What does it take to get Nash?

Hoags wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:The thing that I find interesting is how quick most of us are to trade Zibanejad - even when it's for a player like Nash. I was told he'd be awesome.

If Murray really offered him then maybe they're not as high on him as we think they are. It's possible that Noesen will turn out to be the better player from that 1st round last year.

No, it's just a case of having to give to get. You offer Noesen instead and you get laughed at. Nobody wants to deal their top prospect.

Big Ev wrote:
No, it's just a case of having to give to get. You offer Noesen instead and you get laughed at. Nobody wants to deal their top prospect.

Yes but Murray has our prospects ranked in terms of value, I don't think he'd give up Silfverberg and Stone for example. My guess is he's OK with offering Zibanejad because he thinks Noesen(or someone else) will be just as good if not better. Trading Zibanejad is a loss and it will hurt but not as much.

Kind of like Rundblad, he was hyped to the moon here and yet Murray traded him because he felt it wasn't a big loss for us.

Would Murray have traded EK in the last few years ? No way, they knew what they had and they knew you don't trade a player like that.

Hoags wrote:

Big Ev wrote:
No, it's just a case of having to give to get. You offer Noesen instead and you get laughed at. Nobody wants to deal their top prospect.

Yes but Murray has our prospects ranked in terms of value, I don't think he'd give up Silfverberg and Stone for example. My guess is he's OK with offering Zibanejad because he thinks Noesen(or someone else) will be just as good if not better. Trading Zibanejad is a loss and it will hurt but not as much.

Kind of like Rundblad, he was hyped to the moon here and yet Murray traded him because he felt it wasn't a big loss for us.

Would Murray have traded EK in the last few years ? No way, they knew what they had and they knew you don't trade a player like that.

Stone would be traded ahead of Zibanejad. No doubt. They'd offer Zibanejad because they're getting Rick Nash. It's as simple as that. LA offers Schenn for Richards, Columbus trades Vorazcek for Carter, etc. Gotta give up good value to get a star player.

You're not trading Zibanejad because you like him less than other guys, you're trading him because you're getting a star player and the rest of our prospect pool is good.

Rundblad isn't the same as he was traded for a guy who was unproven and had much much less value than a star player like Nash.

Bobby Ryan is younger, cheaper and a right wing.

Rick Nash is 27, expensive and a left wing.

Isn't left wing a need in Ottawa?

Actually, Nash plays RW, but has played LW in the past. He can play both sides.

Riprock wrote:Actually, Nash plays RW, but has played LW in the past. He can play both sides.

He's a left handed shot so you'd think he'd play LW.

Spezza's a RH so pairing him with Nash on the left would work nicely. Heatley was a left shot as well and that combination was money.

Handedness has nothing to do with it. Ovechkin plays LW and is RH, and that is only one example.

Diddle I am getting pissed off hearing about Philly and NYR as the teams to beat out... why the Diddle do they need to get Nash? What the Diddle is Philly going to do? Trade their top 6 player JVR + a bunch of other stuff for another top 6? OR the Rangers the same thing?

How about let the Sens who actually need a top 6 get him? Seriously some people think it is too much to trade Lehner and Zibanejad, but where are the Flyer and Ranger fans saying not to trade JVR and Dubinsky/Erixon/Del Zotto/Kreider/etc etc etc

Diddle Dung Diddle Dung

IMO the Sens are the only team that will improve if they get Nash - for everyone else, they have to give up too much roster pieces because they either a) don't have good enough prospects, b) good enough pick, or c) cap room to absorb Nash's contract without a salary dump.

Philly and NY love to make the big splash and it's not working. They can load up with all the talent they want but they aren't going to win because they change so much. Philly should worry about Pronger's future and what it means to their cap situation, and fill out their D before adding another top 6 forward.

TSN talking about Rick Nash was hilarious tonight.

Dreger says Philadelphia is a dark horse for Nash. Why you ask ? Well Dreger says because Paul Holmgren loves making big deals Um Darren have you seen the Flyers cap situation ? they can't even resign their own guys.

When talking about the Sens, Dreger says it makes sense because we have the assets to pull it off. Rick Nash should love playing here and definitely should expand his list.

He still says the asking price is 2 roster players and 2 prospects. I say we forget about it.

Really sounds like Dreger is doing PR work for Howson.

There really is no reason for Nash to not want to come to Ottawa.

He'll be a star player but not THE star player - he'll have Alfie, Spezza, and Karlsson there taking some of that pressure off of him. He gets he benefit of playing in Canada. It's only 4 hrs from his hometown, and gets to play there 4 times a year. He will not be THE captain, so he doesn't have that added pressure.

You've got the longest serving Captain in NHL history, a 22 year old Norris winner, and a PPG center setting you up. You've got Bryan Murray running the show, and you have Adam's runner up Paul MacLean behind the bench.

