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Flo The Action wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:If having Chris Neil on the 4th line somehow makes the team worse, I'd like to hear how, specifically.  He plays a super-simple style of game.  He hits guys, he goes straight to the net, he forechecks, and he backchecks.  He actually provides some veteran leadership, and will call guys out in the room.

I think people have this fantasy that one of our vaunted prospects will come in and produce a whole lot more than Neil on the 4th line. Some will say that it's a given because you'll be able to trust Neil's replacement with more minutes, thus increasing the likelihood of more production. Yet, those extra minutes will take away from someone else and likely their production resulting in a net benefit somewhere around Zero.

I'll take the leadership and pride of being a lifetime Senator over any of that 10 times out of 10. Let's improve the Top 9 before we start crying about a 4th line veteran wanting to end his career where it started.

See I totally disagree, it's not saying one of our prospects could do better but you have to break them in somewhere. Neil is on the decline, as anyone who could try for that position would be on the up. And are we really still looking at Neil for leadership? I think there's some in e room already and if they lack some they should be trying to add some that has a cup ring on their CV.

We've been breaking in our top prospect for almost 2 years now and the next one can be broken in in place of Chiasson and Michalek. Leave the rest in the minors until they're over-ripe and they can step in and make an impact in the Top 9. Like Hoffman and Stone, for instance.

And that Cup ring should be added at the deadline if we're in the playoff race. And they should be Top 6 forward or Top 4 D calibre, IMO.

Flo The Action wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:

wprager wrote:

Flo The Action wrote:I wonder now that it's looking more and more like the flames will miss the post season if Murray zeros in on Russell. I'm not sure if it would cost us that much and might be easier to resign.

Sens may be sellers themselves.  If they can find a buyer for Cowen Wier, Neil.

As per recent reports, we're trying to resign Chris Neil.

Exactly what I was going to say.

tim1_2 wrote:McCormick and Dizzy have been recalled to the big club.

Must be a negotiating tactic; contract talks with Neil's camp must be not going very well.

Flo The Action wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:If having Chris Neil on the 4th line somehow makes the team worse, I'd like to hear how, specifically.  He plays a super-simple style of game.  He hits guys, he goes straight to the net, he forechecks, and he backchecks.  He actually provides some veteran leadership, and will call guys out in the room.

I think people have this fantasy that one of our vaunted prospects will come in and produce a whole lot more than Neil on the 4th line. Some will say that it's a given because you'll be able to trust Neil's replacement with more minutes, thus increasing the likelihood of more production. Yet, those extra minutes will take away from someone else and likely their production resulting in a net benefit somewhere around Zero.

I'll take the leadership and pride of being a lifetime Senator over any of that 10 times out of 10. Let's improve the Top 9 before we start crying about a 4th line veteran wanting to end his career where it started.

See I totally disagree, it's not saying one of our prospects could do better but you have to break them in somewhere. Neil is on the decline, as anyone who could try for that position would be on the up. And are we really still looking at Neil for leadership? I think there's some in e room already and if they lack some they should be trying to add some that has a cup ring on their CV.

I think it's better to have high-potential prospects playing 18-20 minutes a night in the AHL than having them play 8-10 in the NHL with Zack Smith and Alex Chiasson as line mates.

Please tell me who's being held back currently by Neil being in the lineup?

SeawaySensFan wrote:

Flo The Action wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:If having Chris Neil on the 4th line somehow makes the team worse, I'd like to hear how, specifically.  He plays a super-simple style of game.  He hits guys, he goes straight to the net, he forechecks, and he backchecks.  He actually provides some veteran leadership, and will call guys out in the room.

I think people have this fantasy that one of our vaunted prospects will come in and produce a whole lot more than Neil on the 4th line. Some will say that it's a given because you'll be able to trust Neil's replacement with more minutes, thus increasing the likelihood of more production. Yet, those extra minutes will take away from someone else and likely their production resulting in a net benefit somewhere around Zero.

I'll take the leadership and pride of being a lifetime Senator over any of that 10 times out of 10. Let's improve the Top 9 before we start crying about a 4th line veteran wanting to end his career where it started.

See I totally disagree, it's not saying one of our prospects could do better but you have to break them in somewhere. Neil is on the decline, as anyone who could try for that position would be on the up. And are we really still looking at Neil for leadership? I think there's some in e room already and if they lack some they should be trying to add some that has a cup ring on their CV.

We've been breaking in our top prospect for almost 2 years now and the next one can be broken in in place of Chiasson and Michalek. Leave the rest in the minors until they're over-ripe and they can step in and make an impact in the Top 9. Like Hoffman and Stone, for instance.

