Sens Reality Check: YOU are the GM!

Neely4Life wrote:Not more anoying than Phillips or Redden, simply impossible. Or Lee.

You mentioned that you saw problems with Lee a week ago or so. Well, Lee has started to frustrate me the last few games. He's stopped skating and is starting to make poor decisions on the breakout. Those are supposed to be he's strengths and without them he is pretty much useless.

If a team asked for him in a trade (if the return was good) then I would probably deal him. We have a lot of defensemen in the fold now and could afford to do so now. Picard is another guy that could be an add in.

Urkie wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:Not more anoying than Phillips or Redden, simply impossible. Or Lee.

You mentioned that you saw problems with Lee a week ago or so. Well, Lee has started to frustrate me the last few games. He's stopped skating and is starting to make poor decisions on the breakout. Those are supposed to be he's strengths and without them he is pretty much useless.

If a team asked for him in a trade (if the return was good) then I would probably deal him. We have a lot of defensemen in the fold now and could afford to do so now. Picard is another guy that could be an add in.

Once E. Karlsson gets here Lee will be so useless he might as well be playing tennis.

I cant stand Lee, and like I said, he isnt good enough at what he does well to not do the other things needed to be successful. Lee is a 1st round bomb, not that it is his fault, he should have never been drafted 9th overall, so expectations on him were impossible to live up to for the most part. Blame the Sens.

Lee just isnt even close to good enough and Bell should def be getting that playing time, but I think they may be showcasing Lee right now. Picard is just awful as well.

Neely4Life wrote:Once E. Karlsson gets here Lee will be so useless he might as well be playing tennis.

I cant stand Lee, and like I said, he isnt good enough at what he does well to not do the other things needed to be successful. Lee is a 1st round bomb, not that it is his fault, he should have never been drafted 9th overall, so expectations on him were impossible to live up to for the most part. Blame the Sens.

Lee just isnt even close to good enough and Bell should def be getting that playing time, but I think they may be showcasing Lee right now. Picard is just awful as well.

I tend to agree. Lee has started to show that he has some serious holes in his game. Picard and Bell have some holes in their games as well though. Now with Campoli it makes 2 out of those 3 guys kind of expendable in the right kind of deal. I wouldn't be surprised if one of them is packaged in a deal at the trade deadline.

Karlsson won't be here for quite a while.

And it'll probably take even longer for him to make a real impact.

Lee is necessary for the transition period to Karlsson, and he's young enough that he can stick around during that.

asq2 wrote:Karlsson won't be here for quite a while.

And it'll probably take even longer for him to make a real impact.

Lee is necessary for the transition period to Karlsson, and he's young enough that he can stick around during that.

I would def say Lee is a plus until Karlsson gets here, but I dont think it is going to be as long as you believe. Karlsson may very well be here next year at some point, if not, 2010/11 for sure. Even at 170lbs he wont get pushed around like Lee because he is actually smaller and a little harder to catch, and he is also a lot more physical than Lee.

Again, I wouldnt be surprised to see him here next year if we sign the right guys to play here. I think Ohlund will be ideal.

Urkie wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:Once E. Karlsson gets here Lee will be so useless he might as well be playing tennis.

I cant stand Lee, and like I said, he isnt good enough at what he does well to not do the other things needed to be successful. Lee is a 1st round bomb, not that it is his fault, he should have never been drafted 9th overall, so expectations on him were impossible to live up to for the most part. Blame the Sens.

Lee just isnt even close to good enough and Bell should def be getting that playing time, but I think they may be showcasing Lee right now. Picard is just awful as well.

I tend to agree. Lee has started to show that he has some serious holes in his game. Picard and Bell have some holes in their games as well though. Now with Campoli it makes 2 out of those 3 guys kind of expendable in the right kind of deal. I wouldn't be surprised if one of them is packaged in a deal at the trade deadline.

I'll take Bell over Picard any day of the week, Picard is awful, awfu, awful.
Bell is also 1/3 of the cap hit that Lee is... Campolli on the 2nd pairing with Kuba is what it should be and Bell with Smith (who for the most part have looked like the best pair).

Im on the fence wiht Kuba in terms of what I think of him as a D, but having Lee as a partner is not helping him, but he should be gone in short time anyways.

Bell is def the best of that group of D. Hopefully they can keep him here to pay that 6, 7 role.

Neely4Life wrote:

asq2 wrote:Karlsson won't be here for quite a while.

And it'll probably take even longer for him to make a real impact.

Lee is necessary for the transition period to Karlsson, and he's young enough that he can stick around during that.

I would def say Lee is a plus until Karlsson gets here, but I dont think it is going to be as long as you believe. Karlsson may very well be here next year at some point, if not, 2010/11 for sure. Even at 170lbs he wont get pushed around like Lee because he is actually smaller and a little harder to catch, and he is also a lot more physical than Lee.

