a stretch that we finish first in division and even if it is I don't think that was the point of the whole assumption. And i personally would be enraged if he was traded at that point

While that's certainly in the realm of the possible, I don't think it is probable. We would need major, major improvement from the back end to get past Boston. Maybe in 2-3 years when Kuba isn't our top defenseman. Nothing against the guy, but he's not going to be making $7M per season in this league, and we need one or two of those guys (not saying two defensemen making $14M between them, but two defensemen who will eventually, at some point make $14M between them).

I did not consider the possibility of Ottawa being 1st (I actually thought Neely meant 1st overall but whatever) when I said I'd be doing some celebrating.

But even then, while the team would certainly suffer short-term, we need Heatley gone long-term. If the best deal comes up at the worst possible time, what do you do? Maybe the team will play even better without Heatley (not scoring more, but playing better as a team). Maybe we get some scoring *with* grit in return. Maybe others step up to fill the void.

A lot of maybes, for sure, but since I still am pretty confident we are a couple of years from contending, we are only talking about, maybe, one extra playoff round.

wprager wrote:

Sens19 wrote:There's nothing wrong with what Neely said. It's not that long of a stretch that we finish first in division and even if it is I don't think that was the point of the whole assumption. And i personally would be enraged if he was traded at that point

While that's certainly in the realm of the possible, I don't think it is probable. We would need major, major improvement from the back end to get past Boston. Maybe in 2-3 years when Kuba isn't our top defenseman. Nothing against the guy, but he's not going to be making $7M per season in this league, and we need one or two of those guys (not saying two defensemen making $14M between them, but two defensemen who will eventually, at some point make $14M between them).

I did not consider the possibility of Ottawa being 1st (I actually thought Neely meant 1st overall but whatever) when I said I'd be doing some celebrating.

But even then, while the team would certainly suffer short-term, we need Heatley gone long-term. If the best deal comes up at the worst possible time, what do you do? Maybe the team will play even better without Heatley (not scoring more, but playing better as a team). Maybe we get some scoring *with* grit in return. Maybe others step up to fill the void.

A lot of maybes, for sure, but since I still am pretty confident we are a couple of years from contending, we are only talking about, maybe, one extra playoff round.

It's not like I want Heatley to stay. I want him gone NOW. What I don't want is him playing great and then us getting fleeced in a deal halfway through a "hypothetically'" great season. And I agree, anything can happen in a deal. Maybe we do get better but the odds are unless we get a star of equal caliber in return we probably won't be better off. I still think a deal now would be better and I'm a little more optimistic about the team's progress than you are

Kuba will never be a #1 defenseman, Karlsson has a better chance to be that in 2-3 years over him which is why I was excited to see Burns and maybe even Boyle (minus giving away Volchie) come here.

Anyways, if Heatley tears it up and everything goes well in OTtawa, we are contenders etc. he won't waive his NTC with 20 games remaining.

wprager wrote:

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:I dunno, I think I'd celebrate, whatever deal we get, whenever we get it. It may be a quick little celebration, followed by weveral weeks of depression, but I'll get my licks in first.

Agreed...again, I don't understand the logic behind thinking his value will increase mid-season. Honestly, GMs are thinking the same as us. They know with the olympics are coming up and Heatley wants a spot. They know what they've heard in the media, same as us. They know he's a great sniper with the potential to knotch 50 goals in a season. These things aren't going to change mid-way through the season. And teams being more willing to take him on because his salary will be less? What, so they can be stuck in the same spot as us right now, -1 year? Honestly, I'd be happy with a Dubinsky +prospects and picks trade at this point.

Some teams are in a situation where contracts are coming off the books next year, so affording his $7.5M is not a problem for the remaining 4 years. But this season they only have $4M in cap space, perhaps. So they can't afford him now (without moving contracts) but will have the cap space in March.

Not saying it will happen, but that there are situations that will make it possible for a team to take on Heatley in March, but not in October.

Okay, that's a valid point. I just don't think when it comes to Heatley's value, these teams that now have the ability to bring him on are going to be offering more than what is being offered now...not much more anyway. The issues are all the same. But, you're right, it becomes feasible for some teams where it just isn't at this point.

FireOnIce wrote:

Sens19 wrote:And i personally would be enraged if he was traded at that point

I personally would be enraged if I turned into Justin Timberlake today, only to find out the Jessica Biel dumps me tomorrow. For Christ sakes they have been dating for 4 years, why dump him/me now?

I don't expect a response to my question either. Some queries don't warrant ripostes.

As you can see I don't live my life in a hypothetical state. I deal with realism, hence my signature and every post I have made for the week since I found this great site.

Don't you think throwing out all hypothetical sitations with what may or may not happen in regards to Heatley is pretty far from being a realist? You seem bent on Heatley coming back to play for Ottawa this year without considering any of the many possible outcomes.

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:I dunno, I think I'd celebrate, whatever deal we get, whenever we get it. It may be a quick little celebration, followed by weveral weeks of depression, but I'll get my licks in first.

Agreed...again, I don't understand the logic behind thinking his value will increase mid-season. Honestly, GMs are thinking the same as us. They know with the olympics are coming up and Heatley wants a spot. They know what they've heard in the media, same as us. They know he's a great sniper with the potential to knotch 50 goals in a season. These things aren't going to change mid-way through the season. And teams being more willing to take him on because his salary will be less? What, so they can be stuck in the same spot as us right now, -1 year? Honestly, I'd be happy with a Dubinsky +prospects and picks trade at this point.

