Melnyk Speaks/Globe says Rebuild is coming

Ok, so, Melnyk was on PTS yesterday on Fan 590 and was tossing around the term "serious contender next year"... and today I read references from Murray about being a "contender" next year... what?

I was encourraged by the initial comments by Melnyk and Murray about staying the course, being active at the trade deadline, getting a high draft pick and bringing in youth next year etc... but to think we're going to be contenders, let alone "serious" contenders next season is way off the mark.

I know Melnyk doesn't want to scare season ticket holders away... but let's call a spade a spade here...

Murray just means the goal is to make the playoffs next year, which is what anyone would expect him to say. And anything goes in the post-season.

don't think it's possible to do a full rebuild post salary cap, you can't just trade away non-expiring contracts that easily and we're not going to "Wade Redden" anyone here either.

We've got a few expiring contracts, they may be able to trade away a few more. They'll be hopefully be replaced by our NHL ready prospects. Can't do much else barring a good trade offer coming along.

As I said in another thread Murray has way too much faith in this team, a new GM would be much more objective. Murray should have done more than just sign Gonchar this summer.

Heh, well, we can't have owners and GMs saying "We want to be mediocre next year... and then, we'll target the playoffs after that!!!!"

Making the playoffs are what every team says their target is every year to their fans. If they don't, then fans should question their commitment to the game, team etc...

Is it realistic? Who knows... we're certainly not Cup contenders... so I take exception to Melnyk's "serious contenders" comment, but I know why he's saying that.

New GM, new Coach, new system, new goalie(s), some fresh young players, no Leclaire, no Kovalev, no Clouston etc... lots of variables there that will have an impact.

At the very least, it should be interesting.

But if you ask Murray he should still be GM.

Seriously though the writing is on the wall. He's had a few years and he's had 3 coaches not including himself. He's failed in terms of on ice team success with one missed playoff year, one first round exit and this year.

Nice college signings, nice amateur drafting and nice job setting up the off season with plenty of money to spend but I want someone else spending that money personally.

shabbs wrote:Heh, well, we can't have owners and GMs saying "We want to be mediocre next year... and then, we'll target the playoffs after that!!!!"

Making the playoffs are what every team says their target is every year to their fans. If they don't, then fans should question their commitment to the game, team etc...

Is it realistic? Who knows... we're certainly not Cup contenders... so I take exception to Melnyk's "serious contenders" comment, but I know why he's saying that.

New GM, new Coach, new system, new goalie(s), some fresh young players, no Leclaire, no Kovalev, no Clouston etc... lots of variables there that will have an impact.

At the very least, it should be interesting.

More and more people are realizing that part of the big change that's coming is Leclaire, Kovalev, Phillips (probably), Kuba (hopefully) and Ruutu all leaving, giving the Sens some cap flexibility to go after a couple of solid top line wingers and an elite goalie. There's nothing more important than getting a proven NHL winner in net for the next 2-3 years and letting Lehner develop a bit more in the A.

Kovalev (5), Leclaire (3.8), Kuba (3.8), Phillips (3.75), Ruutu (1.2) are a TON of money coming off the books. That right there is a re-tooling, whether you buy UFAs or not.

True SpezD but from the sounds of it guys like Zack Smith, Bobby Butler and maybe even one of Greening, Condra, O'Brien could all be here next season along with Cowen and Rundblad. That's a lot of fresh faced rookies. Throw in whats his face college dude (forgot his name sorry) and that leave pretty much no room for anything but a goalie.

Does this look like a Playoff bound team to you?

Alfie - Spezza - Foligno
Michalek - Fisher - Butler
Zack Smith - Kelly - Winchester
O'Brien - Regin - Neil

Gonchar - Karlsson
Cowen - Rundblad
Carkner - Hale/Campoli/Gryba
Lee - Who we kidding we're stuck with him another year.

Elite Goalie? I hope so.
Elliott?

Murray is a great builder in terms of drafting and developing talent as well as college FAs, he's weak at all other things. Those are his strengths I guess.

Hoags wrote:Murray is a great builder in terms of drafting and developing talent as well as college FAs, he's weak at all other things. Those are his strengths I guess.

Precisely why I want him to stay on as an advisor to make sure the new GM doesn't gut the amateur scouting staff and the prospects and college signings continue to be a strong point of the organisation. Start getting some blue chip forwards though please.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:
Precisely why I want him to stay on as an advisor to make sure the new GM doesn't gut the amateur scouting staff and the prospects and college signings continue to be a strong point of the organisation. Start getting some blue chip forwards though please.

I want him to stick around in that capacity but I think his professional pride has been hurt and he wants to 'fix it', he may not like some other guy tinkering with his team.

He's been drafting defencemen, strangely we haven't been drafting goalies much at all. I believe they tried to get a forward last year but they were all gone by the time our turn came around.

Probably why he's been involved in SC winning teams but hasn't actually been the GM of a winning team.

I think the good he did outweighs the bad, don't think he did much long term damage, Kovalev and Leclaire weren't signed for long term.

Kovalev was kind of forced on us with Heatley leaving and I thought Leclaire was a good gamble to take at the time. Some moves just don't work out. Gonchar is a mystery to me as well but I think it's too soon to call. Not sure if you can blame him for Kuba's injuries and decline.

His coach hirings are bizarre and I'm not sure he really has a vision of what he wants this team to be considering the variety of coaches he hired.

Throw Dung at the wall and hope it sticks.

But we really need a GM to do what Holmgren has done in Philly, we also need a coach like Laviolette.

