Chris Neil re-signs with the Sens per TSN

shabbs wrote:

davetherave wrote:But skillwise, aren't there less expensive and more effective alternatives?

I don't think so, and certainly not in the Sens' pipeline just yet. Don't get me wrong, I like Neil - I'm a big fan of him, his role and what he does, I'm glad he has a roster spot as I don't think the Sens have anyone that can "do" what Neil does just yet. I just don't like the money that was spent on him, but I see BM was put in a tough space with the Rangers and Leafs in the hunt for Neil and I understand BM's reason for keeping him.

We're what... almost $2M over the cap and we still haven't signed Elliott... so something's gotta give, especially if we don't move Heatley.

I thought we were $2M over *before* moving Auld. We're still $2M over but with money for Elliott.

Smith will be either moved or off the playing roster, so that puts us $600K under. Not enough for injury callups, but enough to start the season.

Well, nhlscap.com is showing us as 1.9 over without Auld.... and no deal for Elliott.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=OTT

Yeh we need to get rid of Smith Schubert and possibly Kelly or Ruutu to be under the cap comfortbly and we still have to sign Elliot.

shabbs wrote:Well, nhlscap.com is showing us as 1.9 over without Auld.... and no deal for Elliott.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=OTT

I don't understand what they're doing at Cap Central. They have O'Brien and Zubov on there (1.7 ish), but no Regin.

Plus they don't include the 700K buyout of Alfredsson. Numbers there are all wrong.

http://www.nhlnumbers.com/overview.php?team=OTT&season=0910

Much better. They include the Alfredsson buyout in his contract, they have 14 forwards, so Schubert has to go, Regin in, and tie up some loose ends (Elliott) and we're on our way.

shabbs wrote:Well, nhlscap.com is showing us as 1.9 over without Auld.... and no deal for Elliott.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=OTT

To be fair, NHLSCAP.com also has us icing 16 forwards, including Zubov ($850K), O'Brien ($846K), and Bass ($513K), who are long-shots to make the roster, and who combined make up for $2.21 mil of the salary listed there.

If you plug in a 21-man roster at CapGeek.com (12 F, 7 D, and 2 goalies), assuming Elliott gets about the same amount and excluding most guys on ELCs (Regin, Lee), the Sens are actually just $50K (no typo) over the cap.

2009-2010 Ottawa Senators

FORWARDS
Dany Heatley $7,500,000
Jason Spezza $7,000,000
Alexei Kovalev $5,000,000
Daniel Alfredsson $4,875,000
Mike Fisher $4,200,000
Chris Kelly $2,125,000
Chris Neil $2,000,000
Jarkko Ruutu $1,300,000
Nick Foligno $850,000
Shean Donovan $625,000
Ryan Shannon $600,000
Jesse Winchester $550,000

DEFENSEMEN
Filip Kuba $3,700,000
Chris Phillips $3,500,000
Jason Smith $2,600,000
Anton Volchenkov $2,500,000
Christoph Schubert $883,333
Alexandre Picard $800,000
Chris Campoli $633,333

GOALTENDERS
Pascal Leclaire $3,800,000
* Brian Elliott $942,000

BUYOUTS
Ray Emery $229,167
Daniel Alfredsson $700,000

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS

ROSTER SIZE 21
SALARY CAP $56,800,000
PAYROLL $56,912,833
BONUSES $65,000
CAP SPACE $-47,833

Is that the team I really want to ice (with no Regin, Lee, Karlsson)? No, not really. But all you need is, for instance, someone to pick up Schubert off of waivers (i.e., for nothing), and you can ice that team if you want.

Probably a little early in the off-season to be worrying about these things, tho', especially with the Heatley thing still hanging over head. Look for the picture to get clearer after that gets sorted out.

shabbs wrote:Well, nhlscap.com is showing us as 1.9 over without Auld.... and no deal for Elliott.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=OTT

yes it says we are 1.9 over with auld gone but it also has 16 forwards and 7 defense and i can guarentee that once we ice the team there wont be 16 forwards in the lineup

i just took off 3 players (zubov o'brien and Bass) and were are no longer negative but have 250K cap space i know thats not a lot but that is with 13 F 7D 1G move smith and you have almost 3M more than enough for elliot not to mention if we move heatley

Hockeyhero22000 wrote:i just took off 3 players (zubov o'brien and Bass) and were are no longer negative but have 250K cap space i know thats not a lot but that is with 13 F 7D 1G move smith and you have almost 3M more than enough for elliot not to mention if we move heatley

Did you add 700K for Alfredsson's buy out (his salary should be 5.4 million I believe), did you add Regin's 700K as well? Or are you not playing him?

Nice breakdown Dr. Poo. And I agree, we'll worry more about this the closer we get to the start of the season. Moving Heatley will probably make it all work out.