Some teams are in a situation where contracts are coming off the books next year, so affording his $7.5M is not a problem for the remaining 4 years. But this season they only have $4M in cap space, perhaps. So they can't afford him now (without moving contracts) but will have the cap space in March.

Not saying it will happen, but that there are situations that will make it possible for a team to take on Heatley in March, but not in October.

Okay, that's a valid point. I just don't think when it comes to Heatley's value, these teams that now have the ability to bring him on are going to be offering more than what is being offered now...not much more anyway. The issues are all the same. But, you're right, it becomes feasible for some teams where it just isn't at this point.

Teams do crazy things nearing the deadline with the Stanley Cup playoffs approaching and their mouths salivating at the thoughts of the Cup.

Many many outlandish trades have been made over the years.

FireOnIce wrote:

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:I dunno, I think I'd celebrate, whatever deal we get, whenever we get it. It may be a quick little celebration, followed by weveral weeks of depression, but I'll get my licks in first.

Agreed...again, I don't understand the logic behind thinking his value will increase mid-season. Honestly, GMs are thinking the same as us. They know with the olympics are coming up and Heatley wants a spot. They know what they've heard in the media, same as us. They know he's a great sniper with the potential to knotch 50 goals in a season. These things aren't going to change mid-way through the season. And teams being more willing to take him on because his salary will be less? What, so they can be stuck in the same spot as us right now, -1 year? Honestly, I'd be happy with a Dubinsky +prospects and picks trade at this point.

Some teams are in a situation where contracts are coming off the books next year, so affording his $7.5M is not a problem for the remaining 4 years. But this season they only have $4M in cap space, perhaps. So they can't afford him now (without moving contracts) but will have the cap space in March.

Not saying it will happen, but that there are situations that will make it possible for a team to take on Heatley in March, but not in October.

Okay, that's a valid point. I just don't think when it comes to Heatley's value, these teams that now have the ability to bring him on are going to be offering more than what is being offered now...not much more anyway. The issues are all the same. But, you're right, it becomes feasible for some teams where it just isn't at this point.

Teams do crazy things nearing the deadline with the Stanley Cup playoffs approaching and their mouths salivating at the thoughts of the Cup.

Many many outlandish trades have been made over the years.

Okay but you didn't address my question. Don't you think, as GM of our team, Murray should be concerned about the effect Heatley is going to have on our team? A negative impact on the players that want to be here is just one of many outcomes that could come from Heatley not being traded. It just seems like you've thought of Heatley, Kovalev and the rest playing together and how glorious it could be (and you're right, it could be) and closed your eyes to any other potential ramifications.

If Heatley does have a good year he will be worth as much in June and he would in March, probably more considering last years trade deadline. How many big deal were there again? How many 1st rounders and prospects changed teams?

Everyone knows Heatley is available now and teams are far more prepared and aware to make adjustments throughout the entire year.

So many things can happen with Heatley and The Sens, its impossible to put them all out there.

That's a point I definitely support. If he's tearing it up here, we can wait until summer (unless a deal comes around that's ridiculous).

If he's not tearing it up...we have a real problem here. That money needs to spent elsewhere. If he sucks badly and we can't move him next summer, we're in a world of hurt.

But then again...that applies to every team and their high priced talent. Issue at work here is that Heatley wants out - and at this point we want him out- but we won't deal for garbage.

Ridiculous scenario. Unreal actually. :^^^^:

Vandelay wrote:

FireOnIce wrote:

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:

Vandelay wrote:

wprager wrote:I dunno, I think I'd celebrate, whatever deal we get, whenever we get it. It may be a quick little celebration, followed by weveral weeks of depression, but I'll get my licks in first.

Agreed...again, I don't understand the logic behind thinking his value will increase mid-season. Honestly, GMs are thinking the same as us. They know with the olympics are coming up and Heatley wants a spot. They know what they've heard in the media, same as us. They know he's a great sniper with the potential to knotch 50 goals in a season. These things aren't going to change mid-way through the season. And teams being more willing to take him on because his salary will be less? What, so they can be stuck in the same spot as us right now, -1 year? Honestly, I'd be happy with a Dubinsky +prospects and picks trade at this point.

Some teams are in a situation where contracts are coming off the books next year, so affording his $7.5M is not a problem for the remaining 4 years. But this season they only have $4M in cap space, perhaps. So they can't afford him now (without moving contracts) but will have the cap space in March.

Not saying it will happen, but that there are situations that will make it possible for a team to take on Heatley in March, but not in October.

Okay, that's a valid point. I just don't think when it comes to Heatley's value, these teams that now have the ability to bring him on are going to be offering more than what is being offered now...not much more anyway. The issues are all the same. But, you're right, it becomes feasible for some teams where it just isn't at this point.

Teams do crazy things nearing the deadline with the Stanley Cup playoffs approaching and their mouths salivating at the thoughts of the Cup.

Many many outlandish trades have been made over the years.

Okay but you didn't address my question. Don't you think, as GM of our team, Murray should be concerned about the effect Heatley is going to have on our team? A negative impact on the players that want to be here is just one of many outcomes that could come from Heatley not being traded. It just seems like you've thought of Heatley, Kovalev and the rest playing together and how glorious it could be (and you're right, it could be) and closed your eyes to any other potential ramifications.

Heatley will not have a negative influence on any of our young guys as Alfie, Phillips, Fisher, Smith, Donovan, maybe even Volchenkov and surprisingly enough maybe even Spezza would not let that happen.