What should Murray do?

smash88 wrote:
Especially too since that line has been a Hab-killer for the past few years..

They've been an every team killer. If we had some dude on the 2nd line capable on potting 40 that would be another story entirely, but sadly, we have 3 offensive guys - true offensive guys. They need to be playing together.

I'd rather lose by the other team shutting them down instead of losing because the other team focuses on Spezza and Heatley and hopes that Fisher will miss.

1.4 million. What is that number significant for? That's the amount of $$ that separates Chris Franking Kelly from Cory Stillman. Hmm. Who would I rather have....

I think I love Jam's idea posted above.

504Heater wrote:

smash88 wrote:
Especially too since that line has been a Hab-killer for the past few years..

They've been an every team killer. If we had some dude on the 2nd line capable on potting 40 that would be another story entirely, but sadly, we have 3 offensive guys - true offensive guys. They need to be playing together.

I'd rather lose by the other team shutting them down instead of losing because the other team focuses on Spezza and Heatley and hopes that Fisher will miss.

1.4 million. What is that number significant for? That's the amount of $$ that separates Chris Franking Kelly from Cory Stillman. Hmm. Who would I rather have....

and I thought I was the only one.... Chris Kelly too me is by far the most over rated player on the Senators...

In all fairness to Hartsburg, I am assuming he wants to see if this team REALLY is just a one-line team and wants to keep them seperated to see what pans out.

Now, after last night's debacle, and the one in Raleigh, I would say if Paddock's past failures haven't shown Hartsburg anything, he MUST see now that the experiment has failed; thus he should reunite the BIG three and possibly bring up Smith in the event Ruutu is handed a suspension, whether LONG or short.

I would think that right now, Kelly and Vermette should be a little afraid...

504Heater wrote:Put the franking top line together and never touch it again. What a wonderful dream world we live in to think we can split up these three guys and still win. It begins and ends with the top line.

The rest of the plugs (with the exception of Fisher) had better start playing for their jobs. Kelly and Vermette would open up 5 million dollars and can be replaced with a)a good to great puck mover or b)someone who can put the franking puck in the net.

Franking joke. Even pinhead Mguire was wondering what was wrong with Hartsburg - and how he couldn't see to put the top line together to start period 2. Everyone knew it...but Hartsburg.

Have to completely agree. The big three are the best line in hockey. Breaking them up has done nothing. So accept it and put the blame on the rest of the pork swords if they cannot produce. They are all getting paid well enough to produce. Make it so, or go...

Plus a true PMD is a hole I would like to fill but I am almost at the point where that hole is equal to a speedy top 6 forward. We need a secondary threat. We had it with Havlat and that made the second line something to fear. I am not suggesting we bring him back but a speed demon who can create instant offense would be nice.. like Afineganov (sp?) I would like that personally...

I was very upset last night, not so much that they lost, but that they were very competitive for the first couple of periods and then things unravelled quite quickly. I left several messages for my husband but he was scouting at an NHL game last night but he did send me this e-mail that I thought I would share with all of you.

Hey there,
Got your message(s), and I have to say it’s the first time I can ever remember you being that upset about a game. Normally you let it die shortly after it’s over but you seem to be taking it harder than normal this time. What I’m about to say may stir some strong feelings, which in part is why I’m writing it in an e-mail rather than calling as it’s likely saving my ear drums from your yelling.

Let me ask you a question and be honest. Do you think that Ottawa is an elite team in the NHL or even the Easter Conference right now? I don’t mean their play, but the team they have. Can you honestly say now looking back that they got to the Stanley Cup because of the team they had, or the team they had got on a roll and earned their way. Did they play to their level or play above it for a period of time leading up to the finals?

The answer to that question will go a long way to setting the proper expectations. My honest answer (coming from a slowly developing Senators fan), is no they are no longer an elite team. They once were however right now they are a good team which with the right system and work ethic can become a very good team. They are not at the same level as Montreal, not even close. Montreal has more team speed, better goaltending by far, and they do have a couple of players on the back end that can help get the puck out. The entire team for the most part plays the same style and very rarely do they get caught out of place and start to scramble. Ottawa has to learn how to get to that point all over again.

In my opinion Montreal is the class of the east with Kudos to the Rangers. Both teams have good defense, but excellent goaltending and forwards on multiple lines that can score. For years Ottawa was the team people feared and Montreal and Toronto fans had to sit and watch the “machine” roll through their cities dismantling their teams. Now it’s Ottawa’s turn to sit in amazement. That’s not to say that you can’t beat those other teams, but you have to accept the fact that for the next couple of years (until the next generation comes up) they will struggle at times, and just be happy that they make the playoffs. Setting the right expectation will go a long way to avoiding frustration.

Now with all that said, the future is bright. I routinely sit in meetings where I’m asked about minor league players and junior/college players from teams around the NHL. I can tell you that we’re not the only organization who recognizes that Ottawa has a lot of solid talent coming in the next year or two, and if what I hear is true, then other teams are trying to get that talent away from Ottawa for help right now. If I’m a fan like you, then I hope that my GM does nothing with that future talent, as that’s where your Cup dreams lay. Trading away that future for help right now isn’t going to do anything for this team other than give it a better chance to make the playoffs, but unless they get on an incredible roll I don’t believe they have a shot at the cup. I say that remembering how Edmonton, Carolina, Tampa were all teams who didn’t have a shot yet made it or won.

