House Cleaning in Ottawa? NEW and IMPROVED

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I just got a free third Jersey from the Sens for being involved in a focus group. For all those conspiracy theorist out there; the Jersey has his name and number but no C on the front. Hmmmm...

Focus group?!? Do tell!

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I just got a free third Jersey from the Sens for being involved in a focus group. For all those conspiracy theorist out there; the Jersey has his name and number but no C on the front. Hmmmm...

They should use the "C" they stiffed you for and use it to spell "Cheap bastards".

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I just got a free third Jersey from the Sens for being involved in a focus group. For all those conspiracy theorist out there; the Jersey has his name and number but no C on the front. Hmmmm...

No "C" on the front?!?!

Seriously, they can't strip Alfie of his C... He frankin' EARNED it...

Ok. Alfi can be a puppet "C". Give Smith the "A" and the puppet controls. I'd buy Smith the biggest, pointiest cowboy boots I could find, with steel toe no less....

Number Twenty Nine wrote:Ok. Alfi can be a puppet "C". Give Smith the "A" and the puppet controls. I'd buy Smith the biggest, pointiest cowboy boots I could find, with steel toe no less....

That's more the ticket. Alfie will always be the captain of this team, however, he leads by example. So you need someone who can get the A and lead with actions and yelling. Not Puss 'n Boots Chris Phillips. I thought Heatley would be a cool alternate captain. Wrong.

Jason Smith and Mike Fisher would be good. Even Volchenkov. Even if his English isn't perfect, you don't need good speech to smash a guy into a locker and tell him to play with more heart.

504Heater wrote:

Number Twenty Nine wrote:Ok. Alfi can be a puppet "C". Give Smith the "A" and the puppet controls. I'd buy Smith the biggest, pointiest cowboy boots I could find, with steel toe no less....

That's more the ticket. Alfie will always be the captain of this team, however, he leads by example. So you need someone who can get the A and lead with actions and yelling. Not Puss 'n Boots Chris Phillips. I thought Heatley would be a cool alternate captain. Wrong.

Jason Smith and Mike Fisher would be good. Even Volchenkov. Even if his English isn't perfect, you don't need good speech to smash a guy into a locker and tell him to play with more heart.

THANK YOU!! Finally, another agreeing point.
Fisher, apparently, is quiet, but he plays with heart so his ACTIONS could do the talking, much like you suggested with A-Train. Smith knows how to be a leader, so strip Dany "look at me I suck and still make $7M" Heatley of his A and give it to someone who won't just yell and throw a hissy but who can actually rally his troops.

As for Big Rig, I like him, but he seems to be in a serious funk of sorts too.

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Number Twenty Nine wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:Stevie Y is a good fit. There is no-one else I would choose. Especially not Nicholson and even more not Messier. If Stevie wants the jobs take it for some respect in the room. Other than that Murray has not been the problem in my books. He won the Tampa trade outright. He got us character players to start the year. The room is just poison. That falls on leadership of the team. Phillips has been piss poor and he is one I would like to see go. Alfie is worn down I think but he has been horrible lately. And Heatly is wearing an 'A' and he has been awful.

Perhaps the cheapest solution, give Smith an 'A' and give Neil or Donovan an 'A'. Strip the other two jokers. I would even think of relieving Alfie of the 'C'.

finally someone agrees with me....

Make that two people. I wouldn't strip Alfredsson of the C quite yet...It may be a Modano situation further down the line, but we don't have a suitable replacement for him.
Stripping Phillips is one possibility, but making Heatley an A was the most ridiculous move I've ever seen. Heatley can be as loud as he wants to be; he will never be the leader he fooled Hartsburg into thinking he was. Stripping him of the A is the least that should be done.

Madano was the captain for like 2 years, not a decade. If the Sens strip the C from Alfi, thats the day I become a Bruins fan again and just stop caring about anything Ottawa. Alfi is the captain, plain and simple.

He is still the MVP of this team, and even last night he was the one who created those 2 goals. Started both plays and Spezza finished them.

My point was that Modano had been with the team for his whole career, had been made captain, later stripped of the Captaincy, but still remained with the team in a diminished role.
Obviously the timelines are different, but if his play continues to decline in this way, it isn't out of the question. He is a shadow of his former self.
And the first goal can barely be "started" by anything...really the only thing that started that goal was dumb luck.
The second goal was an outlet from Heatley. Alfredsson "started" it but he hardly created it. Giving credit to Alfredsson is ridiculous.