And that Cup ring should be added at the deadline if we're in the playoff race. And they should be Top 6 forward or Top 4 D calibre, IMO.

I'm not sure we'll be adding much at the deadline unless we can trade out some salary.
I think the team has to go hard after Ladd in the offseason. Yes we might have to overpay on either term or money but we miss out on some great players in FA that could of helped put team. I screamed for Justin Williams this off season and he signed for pennies of what he was likely worth. We obviously have to adress the blueline and that might also end up happening through FA. Maybe Russell. As long as they find a way to move out or buy out greening and Cowen we should be able to make a tinny splash in FA.
As for the deadline I doubt we acquire anyone unless all that's going back is picks and prospects.

tim1_2 wrote:

Flo The Action wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:If having Chris Neil on the 4th line somehow makes the team worse, I'd like to hear how, specifically.  He plays a super-simple style of game.  He hits guys, he goes straight to the net, he forechecks, and he backchecks.  He actually provides some veteran leadership, and will call guys out in the room.

I think people have this fantasy that one of our vaunted prospects will come in and produce a whole lot more than Neil on the 4th line. Some will say that it's a given because you'll be able to trust Neil's replacement with more minutes, thus increasing the likelihood of more production. Yet, those extra minutes will take away from someone else and likely their production resulting in a net benefit somewhere around Zero.

I'll take the leadership and pride of being a lifetime Senator over any of that 10 times out of 10. Let's improve the Top 9 before we start crying about a 4th line veteran wanting to end his career where it started.

See I totally disagree, it's not saying one of our prospects could do better but you have to break them in somewhere. Neil is on the decline, as anyone who could try for that position would be on the up. And are we really still looking at Neil for leadership? I think there's some in e room already and if they lack some they should be trying to add some that has a cup ring on their CV.

I think it's better to have high-potential prospects playing 18-20 minutes a night in the AHL than having them play 8-10 in the NHL with Zack Smith and Alex Chiasson as line mates.

Please tell me who's being held back currently by Neil being in the lineup?

held back not so much but if this team wants to compete it might have to bring in a free agent in the top 6 pushing back a few players. I'd rather see a line of McCormick smith and Chiasson then Neil in there and have Prince/michalek, pageau lazar on the third line.

It's *because* we have a fourth line that is a so-called "energy line" and not a line of young players slowly being turned into full-time NHLers that we don't have any room for young guys to come up and grow in their roles.  A young guy like Prince, who is a sniper and not a banger, certainly needs some sheltered minutes but he also needs some like-minded linemates to help develop into a valuable third or even second liner.  Neil no-longer has the speed to keep up with the play and as fighting is no-longer happening on a nightly basis and half of his best hits of the past would now be 5+game+suspension his usefulness to the team has diminished greatly.

We have plenty of veterans on this team to provide leadership, we have gritty players, too.  As someone already said, if Neil wants to accept that he will be a healthy scratch on quite a few nights, then go ahead and extend him.  But not at $2M.

Next year we have Phillips' salary coming off the books and I'm still hoping that Greening and Cowen will be dealt with one way or another.  Same with Chiasson and Wiercioch, unless they can show *something* in the next 32 games to justify keeping them.  In addition to the players who have already "auditioned", like Prince, Puempel, McCormick, Claesson, we have Colin White, Englund and maybe even Chabot pushing for ice time next year.  We need roster room and budget space.

Post-all star Lazar is gonna be LIT. Who wants to bet me over/under 0.6 PPG the rest of the way? I take over.

Ev wrote:Post-all star Lazar is gonna be LIT. Who wants to bet me over/under 0.6 PPG the rest of the way? I take over.

I won't take the bet because I hope you're right. You have to be right. He needs to come out and explode.

Ev wrote:Post-all star Lazar is gonna be LIT. Who wants to bet me over/under 0.6 PPG the rest of the way? I take over.

I hate that you're so young. I wish I could still be 24 and stupid.

Kidding (except about being younger) but 0.5PPG would be a great achievement in itself, there's no way he's going over that.

Flo The Action wrote:

Ev wrote:Post-all star Lazar is gonna be LIT. Who wants to bet me over/under 0.6 PPG the rest of the way? I take over.

I won't take the bet because I hope you're right. You have to be right. He needs to come out and explode.

The only thing that will cause him to explode is eating too many burgers off the ground all at once.