Hartsburg knows what he’s doing and Murray is a good GM. Things will work out, and plus the team wasn’t going to make the playoffs every year for the rest of its history. It’s likely better than they miss in draft years as talented as this and next anyways.

Have a good day and remember it’s still just a game.

I don't know what to do, but maybe it's time to just enjoy the game and not worry about the team.

Dawg's Wife wrote:I was very upset last night, not so much that they lost, but that they were very competitive for the first couple of periods and then things unravelled quite quickly. I left several messages for my husband but he was scouting at an NHL game last night but he did send me this e-mail that I thought I would share with all of you.


I don't know what to do, but maybe it's time to just enjoy the game and not worry about the team.

Thanks DW. I'm upset more so than I've been in a while and your husbands comments on our young guys is definitely uplifting.

jamvan wrote:Trade Vermette and Neil for Seabrook. Send down Foligno and call up Zubov. Finally sign Shanny, but do it now, cause he won't be in game shape. Put the top line back together and there you go.

THis team is simply not good enough and at this point I really don't see them making the playoffs. I'm so close to calling this a rebuilding year.

Done.
That is exactly what needs to happen.
Foligno has been dreadful for weeks and Vermette will never work on that 1st line (if he takes one more 40 shot from just inside the blueline, I'm going to f-ing lose it! He's playing like he thinks he's a goddam sniper :x )
I really like the idea of having our own "bash brothers" and I love seeing Ruutu and Neil run into players together, but Neil isn't doing much more than that to warrant a place on this team.
I'm still not sold that Shanny is the solution to the top-6, but he couldn't be worse than Vermette.

Seabrook's not going anywhere

TheAvatar wrote:Seabrook's not going anywhere

Not at that price anyway

Trade Everyone!! is never the solution... team's don't win cups by making panicky trades when the players are underperforming.

Fisher, Phillips, Spezza, Alfie, Heatley, Volchenkov, aren't going anywhere. NTCs aplenty for starters, and they were signed to be core players.

Players that are unlikely to be traded are Ruutu (low trade value, fitting in well), McAmmond (solid veteran presense, and wouldn't net much return), Donovan (same reason), Winchester (young player at a bargain basement price who is fitting in well, winning teams need these kinds of players), Smith (vet with a significant salary, I doubt he moves), Picard (recently acquired, and has shown signs of improvement, not untouchable, but unlikely to be flipped so quickly), Gerber (we're stuck with the guy).

So, the remaining players who quite possibly could be trade are:

Vermette - this guy has to have his head closest to the chopping block
Kelly - slightly overpaid, but brings intangibles. Not on the block per say, but if another team were interested, I'm sure he could be had.
Neil - pending UFA, and with Bass in the system, he may no longer have a place
Schubert - was disgruntled early in the season, but is maybe happy now that he's playing more regularly on D
Foligno - he's been ice cold. perhaps his promotion to the first line is a little showcasing?
Kuba - his trade value HAS to be high right now. if we can bring in a PMD, maybe this guy goes the other way. I don't see him as part of Ottawa's plans moving forwards.
Lee - in the minors for salary reasons, and he struggled early, but with Picard and Karlsson, perhaps management finds Lee expendable.

That said, I'm a HUGE fan of Lee and Foligno, and it would hurt to see them go. In fact, the only guy I'd want to see traded is Vermette, as he is clearly underperforming. I'm a fan of Neil (own his jersey), and Schubert as well. Don't read into my comments that I WANT any of these guys dealt.

I was trying to objectively predict who is most likely to go.

Guy I think is GONE in the first trade: Hennessy.

Well said Matt. And quite honestly, I think Vermette and Kelly OUGHT to be playing for their lives... I'm sure deep-down they realize they are becoming more and more the odd-men out...

Kelly's little neck is getting closer and closer to the trade block. Foligno won't be moved unless the return is significant (part of a Bow deal or for Ohlund).

504Heater wrote:Kelly's little neck is getting closer and closer to the trade block. Foligno won't be moved unless the return is significant (part of a Bow deal or for Ohlund).

We should be going for both Ohlund and Bouwmeester.

that might not be such a bad idea, depending on the asking price.

Completely depended on asking price.

[quote="Cap'n Clutch"]

rooneypoo wrote:

Last I heard he's doing OK. Not racking up a tonne of points but his plus minus is much better than last season. It's the Zubov, Shannon, Z. Smith and Bell show on Offense and the Elliot show in goal.

Actually Matt's Morning Mashup has some Bingo updates. You should have a look.

Oh, I've been reading Matt's stuff. I'm just wondering *specifically* how Lee is doing.

And looks like I was wrong about Foligno. A -3 on the night, and he moves from 4th to 1st line duties? I'm confused... I still say we ought to give one of the Bingo boys a shot.

Do you really think the Sens could get much for Vermette at the moment? I even doubt Florida would offer much.