He hasn't been anywhere near the player he should be and our record has been affected by it. He hasn't single-handedly lifted this team on his shoulders once this season. That used to be his thing ...

cash wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Number Twenty Nine wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:Stevie Y is a good fit. There is no-one else I would choose. Especially not Nicholson and even more not Messier. If Stevie wants the jobs take it for some respect in the room. Other than that Murray has not been the problem in my books. He won the Tampa trade outright. He got us character players to start the year. The room is just poison. That falls on leadership of the team. Phillips has been piss poor and he is one I would like to see go. Alfie is worn down I think but he has been horrible lately. And Heatly is wearing an 'A' and he has been awful.

Perhaps the cheapest solution, give Smith an 'A' and give Neil or Donovan an 'A'. Strip the other two jokers. I would even think of relieving Alfie of the 'C'.

finally someone agrees with me....

Make that two people. I wouldn't strip Alfredsson of the C quite yet...It may be a Modano situation further down the line, but we don't have a suitable replacement for him.
Stripping Phillips is one possibility, but making Heatley an A was the most ridiculous move I've ever seen. Heatley can be as loud as he wants to be; he will never be the leader he fooled Hartsburg into thinking he was. Stripping him of the A is the least that should be done.

Madano was the captain for like 2 years, not a decade. If the Sens strip the C from Alfi, thats the day I become a Bruins fan again and just stop caring about anything Ottawa. Alfi is the captain, plain and simple.

He is still the MVP of this team, and even last night he was the one who created those 2 goals. Started both plays and Spezza finished them.

My point was that Modano had been with the team for his whole career, had been made captain, later stripped of the Captaincy, but still remained with the team in a diminished role.
Obviously the timelines are different, but if his play continues to decline in this way, it isn't out of the question. He is a shadow of his former self.
And the first goal can barely be "started" by anything...really the only thing that started that goal was dumb luck.
The second goal was an outlet from Heatley. Alfredsson "started" it but he hardly created it. Giving credit to Alfredsson is ridiculous.

He hasn't been anywhere near the player he should be and our record has been affected by it. He hasn't single-handedly lifted this team on his shoulders once this season. That used to be his thing ...

He is Diddle 35 years old, his best days are behind him, and like it or not, has still been this teams best player most nights. What do you expect from a 35 year old, to get better? Put up more points?

Lets strip Sakic, Iginla, Yzerman, Brindamour. Its the same thing! It never happend, never would happen, never will happen. There is more to being a cpatain than just points, just like there is more to being an elite player than just points.

Some people dont get that I guess.

I'm one to blame players. At least in most cases. Most of the time, coaches are blamed, unfairly, while players get chastised a bit, but nothing much occurs to them. However, I believe in this case, it is Hartsburg that needs to be blamed.

Not one of our players has played well under him. Vermette, a 50 point guy, is on pace for less than half of that this year. Fisher is on pace for a little more than half of what he had last year. Spezza, Alfie, and Heater, all career pt/g players, are all under that honor this year. Alfie looks sluggish, Philly looks sluggish. Our young players all look like they belong in the AHL. While once i would have blamed the players, in my opinion, the blame rests on the coach.

His system does not work with this team. He cannot motivate the players. Sens games have become painful to watch. Most of us have even started the Hedman/Tavares watch. How does a team go from being consistently one of the top scoring teams in the league to being the lowest scoring team in the league. That's not due to the players.

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Number Twenty Nine wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:Stevie Y is a good fit. There is no-one else I would choose. Especially not Nicholson and even more not Messier. If Stevie wants the jobs take it for some respect in the room. Other than that Murray has not been the problem in my books. He won the Tampa trade outright. He got us character players to start the year. The room is just poison. That falls on leadership of the team. Phillips has been piss poor and he is one I would like to see go. Alfie is worn down I think but he has been horrible lately. And Heatly is wearing an 'A' and he has been awful.

Perhaps the cheapest solution, give Smith an 'A' and give Neil or Donovan an 'A'. Strip the other two jokers. I would even think of relieving Alfie of the 'C'.

finally someone agrees with me....

Make that two people. I wouldn't strip Alfredsson of the C quite yet...It may be a Modano situation further down the line, but we don't have a suitable replacement for him.
Stripping Phillips is one possibility, but making Heatley an A was the most ridiculous move I've ever seen. Heatley can be as loud as he wants to be; he will never be the leader he fooled Hartsburg into thinking he was. Stripping him of the A is the least that should be done.