Again, I wouldnt be surprised to see him here next year if we sign the right guys to play here. I think Ohlund will be ideal.

In a recent article, he said he plans on staying in Sweden for one more year.

Karlsson would IMO seriously jeopardize his career by coming into the league at 170lbs. Especially as a defenceman.

Lee hasn't impressed me this season, but let's remember one thing: he's a rookie defenceman. Lee has less NHL experience than Luke Schenn or Drew Doughty.

His skating is already good, he's got a good frame, he's got good puck skills and a good pass. As he remains in the NHL, he'll get stronger, and he'll make better decisions.

Lee is 3 years older than those two, has playoff experience, and still looks worse now than they did in their first ten games... You're right that he'll only get better and stronger, but he'll probably never be all that good. There's no way he'll ever be a top-pairing D-man or a go-to guy Imo.


Neely, I agree with your D-pairings. Thats probably the best way to go.

cash wrote:Lee is 3 years older than those two, has playoff experience, and still looks worse now than they did in their first ten games... You're right that he'll only get better and stronger, but he'll probably never be all that good. There's no way he'll ever be a top-pairing D-man or a go-to guy Imo.


Neely, I agree with your D-pairings. Thats probably the best way to go.

I don't think that series was long enough or competitive enough for him to get an actual taste of play-off hockey.

Seriously, though, what are our biggest complaints about him? Poor decision-making at times and general weakness/softness.

Both can and will be improved over time. I certainly don't think he's our #1 going forward, but I'm not really interested in trading him unless it's in a package for a better, young defenceman.

asq2 wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

asq2 wrote:Karlsson won't be here for quite a while.

And it'll probably take even longer for him to make a real impact.

Lee is necessary for the transition period to Karlsson, and he's young enough that he can stick around during that.

I would def say Lee is a plus until Karlsson gets here, but I dont think it is going to be as long as you believe. Karlsson may very well be here next year at some point, if not, 2010/11 for sure. Even at 170lbs he wont get pushed around like Lee because he is actually smaller and a little harder to catch, and he is also a lot more physical than Lee.

Again, I wouldnt be surprised to see him here next year if we sign the right guys to play here. I think Ohlund will be ideal.

In a recent article, he said he plans on staying in Sweden for one more year.

Karlsson would IMO seriously jeopardize his career by coming into the league at 170lbs. Especially as a defenceman.

Lee hasn't impressed me this season, but let's remember one thing: he's a rookie defenceman. Lee has less NHL experience than Luke Schenn or Drew Doughty.

His skating is already good, he's got a good frame, he's got good puck skills and a good pass. As he remains in the NHL, he'll get stronger, and he'll make better decisions.

You can say Lee has less NHL experence than those 2, but he has been in the AHL and has also had way more time to develope into a certain type of player, and more pro expierence than both of them. People forget Lee struggled in the AHL this year as well as the NHL, that reflects pretty poorly on him. Bell getting the call before him this year after being sent down tells basically the whole story of Lee. Rookie or not, he shouldnt be in the NHL right now.

The 170 lbs is not as big of a deal IMO because of the game Karlsson plays. He may never tip the scales over 180-185, but that doesnt mean he will be any less effective. Over the next 6, 7 months before camp he will prob put on another 5-10lbs. He may very well stay another year, but again, it wouldnt surprise me if he was here at camp next year.

asq2 wrote:Karlsson won't be here for quite a while.

And it'll probably take even longer for him to make a real impact.

Lee is necessary for the transition period to Karlsson, and he's young enough that he can stick around during that.

Well, this we know. Phillips, Volchenkov and Campoli will be here for sure so that leaves a top 4 spot open. I'd say Murray will probably sign a UFA defensemen this summer to fill that role since I don't think Lee is ready to be a top 4 guy.

Play him there and see if he improves. If he doesn't then he becomes unnecessary as Karlsson and/or Wiercioch will push him out.

I know one thing though. Between Smith, Picard and Bell somebody is going to get traded. Maybe even all three as M. Karlsson can probably step in next year and do just as good.

asq2 wrote:

cash wrote:Lee is 3 years older than those two, has playoff experience, and still looks worse now than they did in their first ten games... You're right that he'll only get better and stronger, but he'll probably never be all that good. There's no way he'll ever be a top-pairing D-man or a go-to guy Imo.


Neely, I agree with your D-pairings. Thats probably the best way to go.

I don't think that series was long enough or competitive enough for him to get an actual taste of play-off hockey.

Seriously, though, what are our biggest complaints about him? Poor decision-making at times and general weakness/softness.

Both can and will be improved over time. I certainly don't think he's our #1 going forward, but I'm not really interested in trading him unless it's in a package for a better, young defenceman.

