Ottawa Senators (present and past) TIDBITS & QUICK HITS!

wprager wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:

NEELY wrote:Also, how's the Spezza vs Turris battle going?  

Turris 9 goal, 18 assists, 27 points, -5 for 3.5 mil a season.
Spezza 6 goals, 21 assists, 27 points, -8, 7.5 mil a season.

Ottawa sure made a mistake getting rid of him.

Hey guys, does anyone know how NEELY feels about Spezza?  I'm unsure...he hasn't been clear on this most important matter.

Meh, whatever.  He'd be getting more points playing top line here.  We'd have more goals and our PP would not be 0 for 25.  We'd still be sitting 10th or 11th.

That's what you get for taking Legwand off the PP.

Before the trade lots of you were saying how the team will instantly be better. So the problems were rooted in the lazy Spezza. Addition by subtraction. Problem is on a roster of 22 players we had maybe a handful so we're not the problem and we changed up one. Plus Phillips and Michalek have become words Neil hasn't gotten any faster, Smith and Greening - so the hell knows. Goaltending of better, and they'd the only improvement over last year.

I thought we'd be a lot better personally.

SpezDispensed wrote:I thought we'd be a lot better personally.  

We're a bubble team.  BUBBALICIOUS.

I always thought we would be around that 7-10 spot, maybe 3rd in the division (which still could happen but not likely). What I didn't see coming was every single vet regressing (aside from Neil), I think a lot of people thought guys like Michalek, Phillips, and Smith would bounce back but anything but has happened. Greening you can kind of throw in there too.

Spezza was 100% the biggest issue and problem last year and getting him out of town was 100% the best thing for the franchise and if you look at what he's done in Dallas it's close to nothing. In Ottawa sure, they could use a PP specialist but you don't know they need one until you know meaning that the very specific hole Spezza left isn't going to be replaced right away and may have to be developed which people with some patients would rather have.

Not disagreeing with any of that, but it's not just the vets regressing (and I assume you primarily meant the offense). Overall team D is still a shambles (it's getting a little better under Cameron -- the number of shots allowed are clearly down). The opposition *always* blocks more shots than the Sens and more often than not, in their own zone, they are second on the puck. Is that effort, positioning or just low hockey IQ? I don't know, but I know it did not go away when Spezza left and this is what I was saying heading into and after the trade, and most here did not listen.

I'll see how the team progresses under Cameron. Early results are encouraging but while we are giving up fewer shots we also seem to have lost our offense. Powerplay is 0 for 25 over the last half dozen or so games and that's probably four points right there -- couple games we would have won if we'd scored a PP goal or two.

There's still a ton of work left and I don't think the true re-load will begin until the old core is completely gone (Phillips, Neil, Greening, Anderson).

wprager wrote:

There's still a ton of work left and I don't think the true re-load will begin until the old core is completely gone (Phillips, Neil, Greening, Anderson).

Those are some of our best players. Why do you think the team will improve after they're gone?

Methot is the only one of 8 D-men in their prime. Six are 25 or younger while one is easily beyond his prime. Same with the center ice position. This is horrible team management along with the team not getting quality production from its vets at those positions. We can see future potential but the team is still couple years away, once the younger players enter their prime.

wprager wrote:Not disagreeing with any of that, but it's not just the vets regressing (and I assume you primarily meant the offense).  Overall team D is still a shambles (it's getting a little better under Cameron -- the number of shots allowed are clearly down).  The opposition *always* blocks more shots than the Sens and more often than not, in their own zone, they are second on the puck.  Is that effort, positioning or just low hockey IQ?  I don't know, but I know it did not go away when Spezza left and this is what I was saying heading into and after the trade, and most here did not listen.

I'll see how the team progresses under Cameron.  Early results are encouraging but while we are giving up fewer shots we also seem to have lost our offense.  Powerplay is 0 for 25 over the last half dozen or so games and that's probably four points right there -- couple games we would have won if we'd scored a PP goal or two.

There's still a ton of work left and I don't think the true re-load will begin until the old core is completely gone (Phillips, Neil, Greening, Anderson).

Young D group, I believe it is the youngest in the NHL and that position takes the most time to work out and become extremely efficient as a group. Not even mentioning that Karlsson isn't even a full season into the captaincy and he needs at least a full season, maybe 2 or 3 to become comfortable enough to lead the team, do his job, and be the player most believe he can be. You see improvement from him and the ability to be coached which is huge, once again patients will need to be practiced.