Madano was the captain for like 2 years, not a decade. If the Sens strip the C from Alfi, thats the day I become a Bruins fan again and just stop caring about anything Ottawa. Alfi is the captain, plain and simple.

He is still the MVP of this team, and even last night he was the one who created those 2 goals. Started both plays and Spezza finished them.

My point was that Modano had been with the team for his whole career, had been made captain, later stripped of the Captaincy, but still remained with the team in a diminished role.
Obviously the timelines are different, but if his play continues to decline in this way, it isn't out of the question. He is a shadow of his former self.
And the first goal can barely be "started" by anything...really the only thing that started that goal was dumb luck.
The second goal was an outlet from Heatley. Alfredsson "started" it but he hardly created it. Giving credit to Alfredsson is ridiculous.

He hasn't been anywhere near the player he should be and our record has been affected by it. He hasn't single-handedly lifted this team on his shoulders once this season. That used to be his thing ...

He is Diddle 35 years old, his best days are behind him, and like it or not, has still been this teams best player most nights. What do you expect from a 35 year old, to get better? Put up more points?

Lets strip Sakic, Iginla, Yzerman, Brindamour. Its the same thing! It never happend, never would happen, never will happen. There is more to being a cpatain than just points, just like there is more to being an elite player than just points.

Some people dont get that I guess.

I think Alfie has been great for the franchise and personally like him a lot. Stripping him of the 'C' is a last resort. That said, captains are in place to lead. Leading a team means when the team does not put forth enough effort, you correct that, when the team is fragile you make them braver, when the game is on the line you impose your will on the game and be a difference maker.... All the guys you mention do that at 35 today or did that when they were. This last calendar year Alfie has been unable to do that, plain and simple. This team is desparate so something has to be done. Philly and Heater are not leaders, strip them and maybe you turn things around. It is at least a shake up.

Bass Destruction (dirtyno wrote:I'm one to blame players. At least in most cases. Most of the time, coaches are blamed, unfairly, while players get chastised a bit, but nothing much occurs to them. However, I believe in this case, it is Hartsburg that needs to be blamed.

Not one of our players has played well under him. Vermette, a 50 point guy, is on pace for less than half of that this year. Fisher is on pace for a little more than half of what he had last year. Spezza, Alfie, and Heater, all career pt/g players, are all under that honor this year. Alfie looks sluggish, Philly looks sluggish. Our young players all look like they belong in the AHL. While once i would have blamed the players, in my opinion, the blame rests on the coach.

His system does not work with this team. He cannot motivate the players. Sens games have become painful to watch. Most of us have even started the Hedman/Tavares watch. How does a team go from being consistently one of the top scoring teams in the league to being the lowest scoring team in the league. That's not due to the players.

I would be behind the Quinn experiment but I am not sure that Melnyk wants to pay another guy to NOT coach his hockey club. Murray would be in real trouble if two coaches not behind the bench were collecting cheques on his watch.

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Number Twenty Nine wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:Stevie Y is a good fit. There is no-one else I would choose. Especially not Nicholson and even more not Messier. If Stevie wants the jobs take it for some respect in the room. Other than that Murray has not been the problem in my books. He won the Tampa trade outright. He got us character players to start the year. The room is just poison. That falls on leadership of the team. Phillips has been piss poor and he is one I would like to see go. Alfie is worn down I think but he has been horrible lately. And Heatly is wearing an 'A' and he has been awful.

Perhaps the cheapest solution, give Smith an 'A' and give Neil or Donovan an 'A'. Strip the other two jokers. I would even think of relieving Alfie of the 'C'.

finally someone agrees with me....

Make that two people. I wouldn't strip Alfredsson of the C quite yet...It may be a Modano situation further down the line, but we don't have a suitable replacement for him.
Stripping Phillips is one possibility, but making Heatley an A was the most ridiculous move I've ever seen. Heatley can be as loud as he wants to be; he will never be the leader he fooled Hartsburg into thinking he was. Stripping him of the A is the least that should be done.

Madano was the captain for like 2 years, not a decade. If the Sens strip the C from Alfi, thats the day I become a Bruins fan again and just stop caring about anything Ottawa. Alfi is the captain, plain and simple.

He is still the MVP of this team, and even last night he was the one who created those 2 goals. Started both plays and Spezza finished them.