My biggest complaint is his work ethic and general attitude. He is of the same ilk as Spezza, babied all the way up to the NHL through high school and college, played on national jr teams with no real impact. Got his entry level deal, so on.

He got sent down this year and he and his agent were complaining to the Murray's about it. Bell got the call and he comaplianed. Tim Murray has gone on the Team 1200 and stated this. There are serious questions about everything in terms of Lee, not just the on ice play.

cash wrote:I can tell from watching him in the last game that Campoli is going to get on my (and probably all of your) nerves. He'll do some solid things for us in the point-production department, but on our side of the puck, we'll be glad we've got Smith and co...


If Kuba doesn't waive, I'm going to buy a ticket to every remaining home game and pelt him with random objects. It'll start with popcorn, then I'll throw a twix bar, then a pretzel with mustard, and I'll finish the season with a dead fish.

Awesome. Don't forget rocks with a picture of Wade Redden on it.

Urkie, the problem with playing Lee outside of the top-4 is that he has no chance of physically competing and maintaining against the aggressive, rough 3rd and 4th lines in the NHL. He gets manhandled and is utterly useless when put in those situations

Neely4Life wrote:

asq2 wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

asq2 wrote:Karlsson won't be here for quite a while.

And it'll probably take even longer for him to make a real impact.

Lee is necessary for the transition period to Karlsson, and he's young enough that he can stick around during that.

I would def say Lee is a plus until Karlsson gets here, but I dont think it is going to be as long as you believe. Karlsson may very well be here next year at some point, if not, 2010/11 for sure. Even at 170lbs he wont get pushed around like Lee because he is actually smaller and a little harder to catch, and he is also a lot more physical than Lee.

Again, I wouldnt be surprised to see him here next year if we sign the right guys to play here. I think Ohlund will be ideal.

In a recent article, he said he plans on staying in Sweden for one more year.

Karlsson would IMO seriously jeopardize his career by coming into the league at 170lbs. Especially as a defenceman.

Lee hasn't impressed me this season, but let's remember one thing: he's a rookie defenceman. Lee has less NHL experience than Luke Schenn or Drew Doughty.

His skating is already good, he's got a good frame, he's got good puck skills and a good pass. As he remains in the NHL, he'll get stronger, and he'll make better decisions.

You can say Lee has less NHL experence than those 2, but he has been in the AHL and has also had way more time to develope into a certain type of player, and more pro expierence than both of them. People forget Lee struggled in the AHL this year as well as the NHL, that reflects pretty poorly on him. Bell getting the call before him this year after being sent down tells basically the whole story of Lee. Rookie or not, he shouldnt be in the NHL right now.

The 170 lbs is not as big of a deal IMO because of the game Karlsson plays. He may never tip the scales over 180-185, but that doesnt mean he will be any less effective. Over the next 6, 7 months before camp he will prob put on another 5-10lbs. He may very well stay another year, but again, it wouldnt surprise me if he was here at camp next year.

One thing that you need to consider is whether or not Karlsson even wants to be a member of this team right now. Given the year we've had, he'll probably want us to get our act together before he commits himself to us and the NHL. I fully expect him to play another year or two in Sweden.

hemlock wrote:

cash wrote:I can tell from watching him in the last game that Campoli is going to get on my (and probably all of your) nerves. He'll do some solid things for us in the point-production department, but on our side of the puck, we'll be glad we've got Smith and co...


If Kuba doesn't waive, I'm going to buy a ticket to every remaining home game and pelt him with random objects. It'll start with popcorn, then I'll throw a twix bar, then a pretzel with mustard, and I'll finish the season with a dead fish.

Awesome. Don't forget rocks with a picture of Wade Redden on it.

No...I don't want him looking good in comparison to anything I throw at him...

cash wrote:Urkie, the problem with playing Lee outside of the top-4 is that he has no chance of physically competing and maintaining against the aggressive, rough 3rd and 4th lines in the NHL. He gets manhandled and is utterly useless when put in those situations.

He'll have to learn though. If he ever wants to become a top 4 defensemen then he'll have to be able to do it all. Make him work at it and try to overcome it. That's the only way he'll ever develop.

I honestly dont know what you can do with Lee. He is 100% a liability and makes the other teams 3rd and 4th lines legit threats to score, and he is totally outskilled on the 1st or 2nd pairings.

Again, Lee just isnt good enough to be an NHL player.

Neely4Life wrote:I honestly dont know what you can do with Lee. He is 100% a liability and makes the other teams 3rd and 4th lines legit threats to score, and he is totally outskilled on the 1st or 2nd pairings.

Again, Lee just isnt good enough to be an NHL player.

We'll see how Lee does from here to the rest of the season. If we don't see any kind of improvement then I guess Bell or unfortunately Picard might be a better option to put on the third pairing next season.