There is still a ton of work left and tons to be excited about but until you see an obvious turn in the corner in Ottawa it will be same old for a while. Give it time, a season in the NHL isn't a ton.

Thing is I have no complaints about Ceci (sophomore) or Boro (except he shouldn't be playing top-pairing minutes at this stage) or Gryba as a 3rd pairing shut down guy. Karlsson is not *that* young and has won a Norris, so he should be considered almost like a vet. Wiercioch is not young, either. So it's not the young 'uns that are hurting this team.

wprager wrote:Thing is I have no complaints about Ceci (sophomore) or Boro (except he shouldn't be playing top-pairing minutes at this stage) or Gryba as a 3rd pairing shut down guy.  Karlsson is not *that* young and has won a Norris, so he should be considered almost like a vet.  Wiercioch is not young, either.  So it's not the young 'uns that are hurting this team.

They're not helping either.

Want to know how the team has done since the coaching switch?
http://the6thsens.com/2015-articles/cameron-versus-maclean-differences-in-the-numbers.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=cameron-versus-maclean-differences-in-the-numbers

Side by side before-after comparison of conventional and advanced stats, as well as TOI numbers. Quite revealing.

wprager wrote:Thing is I have no complaints about Ceci (sophomore) or Boro (except he shouldn't be playing top-pairing minutes at this stage) or Gryba as a 3rd pairing shut down guy.  Karlsson is not *that* young and has won a Norris, so he should be considered almost like a vet.  Wiercioch is not young, either.  So it's not the young 'uns that are hurting this team.

I'll give him more than 3 months as the captain to make any kind of judgement on his game let alone a coaching change and a culture change as well. In the same breath Karlsson is not hurting this team in the least despite some mistakes he may make. It takes years to become a solid, reliable #1 D man, it doesn't happen over night especially when you are the one expected to lead.

wprager wrote:Want to know how the team has done since the coaching switch?
http://the6thsens.com/2015-articles/cameron-versus-maclean-differences-in-the-numbers.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=cameron-versus-maclean-differences-in-the-numbers

Side by side before-after comparison of conventional and advanced stats, as well as TOI numbers.  Quite revealing.  

Those stats are interesting because they kind of tell a story. That story is everyone is starting to be given a specific role that they are supposed to play. Look at Gryba, SH mins way up, that's what they want him to be, ES mins about the same.

Karlsson, PP time is up but overall time is down so that means keeping him off the ice for the hard ES mins where he looks like he's dogging it (truth be told he could be burnt out).

Bobby Ryan is noticeable too, more ES ice time but a lot less PP time. This means he isn't being used a specialist and is being leaned on for heavy minutes which is exactly what you want from your highest paid player (going forward).

Say what you want about Melnyk's guy but he is looking like a much better choice than MacLean and the right players are playing the big minutes.

Some more interesting numbers. I took a look at the stats of the Sens centers to compare last year to this year. For last season they had Conacher and Grant listed as centers but I ignored their stats and went with just Spezza/Turris/Zibanejad/Smith/DaCosta/Pageau.

Goals per game went from 0.44 to 0.15 -- almost a 3x drop. Points per game went from 0.86 to 0.39 -- more than a 2x drop. Surely, though, with the improved goaltending the +/- will be better, right? Especially with Spezza gone. This year the centers are accumulating minuses at the rate of -0.12 per game, as compared to last year's 0.10 pace.

Way less offense down the middle. Scary bad. And the +/- is actually slightly worse, despite much better goalie performance.

Thing is, looking at the UFA centers that were signed in the off-season, if you ignore the high end guys (e.g. Stastny) who would never have signed here anyway, Legwand really was the best of the bunch. It's quite sad.

Forget about wingers, we need better production from our centers. And Lazar, even if he improves post-WJC, is not going to cut it. We need more from Zibanejad and Turris or we need someone else.

Wow, did not know this:

Slava Malamud ‏@SlavaMalamud 32m32 minutes ago

KHL's website pays a backhanded compliment to #Sens scouts, saying that there are more Ottawa draftees in the KHL than any other NHL team's.

And that does not include Filatov since he wasn't drafted by Ottawa.

wprager wrote:Wow, did not know this:

Slava Malamud ‏@SlavaMalamud 32m32 minutes ago

KHL's website pays a backhanded compliment to #Sens scouts, saying that there are more Ottawa draftees in the KHL than any other NHL team's.

And that does not include Filatov since he wasn't drafted by Ottawa.  

That's a solid endorsement of the Senatores right there. GO SENS GO!!!