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GM Hockey » Breaking Rumours!! » Member's Story breakers! » UPDATE: NHL investigating Hossa, Pronger contracts

UPDATE: NHL investigating Hossa, Pronger contracts

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SeawaySensFan
rooneypoo
PKC
The Silfer Server
Hockeyhero22000
davetherave
PTFlea
shabbs
wprager
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shabbs


Hall of Famer
Hall of Famer

Cool. Thanks for clearing that up. Nicely done.

I let the "rounding" go... as I'm sure you give me leeway with English...

Wink

rooneypoo


All-Star
All-Star

shabbs wrote:Cool. Thanks for clearing that up. Nicely done.

I let the "rounding" go... as I'm sure you give me leeway with English...

Wink

Thank you.

It's a pisser. Those last two figures ($17.376 mil and $17.46 mil) were supposed to come out identical -- which would have looked impressive and clinched the thing -- but my eyes were starting to hurt following the numbers.

That final figure is really neat, tho'. In the end, the precise amount of money that the team notionally saved in the years previous to the buyout HAS TO equal the amount of the combined cap hit for the years being bought out. Really nicely balanced there, I have to say.

shabbs


Hall of Famer
Hall of Famer

Don't you just love math? YES!!!! Smile

Riprock

Riprock
All-Star
All-Star

shabbs wrote:
Dash wrote:I think this is all complete Dung on the NHL's part. They shouldn't interfere with players decisions. It is the player's every right to sign a contract, with whomever he wants, wherever he wants, for as much or little as he wants and for as long or short as he wants. Do you think Hossa is upset? Chicago? Maybe the greedy agents and Buttman, but who gives a Dung what they want.
The point is that the NHL seems to have gotten wind that maybe the Hawks and Hossa had a conversation like this when they drew up the contract...

Hawks: "We really want you, but need to get your cap hit down."
Hossa: "How far down?"
Hawks: "We'll sign you to a 12-year deal to make the cap hit low..."
Hawks: "...but you need to retire after 8-years."
Hossa: "So that you can get the cap hit off the books after that right?"
Hawks: "Yeah."
Hossa: "What about my money?"
Hawks: "We'll front load this contract so huge the last four years will be tiny."
Hossa: "Let's do it."
Hawks: "Deal."

If it went down like that, then the NHL would certainly take issue.

Problem is that you cannot force someone to retire... it's all speculation as to what transpired in negotiations, but say that was the intended plan, Hossa's no guarantee to retire in 8 years, let alone 12 years... who knows how long he can play for. On the other side of the spectrum, he could retire next year for all we know.

shabbs

shabbs
Hall of Famer
Hall of Famer

It will be impossible to prove unless they have a conversation taped with them discussing the plans.

davetherave

davetherave
All-Star
All-Star

Bill Daly and Paul Kelly quoted in the Chicago Tribune on Friday...from the Tribune article:

In an e-mail to the Tribune on Friday, NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly confirmed the league is investigating but said it's too early to draw any conclusions.

"It would be grossly premature for anyone to leap to a conclusion that the Blackhawks engaged in any wrongdoing here," Daly wrote in the e-mail. "... When we receive contracts structured the way this one was, we have an obligation to investigate and to ensure its compliance with the CBA. We have talked to Blackhawk management and they are adamant that they complied fully with the terms of the CBA."

The league reportedly also is investigating the seven-year, $35 million contract extension 34-year-old defenseman Chris Pronger signed with the Philadelphia Flyers on July 7.

The National Hockey League Players' Association is not involved in the investigation, but NHLPA Director Paul Kelly said in an e-mail Friday that it will fight to allow players to sign such contracts.

"The NHLPA will take whatever steps are necessary to insure that players continue to have the unfettered ability to negotiate contracts that are compliant with existing CBA rules," Kelly wrote.

Full text here:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/hockey/blackhawks/chi-01-blackhawks-marian-hossa-aug01,0,1684598.story

Another conflict shaping up between the NHL and NHLPA?

Guest


Guest

I think it is a case of both sides doing their jobs. Nothing will come out of it unless there is hard evidence of wrong doing. In which case the investigation would be over already.

Guest


Guest

I would hope that this loophole will be closed by negotiating changes to the current CBA. If it is changed Detoit, Philly and Chicago won't be please at having 5M cap hits for 40 year olds.

Guest


Guest

Older contracts tend to get grandfathered anyways so I dont think they are too concerned.

shabbs

shabbs
Hall of Famer
Hall of Famer

Yeah, like Alfie's was. Contracts that are done before a new CBA is agreed to are grandfathered in.

Guest


Guest

Neely4Life wrote:Older contracts tend to get grandfathered anyways so I dont think they are too concerned.
Why would they need to be grandfathered in. If there was no intent to circumvent the cap they are obviously expecting the players to play to the end of the contract. Shrug

Guest


Guest

Im pretty sure it's law, but I stand to be corrected.

Guest


Guest

What I mean is that to close the loophole, they could say for any player that retires after 35 the cap hit remains and is lowered to account for the unpaid portion of the contact. for example:

Player signs contract for 10 years at age 30.
Contract calls for
Year 1 - 8M
Year 2 - 8M
Year 3 - 8M
Year 4 - 8M
Year 5 - 4M
Year 6 - 4M
Year 7 - 4M
Year 8 - 2M
Year 9 - 1M
Year 10 - 1M

Cap hit of 4.8M for each year.

Player retires after year 7 leaving 4M on the table. The team has already taken 33.6M cap hit over 7 years. 48M-4M = 44M.
Cap hit for remaining 3 years would be 10.4M divided by 3 years giving them a cap hit of just under 3.5M.

Guest


Guest

Ya, I dont know, I cant carry on a conversation too long about this kida stuff, dont know the ins and outs at all. I just watch and love the game, everything else is BS to me.

Guest


Guest

Fair enough, I love the money side of sports.

Guest


Guest

I hate it, it lessens the sport.

Guest


Guest

I tend to separate the two. During the season I could care less about the business side, but it keeps me interested during the offseason.

rooneypoo

rooneypoo
All-Star
All-Star

RobbyJ wrote:I tend to separate the two. During the season I could care less about the business side, but it keeps me interested during the offseason.

Me too.

I insist on trying to know as much as possible about the business and CBA stuff, especially during the off-season, because otherwise conversations on these kinds of sites often become worse than useless. You can't develop much of by way of useful conversation if it's not down with a eye towards understanding all the specific conditions under which the team operates. Trade proposal scenarios concocted without an eye to cap implications infuriate me in particular. They're worse than useless: they ask the team, and posters, to consider what is literally impossible.

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