It really depends on whether Howson likes our offer over others. The "2 roster players, 2 prospects" makes it sound like ours isn't enough. Dreger made it sound like Ottawa hasn't put in an offer yet .. but we should.

Dreger seemed to be almost begging Nash to add Ottawa to his list though, never seen TSN so pro-Sens like that. Seemed real odd. He said pretty much what you just wrote.

Maybe Howson likes our offer and is using the media to pressure Nash to waive for us ?

Riprock wrote:Diddle I am getting pissed off hearing about Philly and NYR as the teams to beat out... why the Diddle do they need to get Nash? What the Diddle is Philly going to do? Trade their top 6 player JVR + a bunch of other stuff for another top 6? OR the Rangers the same thing?

How about let the Sens who actually need a top 6 get him? Seriously some people think it is too much to trade Lehner and Zibanejad, but where are the Flyer and Ranger fans saying not to trade JVR and Dubinsky/Erixon/Del Zotto/Kreider/etc etc etc

Diddle Dung Diddle Dung

Philly and NYR should let the Sens get Nash because we need him more? Sorry man, but this sounds kind of whiney to me.

Riprock wrote:There really is no reason for Nash to not want to come to Ottawa.

He'll be a star player but not THE star player - he'll have Alfie, Spezza, and Karlsson there taking some of that pressure off of him. He gets he benefit of playing in Canada. It's only 4 hrs from his hometown, and gets to play there 4 times a year. He will not be THE captain, so he doesn't have that added pressure.

You've got the longest serving Captain in NHL history, a 22 year old Norris winner, and a PPG center setting you up. You've got Bryan Murray running the show, and you have Adam's runner up Paul MacLean behind the bench.

Longest serving captain CURRENTLY. Yzerman was the captain in Detroit longer than Alfie has been in the league.

Nash being willing to go to Ottawa is only one part of the equation. Murray has to put the assets up to make it happen.

spader wrote:

Riprock wrote:Diddle I am getting pissed off hearing about Philly and NYR as the teams to beat out... why the Diddle do they need to get Nash? What the Diddle is Philly going to do? Trade their top 6 player JVR + a bunch of other stuff for another top 6? OR the Rangers the same thing?

How about let the Sens who actually need a top 6 get him? Seriously some people think it is too much to trade Lehner and Zibanejad, but where are the Flyer and Ranger fans saying not to trade JVR and Dubinsky/Erixon/Del Zotto/Kreider/etc etc etc

Diddle Dung Diddle Dung

Philly and NYR should let the Sens get Nash because we need him more? Sorry man, but this sounds kind of whiney to me.

Heh, I guess. But it doesn't make sense for those teams to trade for him.

Riprock wrote:

spader wrote:

Riprock wrote:Diddle I am getting pissed off hearing about Philly and NYR as the teams to beat out... why the Diddle do they need to get Nash? What the Diddle is Philly going to do? Trade their top 6 player JVR + a bunch of other stuff for another top 6? OR the Rangers the same thing?

How about let the Sens who actually need a top 6 get him? Seriously some people think it is too much to trade Lehner and Zibanejad, but where are the Flyer and Ranger fans saying not to trade JVR and Dubinsky/Erixon/Del Zotto/Kreider/etc etc etc

Diddle Dung Diddle Dung

Philly and NYR should let the Sens get Nash because we need him more? Sorry man, but this sounds kind of whiney to me.

Heh, I guess. But it doesn't make sense for those teams to trade for him.

Personally, I don't think NYR are all that great offensively. After their top line, the scoring kinda drops off. If they can package up some assets (especially Dubinsky) and land Nash, why not?

Uhm, they had 3 20+ goal scorers (41, 29 & 25). They had 15 double digit scorers, four of which scored over 50 points.

Pretty sure they aren't hurting in that department.

Putting it into perspective, the Sens had three 20+ goal scorers (35, 34 & 27), and 4 players over 50 points, 1 of them Karlsson.

Sens had 16 double digits scorers though.

Riprock wrote:Uhm, they had 3 20+ goal scorers (41, 29 & 25). They had 15 double digit scorers, four of which scored over 50 points.

Pretty sure they aren't hurting in that department.

Putting it into perspective, the Sens had three 20+ goal scorers (35, 34 & 27), and 4 players over 50 points, 1 of them Karlsson.

Sens had 16 double digits scorers though.

Essentially their top line did the bulk of the scoring. They were 8th in the East in Goals for. We saw first hand against Ottawa that if you shut down Gaborik and Richards, that team could be beaten.

You're making my point for me. They need a Nash much more than say, Philly. You made it sound like they are Pittsburgh or something that have 5 25 goal guys in addition to Crosby, and getting Nash is quite unnecessary.

Point is, you specifically brought up the Flyers (I agree) and Rangers (I don't) as teams that don't really need a Nash type scorer. Please don't tell me that you honestly think that Rangers couldn't use another 40 goal guy (potentially).