Bryan Murray Vs Dany Heatley: Who Blinks First?

Guest wrote:

davetherave wrote:Well Hemlock, I see you are getting very sensitive about this.

Neither you, nor I, nor anyone else, knows what's going to happen.

And you are the one being presumptuous here to presume that I am being presumptuous...

Sensitive? No. I just don't care for your tone. I think there are more constructive ways to get your point across than saying something like "You don't have a clue" or "You don't know what you are talking about." Apparently, you either don't know this, or don't care. Either way...respect -1.

In the future though, I'll be better served knowing that you'll overreact when someone disagree with your lofty opinions. You know, things like the Atlanta situation, because clearly, you are the expert.

Go ahead, have the last word. You know you can't stop yourself anyway.

From what I understand of the word, Dave did not presume anything. He said (paraphrasing):

If you think that billionaires don't care about millions, then you don't know much about billionaires.

The old if-then construct. If the if-clause does not evaluate to true, then the else-clause is not executed.

rooneypoo wrote:

davetherave wrote:
Murray is watching the clock, too, because of the $4- million signing bonus that is due to Heatley on July 1.

What that will do is make Heatley's price tag higher after July 1, said one agent. If Murray has to pay the bonus, he'll be looking for more in return to compensate.

Under the collective bargaining agreement, teams can't trade cash, so Murray would be looking for an asset as compensation.

"Whatever Bryan asks for on June 30 is going to dramatically increase on July 2," said one agent.

What do you know... that's exactly what I said about the situation right after Booboo released his 'big scoop.' Another reason why that $4mil 'bonus' is not the big bogey man it's being made out to be.

Note, too, that the story clarifies a point brought up in an earlier thread about the CBA and whether or not team can trading cash. Nice to know!

Well, it's good to know that some journalists do read these boards.

By the way, what's this "Guest" thing? And why did Dave respond to one of the guest's posts as to Hemlock? What did I miss?

TheAvatar wrote:

rooneypoo wrote:
Note, too, that the story clarifies a point brought up in an earlier thread about the CBA and whether or not team can trading cash. Nice to know!

Is the story reliable tho? I couldn't find anything to that effect in the CBA (not that I'm an expert).

Given that it speaks facts corroborated by the fine posters here, I'd say it's reliable.

Also, it's The Citizen, versus The Sun. You can draw your own conclusions, but I'll just say that more people read The Sun for the Sunshine Girl and not for insightful journalism.

jamvan wrote:How about Heatley and Schubert for Perry, Tangradi and the 15th pick

Man, Perry would look great in a Sens Uni ... I`m not sure why Anaheim would take on more salary and give up their 15th pick though. Lets just hope they want to re-unite the dominant getzlaf-heatley combo. Also Tangradi was traded to the Pens in the Kunitz-Whitney deal.

wprager wrote:By the way, what's this "Guest" thing? And why did Dave respond to one of the guest's posts as to Hemlock? What did I miss?

Follow back through the exchange in the Dudley thread and you'll see. Hemlock deleted his account after the exchange and it now shows up as Guest.

shabbs wrote:

wprager wrote:By the way, what's this "Guest" thing? And why did Dave respond to one of the guest's posts as to Hemlock? What did I miss?

Follow back through the exchange in the Dudley thread and you'll see. Hemlock deleted his account after the exchange and it now shows up as Guest.

But ... but ... who will act as the impartial by-stander and collect the bracket pool votes next year?

The picture Allen Panzeri paints this morning of the Heatley situation is not a promising one...

'Nobody' wants Heatley: NHL exec
Senators finding few takers for big contract
Allen Panzeri, The Ottawa Citizen, June 29, 2009

As the NHL draft wrapped up Saturday, an executive with one of the league's 30 teams leaned on the metal fence separating the draft floor from the media and asked about Dany Heatley.

Told that Senators general manager Bryan Murray had not yet even received an offer, the league executive nodded and said: "That's because nobody wants him. Nobody."