I don't think we're in a bad situation but it's really crucial the right moves are made starting at the deadline.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:True SpezD but from the sounds of it guys like Zack Smith, Bobby Butler and maybe even one of Greening, Condra, O'Brien could all be here next season along with Cowen and Rundblad. That's a lot of fresh faced rookies. Throw in whats his face college dude (forgot his name sorry) and that leave pretty much no room for anything but a goalie.

Does this look like a Playoff bound team to you?

Alfie - Spezza - Foligno
Michalek - Fisher - Butler
Zack Smith - Kelly - Winchester
O'Brien - Regin - Neil

Gonchar - Karlsson
Cowen - Rundblad
Carkner - Hale/Campoli/Gryba
Lee - Who we kidding we're stuck with him another year.

Elite Goalie? I hope so.
Elliott?

Where's my sniping winger in this equation?

SpezDispenser wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:True SpezD but from the sounds of it guys like Zack Smith, Bobby Butler and maybe even one of Greening, Condra, O'Brien could all be here next season along with Cowen and Rundblad. That's a lot of fresh faced rookies. Throw in whats his face college dude (forgot his name sorry) and that leave pretty much no room for anything but a goalie.

Does this look like a Playoff bound team to you?

Alfie - Spezza - Foligno
Michalek - Fisher - Butler
Zack Smith - Kelly - Winchester
O'Brien - Regin - Neil

Gonchar - Karlsson
Cowen - Rundblad
Carkner - Hale/Campoli/Gryba
Lee - Who we kidding we're stuck with him another year.

Elite Goalie? I hope so.
Elliott?

Where's my sniping winger in this equation?

Exactly. No room for him by the sounds of their plan to bring these guys up next season.

SpezDispenser wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:

Alfie - Spezza - Foligno
Michalek - Fisher - Butler
Zack Smith - Kelly - Winchester
O'Brien - Regin - Neil

Gonchar - Karlsson
Cowen - Rundblad
Carkner - Hale/Campoli/Gryba
Lee - Who we kidding we're stuck with him another year.

Elite Goalie? I hope so.
Elliott?

Where's my sniping winger in this equation?

Thoughts:

- we need Gonchar on the RIGHT (hopefully new coach gets this), gonchar and karlsson has not worked all year
- not sure about pairing 2 rookies together (cowen and rundblad)
- I'd move Butler on line #1 and move Alfie on line #2( dont think Alfie is a 1st line player - save his energy for the PP).
- Move Foligno on LW with Spezza or Fisher
- hopefully trade Fisher

Cap'n Clutch wrote:
Exactly. No room for him by the sounds of their plan to bring these guys up next season.

No, no. That simply cannot happen. I don't give a Dung if Greening, O'Brien, Condra are ready to play in the NHL, they can take another year in the A and be even *more* ready. If Murray and Melnyk want to re-tool, then they'll have to face some facts.

1.This team has no wingers capable of scoring consistently and we don't need one, we need two. If players need to be moved to accomplish it, then you do it, but you don't leave the team twisting in the wind offensively. The D is gonna be young and green enough without having the same offence, but...younger coming in. The support that's needed from two top line wingers are paramount, the only thing more important is...

2.An ELITE goalie, no Cussing around this time, Vokoun, Bryz, a trade for someone with pedigree, whatever has to be done, has to be done. Otherwise, we're a lottery team next year again with the youth on D.

Fill these 3 slots and slowly but surely we'll be looking to get back on track. Leave the 'kids' to do it all and we're dead.

Murray will be on HC @ Noon today... you can listen at fan590.com.

Hoags wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:

Alfie - Spezza - Foligno
Michalek - Fisher - Butler
Zack Smith - Kelly - Winchester
O'Brien - Regin - Neil

Gonchar - Karlsson
Cowen - Rundblad
Carkner - Hale/Campoli/Gryba
Lee - Who we kidding we're stuck with him another year.

Elite Goalie? I hope so.
Elliott?

Where's my sniping winger in this equation?

Thoughts:

- we need Gonchar on the RIGHT (hopefully new coach gets this), gonchar and karlsson has not worked all year
- not sure about pairing 2 rookies together (cowen and rundblad)
- I'd move Butler on line #1 and move Alfie on line #2( dont think Alfie is a 1st line player - save his energy for the PP).
- Move Foligno on LW with Spezza or Fisher
- hopefully trade Fisher

To be clear here: I hate that lineup I put up there but that roster, however configured, is implied by what has been said so far by Murray and Melnyk. I hope I'm wrong though and as SpezD mentioned; we fill the holes we need to fill with a couple reliable scoring wingers. Here's a line up I'd much prefer.

(Scoring winger through trade or FA) - Spezza - (Scoring winger through trade or FA)
Alfie - Fisher - Michalek
Foligno - Regin - Butler (With PP time?)
Zack Smith - Kelly - Neil

E. Karlsson - Phillips
Gonchar - FA/trade acquisition D of the shut down variety
Carkner - Rundblad (Second unit PP time)
Lee

True number one goalie
Elliott

^ God yes, that's 1000X better.

SpezDispenser wrote:^ God yes, that's 1000X better.

It sure as hell is but is it realistic? Is it part of the plan? It damn well better be if they actually believe they can build a cup contender in time for Alfie's swan song.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:^ God yes, that's 1000X better.

It sure as hell is but is it realistic? Is it part of the plan? It damn well better be if they actually believe they can build a cup contender in time for Alfie's swan song.

With ~20 million dollars to spend (wisely please!), then yes, it should be realistic. The question is: who and what do we have to give up?

I think it's time for a thread about forwards.