SpezDispenser wrote:

Hockeyhero22000 wrote:i just took off 3 players (zubov o'brien and Bass) and were are no longer negative but have 250K cap space i know thats not a lot but that is with 13 F 7D 1G move smith and you have almost 3M more than enough for elliot not to mention if we move heatley

Did you add 700K for Alfredsson's buy out (his salary should be 5.4 million I believe), did you add Regin's 700K as well? Or are you not playing him?

no i missed alfies buyout and i never noticed that cap central doesnt have regin playing but if you put him in another player will come out and thats assuming we got with 13 forwards

SpezDispenser wrote:http://www.nhlnumbers.com/overview.php?team=OTT&season=0910

Much better. They include the Alfredsson buyout in his contract, they have 14 forwards, so Schubert has to go, Regin in, and tie up some loose ends (Elliott) and we're on our way.

Actually, NHLnumbers is getting Alfie's cap hit wrong, too.

I remember the specifics now. That $2.1 mil "buyout" for the last 3 option years on Alfie's last deal only apply to the 1st 3 years of this new 4-year deal, and that means that Alfie's cap hit is one number for the 1st 3 years of the deal, and another number for the last (4th) year of the deal.

So, you subtract the "buyout figure" ($2.1 mil, total) from the total ($21.6 mil) and add up all the other amounts he gets paid for each of the 4 years of the deal ($7 mil, $7 mil, $4.5 mil, $1 mil = $19.5 mil), divide that figure by four and you get a base figure of $4.875. Then, you take the $2.1 mil buyout figure, divide it by 3 (the number of years the buyout is for), and add $700K to the base total ($4.875) but ONLY for first 3 years of Alfie's contract.

That leads to 2 cap hits for Alfie:

2009-10, 2010-11, and 2011-12: $5.575 mil
2012-13: $4.875 mil

And those are the real numbers that we should be throwing around when talking about Alfie's cap hit. Neither site has it right -- only CapGeek does.

EDIT: Scratch that last comment. CapGeek USED to show Alfie's cap hit in the 'bonus' section, but they don't show it anywhere anymore. That site is still coming into its own, tho', and working through kinks.

I thought when they "bought" out his deal that they had to make it such that his salary was one cap hit that didn't change for the life of the contract.

I realize he had the last remaining contract with option years in it which was signed before the Cap came in but how does the CBA allow two seperate cap hits for one contract that was signed during the CBA.

His other contract was signed before the CBA came in so that explains the option years but not the 2 seperate cap hits on a contract signed during the new CBA.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I thought when they "bought" out his deal that they had to make it such that his salary was one cap hit that didn't change for the life of the contract.

I realize he had the last remaining contract with option years in it which was signed before the Cap came in but how does the CBA allow two seperate cap hits for one contract that was signed during the CBA.

His other contract was signed before the CBA came in so that explains the option years but not the 2 seperate cap hits on a contract signed during the new CBA.

Since the $2.1 mil "buyout" of Alfie's option years under the previous contract only applied to the first 3 years of the new 4-year deal, the league ruled that that buyout amount should factor into the cap hit for only those 3 years that were being bought out.

Hence, the two different cap hits. I remember this vividly because Alfie's is the only deal in the NHL I"m aware of that has two different cap hits at two different stages of the contract. His cap hit is $5.575 mil for the next three years, and $4.875 for the 4th year, and not $5.4 mil as nhlnumbers.com is suggesting.

rooneypoo wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I thought when they "bought" out his deal that they had to make it such that his salary was one cap hit that didn't change for the life of the contract.

I realize he had the last remaining contract with option years in it which was signed before the Cap came in but how does the CBA allow two seperate cap hits for one contract that was signed during the CBA.

His other contract was signed before the CBA came in so that explains the option years but not the 2 seperate cap hits on a contract signed during the new CBA.

Since the $2.1 mil "buyout" of Alfie's option years under the previous contract only applied to the first 3 years of the new 4-year deal, the league ruled that that buyout amount should factor into the cap hit for only those 3 years that were being bought out.

Hence, the two different cap hits. I remember this vividly because Alfie's is the only deal in the NHL I"m aware of that has two different cap hits at two different stages of the contract. His cap hit is $5.575 mil for the next three years, and $4.875 for the 4th year, and not $5.4 mil as nhlnumbers.com is suggesting.

He was also the only one with option years after the new CBA. The Sens had to hold off on announcing his resigning because both the NHLPA and NHL had to work together to ensure all loop holes were closed.

Tom Kostopoulos was signed by the Canes for $2.76 over three years. That's $700K this season, $950K the next, and 7-figures finally in year three, at $1.1M. He scored 8 goals and added 15 assists last year. Just sayin'

wprager wrote:Tom Kostopoulos was signed by the Canes for $2.76 over three years. That's $700K this season, $950K the next, and 7-figures finally in year three, at $1.1M. He scored 8 goals and added 15 assists last year. Just sayin'

WTF is Bob Gainey thinking? Kosto at this price is an absolute steal.

marakh wrote:

wprager wrote:Tom Kostopoulos was signed by the Canes for $2.76 over three years. That's $700K this season, $950K the next, and 7-figures finally in year three, at $1.1M. He scored 8 goals and added 15 assists last year. Just sayin'

WTF is Bob Gainey thinking? Kosto at this price is an absolute steal.

Don't sweat it...Bob's got it all covered. Two words for you: Hal. Gill.