It's difficult to believe that a 50-goal scorer of Heatley's ability could be unwanted -- maybe even untradeable -- but that's the stark reality Murray must confront as the days count down to July 1, the day the Senators must pay Heatley a $4-million U.S. signing bonus.

Heatley's contract, which has five years to go at an average salary cap hit of $7.5 million, is too expensive.

As attractive as Heatley is as a player, teams have been asking themselves this: Why go after Heatley when it might be possible to sign a free agent such as Marian Hossa, Marian Gaborik or Martin Havlat without having to give up something in return?

This is squeezing Murray.

He's under pressure to get something close to equal value for Heatley, but he's playing with a weak hand as he tries to unload a disgruntled player with a heavy contract.

That's why some of the rumoured offerings have been so embarrassing. This one began as the wishful thinking of a New York Post columnist and seems to have morphed into the New York Rangers offer: Michael Roszival (a $5-million cap hit) and Nikolai Zherdev (a restricted free agent, but he made $3.25 million last season) for Heatley. If the Senators were to take Wade Redden and his $6.5-million contract, even better.

No wonder Murray wasn't able to make a deal during draft weekend.

He may be forced to make more of an "accommodation" -- his word -- in the next few days, because it will even be tougher to trade Heatley after Wednesday.

Having paid the signing bonus, the Senators will be looking for a return on that investment.

It's unfathomable to think Heatley could be back in an Ottawa uniform this fall. It would be such a daily distraction that it would assuredly ruin the season, hardly something the team needs.

It's brave of Murray to say he won't trade Heatley unless he receives a decent offer, but he knows what it would be like to have an angry, unhappy player in the lineup and in the locker room, providing daily fodder for newspapers, radio, and TV

This will undoubtedly be part of the scenario Murray discusses with Heatley's agents over the next day or so. Whether they have any suggestions or not, it'll be an interesting discussion.

Still, it's difficult to imagine that the agents could help arrange a trade that Murray has so far been unable to make unless it involves a drastic reduction in Murray's price tag.

That may well happen. For now, though, Murray remains hopeful.

Free agency approaches
Before the Heatley mess fell into his lap, Murray was hoping to make a splash or two in the free-agent market.

He's still thinking about it.

"I said at the end of the hockey season I'd really like to get a top-six forward, whether that be through trade or through free agency," he said as the draft ended.

"I hope to be able on July 1 to participate in some conversations with people and find out if Ottawa is a place."

Murray still has to have another conversation with Todd Reynolds, the agent for winger Chris Neil, to see if a deal is possible before Neil becomes a free agent. Neil, who has spent his first seven NHL seasons as a Senator, is willing to take a shave, but not a bath, to stay in Ottawa.

Also, it's clear Murray isn't close to re-signing unrestricted free agent Mike Comrie. Comrie made $4 million last season.

The Senators were hopeful they'd be able to get him for at least half that, but clearly it was wishful thinking.

Qualifying offers
Today is the deadline for qualifying offers to go out to each team's restricted free agents. Those who don't receive such offers become unrestricted free agents, meaning their previous employers receive no compensation if they sign with other clubs.

Senators goalie Brian Elliott gets one if he hasn't already -- the sides have been talking about a new contract -- but it doesn't appear that defenceman Brendan Bell will.

After accepting a two-way contract last year and finishing the season with the Senators, he'll be looking for a one-way contract, but the Senators don't need another sixth or seventh defenceman.

Murray is already thought to be shopping 35-year-old Jason Smith ($2.6-million contract for next season) and 23-year-old Alexandre Picard ($850,000).

Murray also needs to clear a roster spot for Eric Karlsson, the Senators' first-round pick in 2008. He will be given every chance to make the team this fall.

At one time, it was thought that Murray would pursue a defenceman in the free-agent market.

With Jay Bouwmeester off the market, at least while the Flames take a shot at signing him before Wednesday, the best of the rest are expected to be Montreal Canadiens defenceman Mike Komisarek and Vancouver Canucks defenceman
Mattias Ohlund, though the Canadiens have said they'd like to re-sign Komisarek.