Michallica wrote:

Ev wrote:Post-all star Lazar is gonna be LIT. Who wants to bet me over/under 0.6 PPG the rest of the way? I take over.

I hate that you're so young.  I wish I could still be 24 and stupid.

Kidding (except about being younger) but 0.5PPG would be a great achievement in itself, there's no way he's going over that.  

0.6 ppg would mean scoring 19 points the rest of the way to finish with 30 points in 77 games. Don't think that's too unreasonable as I had him pegged for 30.

wprager wrote:It's *because* we have a fourth line that is a so-called "energy line" and not a line of young players slowly being turned into full-time NHLers that we don't have any room for young guys to come up and grow in their roles.  A young guy like Prince, who is a sniper and not a banger, certainly needs some sheltered minutes but he also needs some like-minded linemates to help develop into a valuable third or even second liner.  Neil no-longer has the speed to keep up with the play and as fighting is no-longer happening on a nightly basis and half of his best hits of the past would now be 5+game+suspension his usefulness to the team has diminished greatly.

We have plenty of veterans on this team to provide leadership, we have gritty players, too.  As someone already said, if Neil wants to accept that he will be a healthy scratch on quite a few nights, then go ahead and extend him.  But not at $2M.

Next year we have Phillips' salary coming off the books and I'm still hoping that Greening and Cowen will be dealt with one way or another.  Same with Chiasson and Wiercioch, unless they can show *something* in the next 32 games to justify keeping them.  In addition to the players who have already "auditioned", like Prince, Puempel, McCormick, Claesson, we have Colin White, Englund and maybe even Chabot pushing for ice time next year.  We need roster room and budget space.

Couldn't agree more. I'd be okay trading Michalek too if a team were interested in him but I'd be just as happy keeping him. This is the ultimate budget team, but I'd be more content with this lineup than what we've been dressing this year. In the event that Mac is a no go- wouldn't Drouin look great on our top six? A lot of speed and potential at a nominal price...

Mac-Turris-Stone
Hoff-Zib-Ryan
Prince-Pageau-Lazar
Michalek-Smith-McCormick
Puempel/Dzingel

XXXX-Karlsson
Methot-Chabot
Boro-Ceci
Claesson/Wideman

You would 100% need to find a #1 d-man to play with Karlsson this off-season though. Hamhuis? Buff? Ehrhoff?

DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
Couldn't agree more. I'd be okay trading Michalek too if a team were interested in him but I'd be just as happy keeping him. This is the ultimate budget team, but I'd be more content with this lineup than what we've been dressing this year. In the event that Mac is a no go- wouldn't Drouin look great on our top six? A lot of speed and potential at a nominal price...

Mac-Turris-Stone
Hoff-Zib-Ryan
Prince-Pageau-Lazar
Michalek-Smith-McCormick
Puempel/Dzingel

XXXX-Karlsson
Methot-Chabot
Boro-Ceci
Claesson/Wideman

You would 100% need to find a #1 d-man to play with Karlsson this off-season though. Hamhuis? Buff? Ehrhoff?

Except Chabot is a leftie. And 19. There's no way I want him on the top pairing until he's had a couple seasons in the NHL (well, stranger things could happen). And getting a top-pairing leftie is a lot harder than just putting Methot with Karlsson and getting a second pairing lefties. Chabot can play on the third pairing alternating with Boro depending on the competition. If he does well, I think Chabot-Ceci has a lot of potential as a second pairing.

Chabot isn't making the team next year. No way. Way too young.

Flo The Action wrote:Chabot isn't making the team next year. No way. Way too young.

Lazar made the team. Why not Chabot? Throw White and Chlapstik in there too!

Ev wrote:

Michallica wrote:

Ev wrote:Post-all star Lazar is gonna be LIT. Who wants to bet me over/under 0.6 PPG the rest of the way? I take over.

I hate that you're so young.  I wish I could still be 24 and stupid.

Kidding (except about being younger) but 0.5PPG would be a great achievement in itself, there's no way he's going over that.  

0.6 ppg would mean scoring 19 points the rest of the way to finish with 30 points in 77 games. Don't think that's too unreasonable as I had him pegged for 30.

Well then, I'll take the under. What are the stakes?

SeawaySensFan wrote:

Flo The Action wrote:Chabot isn't making the team next year. No way. Way too young.

Lazar made the team. Why not Chabot? Throw White and Chlapstik in there too!

D-men take slightly longer to get there. His offencive ability look there but I would rather have him focus on developing the defensive aspects of his game for at least another year. I imagine you are being sarcastic when I compare your comments to how you felt we rushed Ceci ?