My point was that Modano had been with the team for his whole career, had been made captain, later stripped of the Captaincy, but still remained with the team in a diminished role.
Obviously the timelines are different, but if his play continues to decline in this way, it isn't out of the question. He is a shadow of his former self.
And the first goal can barely be "started" by anything...really the only thing that started that goal was dumb luck.
The second goal was an outlet from Heatley. Alfredsson "started" it but he hardly created it. Giving credit to Alfredsson is ridiculous.

He hasn't been anywhere near the player he should be and our record has been affected by it. He hasn't single-handedly lifted this team on his shoulders once this season. That used to be his thing ...

He is Diddle 35 years old, his best days are behind him, and like it or not, has still been this teams best player most nights. What do you expect from a 35 year old, to get better? Put up more points?

Lets strip Sakic, Iginla, Yzerman, Brindamour. Its the same thing! It never happend, never would happen, never will happen. There is more to being a cpatain than just points, just like there is more to being an elite player than just points.

Some people dont get that I guess.

lmao you're arrogance is amusing.

This Captain made the single greatest mistake in franchise history at the end of the 2nd period in game 4 of the SCF. He spent all of game 5 trying to make up for it.
This Captain has never truly shown the ability to lead, nor the judgment necessary to be considered a true leader:
-We have not experienced any of the success necessary to accurately and reasonably compare him to Sakic or Yzerman.
-LMFAO @ your Brind'Amour reference because his timeline as Captain is identical to Modano's without being stripped.
-Iginla is a far more reasonable comparison, given the fact that he too has won nothing.
This Captain IS 35 years old, but has NOT been this teams best player on most nights this season, as you claim. He truly, truly has not...
His decision making has been suspect, his turnovers have increased tenfold, his point-production is down, his team is in the crapper: His leadership abilities are in question; and rightly so.

Bass Destruction (dirtyno wrote:I'm one to blame players. At least in most cases. Most of the time, coaches are blamed, unfairly, while players get chastised a bit, but nothing much occurs to them. However, I believe in this case, it is Hartsburg that needs to be blamed.

Not one of our players has played well under him. Vermette, a 50 point guy, is on pace for less than half of that this year. Fisher is on pace for a little more than half of what he had last year. Spezza, Alfie, and Heater, all career pt/g players, are all under that honor this year. Alfie looks sluggish, Philly looks sluggish. Our young players all look like they belong in the AHL. While once i would have blamed the players, in my opinion, the blame rests on the coach.

His system does not work with this team. He cannot motivate the players. Sens games have become painful to watch. Most of us have even started the Hedman/Tavares watch. How does a team go from being consistently one of the top scoring teams in the league to being the lowest scoring team in the league. That's not due to the players.

I wouldn't disagree, but he is doing the best that he can with the players available to him. He has to compensate for his sub-par goaltending and poor D-corps.

cash wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

cash wrote:

Number Twenty Nine wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:Stevie Y is a good fit. There is no-one else I would choose. Especially not Nicholson and even more not Messier. If Stevie wants the jobs take it for some respect in the room. Other than that Murray has not been the problem in my books. He won the Tampa trade outright. He got us character players to start the year. The room is just poison. That falls on leadership of the team. Phillips has been piss poor and he is one I would like to see go. Alfie is worn down I think but he has been horrible lately. And Heatly is wearing an 'A' and he has been awful.

Perhaps the cheapest solution, give Smith an 'A' and give Neil or Donovan an 'A'. Strip the other two jokers. I would even think of relieving Alfie of the 'C'.

finally someone agrees with me....

Make that two people. I wouldn't strip Alfredsson of the C quite yet...It may be a Modano situation further down the line, but we don't have a suitable replacement for him.
Stripping Phillips is one possibility, but making Heatley an A was the most ridiculous move I've ever seen. Heatley can be as loud as he wants to be; he will never be the leader he fooled Hartsburg into thinking he was. Stripping him of the A is the least that should be done.

Madano was the captain for like 2 years, not a decade. If the Sens strip the C from Alfi, thats the day I become a Bruins fan again and just stop caring about anything Ottawa. Alfi is the captain, plain and simple.

He is still the MVP of this team, and even last night he was the one who created those 2 goals. Started both plays and Spezza finished them.

My point was that Modano had been with the team for his whole career, had been made captain, later stripped of the Captaincy, but still remained with the team in a diminished role.
Obviously the timelines are different, but if his play continues to decline in this way, it isn't out of the question. He is a shadow of his former self.
And the first goal can barely be "started" by anything...really the only thing that started that goal was dumb luck.
The second goal was an outlet from Heatley. Alfredsson "started" it but he hardly created it. Giving credit to Alfredsson is ridiculous.