---

As Sens broadcast commentator Dean Brown is saying this morning on Team 1200, BM has been put in "an impossible position", and the "only GMs who are speaking about this issue, are speaking about it negatively."

Regarding the possibility of Heatley starting the season in Ottawa, Brown reminded the listeners that Alexei Yashin came back to play after holding out..."so nothing is impossible" says Dean.

Like I said in another thread. I'd rather have Heatley here than take the garbage offers other GMs are trying to low-ball Murray with.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:Like I said in another thread. I'd rather have Heatley here than take the garbage offers other GMs are trying to low-ball Murray with.

I echo that thought. Murray does not have to trade Heatley. I'm sure it could be a pain to have him in the room but I don't care. Based on everything I hear, Heatley is a bit of a loner who does his own thing; no matter what.

I'm sure if he must come back, there'll be a meeting behind closed doors (they've become really good at that) and they'll have some serious discussions but these are men and they'll work things out; at least well enough to play together.

Remember, all it takes is for Heatley to grow up and play like he played in 2006 when our top 3 centers went down. That was, all out, the best hockey he had ever played. If he comes back to that, he will surely get some lovin' back from the fans and from his team mates.

I say, if you can't get the right deal for him, keep him around until at least the trade deadline; you'll get top value for him at that time if he played hard throughout the year.

Maybe by then, if they're succesfull, he won't want a trade ...

Please don't go into garage sale mode ...

^If he stays do we even have room to add via free agency? Ideally he gets dealt for the best available offer... Minnesota seemed interested but Murray will have to stop asking for Burns.

If he stays in Ottawa though it will be interesting. On ice I'll be happy because he'll be scoring goals but I have my doubts when it comes to the team being a cohesive unit.

beerandsens wrote:^If he stays do we even have room to add via free agency? Ideally he gets dealt for the best available offer... Minnesota seemed interested but Murray will have to stop asking for Burns.

If he stays in Ottawa though it will be interesting. On ice I'll be happy because he'll be scoring goals but I have my doubts when it comes to the team being a cohesive unit.

No he won't. Minnesota will have to stop thinking they will get something for nothing. Barring that they can Diddle off.

Well, either Murray lowers his expectations or Heatley stays. If Heatley stays it will be the longest year in Sens history.

Yashin holdout year?

This will be worse simply because it's about more than money. Say what you want about Yashin but he never asked to be traded.

Yeah but he waited the year and then came back. That was s saga...

comparing Yashin to Heatley is like apples to oranges, either way, they were both rotten, so should be thought of in the same regard, a kick in the Donkey on the way out and bring on the return, Yashin's was nice, hopefully if things go well, so will Heatley's be.

beerandsens wrote:^If he stays do we even have room to add via free agency? Ideally he gets dealt for the best available offer... Minnesota seemed interested but Murray will have to stop asking for Burns.

If he stays in Ottawa though it will be interesting. On ice I'll be happy because he'll be scoring goals but I have my doubts when it comes to the team being a cohesive unit.

A couple of things to think about. First Murray has given his agents permission to make a deal on their own. This does a couple of things, first it allows BM to work multiple offers at the same time without showing his personal hand, it's the agents that are trying to get value by suggesting names. Second, it proves to the agents that Murray isn't blowing smoke. In fact that there really isn't a market for a whinning forward who doesn't want to work.


Also Heatley has to be very careful. Refusing to show up and play for Ottawa (should a trade not happen) will mean his Olympics are over. Also any shot at a future trade is severlyl hampered as he is further reducing his value. His best chance is to show up, play hard as the team and coach asks, and hopefully with decent stats he can increase his value to a point where he is wanted.

Lastly, there is some concern in the Heatley camp that should he refuse to show up, he'll have to return the 4 million owed to him July 1st, as it's part of a salary for the upcoming year and as such by not showing up he'll be suspended and have to return all money paid to that point.