He hasn't been anywhere near the player he should be and our record has been affected by it. He hasn't single-handedly lifted this team on his shoulders once this season. That used to be his thing ...

He is Diddle 35 years old, his best days are behind him, and like it or not, has still been this teams best player most nights. What do you expect from a 35 year old, to get better? Put up more points?

Lets strip Sakic, Iginla, Yzerman, Brindamour. Its the same thing! It never happend, never would happen, never will happen. There is more to being a cpatain than just points, just like there is more to being an elite player than just points.

Some people dont get that I guess.

lmao you're arrogance is amusing.

This Captain made the single greatest mistake in franchise history at the end of the 2nd period in game 4 of the SCF. He spent all of game 5 trying to make up for it.
This Captain has never truly shown the ability to lead, nor the judgment necessary to be considered a true leader:
-We have not experienced any of the success necessary to accurately and reasonably compare him to Sakic or Yzerman.
-LMFAO @ your Brind'Amour reference because his timeline as Captain is identical to Modano's without being stripped.
-Iginla is a far more reasonable comparison, given the fact that he too has won nothing.
This Captain IS 35 years old, but has NOT been this teams best player on most nights this season, as you claim. He truly, truly has not...
His decision making has been suspect, his turnovers have increased tenfold, his point-production is down, his team is in the crapper: His leadership abilities are in question; and rightly so.

You actually have no clue, none. You really have no idea what you are talking about, and should probably stop talking. I can basically poke holes and tear down everything you said there, but it would be 2 pages long.

Stop talking,

Neely4Life wrote:You actually have no clue, none. You really have no idea what you are talking about, and should probably stop talking. I can basically poke holes and tear down everything you said there, but it would be 2 pages long.

Stop talking,

I'm not usually a fan of having discussions with you
Scratch that: I'm not a fan of having discussions with you, but I would like to see this supposed tear down. You can leave out the inevitable defence of the Aflie-Niedermayer situation because you're simply too stubborn and hard-headed to bother arguing the point with.
What I'm interested in is how you plan on justifying an Yzerman comparison and how you plan on further glorifying his play from this season?

cash wrote:This Captain made the single greatest mistake in franchise history at the end of the 2nd period in game 4 of the SCF. He spent all of game 5 trying to make up for it.
This Captain has never truly shown the ability to lead, nor the judgment necessary to be considered a true leader:
-We have not experienced any of the success necessary to accurately and reasonably compare him to Sakic or Yzerman.
-LMFAO @ your Brind'Amour reference because his timeline as Captain is identical to Modano's without being stripped.
-Iginla is a far more reasonable comparison, given the fact that he too has won nothing.
This Captain IS 35 years old, but has NOT been this teams best player on most nights this season, as you claim. He truly, truly has not...
His decision making has been suspect, his turnovers have increased tenfold, his point-production is down, his team is in the crapper: His leadership abilities are in question; and rightly so.

Hogwash! I can't believe we're back to the "throw alfie off the train talk". It's unbelievable.

TheAvatar wrote:

cash wrote:This Captain made the single greatest mistake in franchise history at the end of the 2nd period in game 4 of the SCF. He spent all of game 5 trying to make up for it.
This Captain has never truly shown the ability to lead, nor the judgment necessary to be considered a true leader:
-We have not experienced any of the success necessary to accurately and reasonably compare him to Sakic or Yzerman.
-LMFAO @ your Brind'Amour reference because his timeline as Captain is identical to Modano's without being stripped.
-Iginla is a far more reasonable comparison, given the fact that he too has won nothing.
This Captain IS 35 years old, but has NOT been this teams best player on most nights this season, as you claim. He truly, truly has not...
His decision making has been suspect, his turnovers have increased tenfold, his point-production is down, his team is in the crapper: His leadership abilities are in question; and rightly so.

Hogwash! I can't believe we're back to the "throw alfie off the train talk". It's unbelievable.

Thank you. Well said Avatar. Alfie is one player that should be held to task, per se, but to throw him under the bus when he is ONE man on a team chalk-full of underachieving, money-counters?!?! C'mon!!

When the entire team slides, the captain is the first to take heat. He's trying a little too hard and he's coughing up the puck.

Stripping him of the C? Really? For whom?

No way, Alfie is captain until the day he retires and becomes our GM.

Now, stripping Phillips and Heatley of the As might be a step in the right direction. Lord knows the new coach will probably do that first thing.