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GM Hockey » The other NHL teams » Atlantic » Detroit Red Wings » What's Next for the Red Wings?

What's Next for the Red Wings?

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shabbs
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SensFan71
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Hockeyhero22000
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31What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Mon Jun 15, 2009 1:38 pm

Hockeyhero22000


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if hossa accepts that deal that is a cap hit of 4 million that pushes the wings up to 55 million cap wise next year it would be safe to say huddler and samualsson wont be returning especially with the wings still needing a backup signed and are going to have to get helm and Abdelkader to come up and play full time and that is still going to be 1.4 total puts them already over this years cap and it is expected to go down next year i dont know how they are going to sign hossa without trading away a larger contract

32What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Mon Jun 15, 2009 1:42 pm

SensFan71


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SpezDispenser wrote:http://www.freep.com/article/20090614/SPORTS05/906140554/0/SPORTS05

Looks like Detroit's gonna offer Hossa a 10 year, 40 million dollar deal. I can't see him signing that, but hey...you never know...

I can't see it, he will run to greener pastures to the next team he thinks will win that is not the Penguins, they would laugh at him.

33What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Mon Jun 15, 2009 1:48 pm

wprager


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Hockeyhero22000 wrote:if hossa accepts that deal that is a cap hit of 4 million that pushes the wings up to 55 million cap wise next year it would be safe to say huddler and samualsson wont be returning especially with the wings still needing a backup signed and are going to have to get helm and Abdelkader to come up and play full time and that is still going to be 1.4 total puts them already over this years cap and it is expected to go down next year i dont know how they are going to sign hossa without trading away a larger contract

Holland has already denied those rumors, hasn't he? I'd definitely keep Helm over Hossa, not that it's one or the other, but I hope you get my meaning. Hossa got paid $7.4M and did not deliver. He led the team in goals, but in light of the playoffs "performance", that's really just an indication that he is not buying into the team game. There are no 50-goal scorers on the Wings because they play a balanced, team-first style. Hossa does not really fit in.

They could try moving Rafalski.

34What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:43 pm

davetherave

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"Abel To Yzerman", one of the most well known, and colourfully ardent Red Wings blogs, puts its cards on the table with regard to 'what's next for the Wings':

THE PAIN WILL BE SO VERY GOOD
'Abel to Yzerman'/Kuklas Korner, June 15, 2008
http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/a2y/comments/the_pain_will_be_so_very_good/

It was a tough weekend for all of us. But it’s over and no matter how many times you imagine it differently, none of the shots taken the final 16 seconds went in.

And no matter what, that’s really all that counts.

The task at hand now for Tick Tock and Uncle Mike? First...figure out what happened in Games 6 and 7. The Wings essentially played two periods worth remembering, both 3rds. And, as usual, they only really turned it on when both situations were at their most dire. No matter the fatigue, or the injuries or the pressure or whatever. Someone needs to figure out how to get this team away from that kind of malaise.

Oh, fatigue had a bit to do with it. But not entirely. It happened all year. Now that we’re done we can all look back and admit that the ferocity and the surgical precision with which the Wings played right off the hop against Columbus surprised, even shocked, most of us. They really could “flip the switch”. And they did.

But the shelf life ran out two games too soon. The switch came unflipped at the same time the Wings faced off against a Pens team that had nothing to lose after getting spanked in Game 5. They were hungrier, grittier and--in those two games--better.

Now? The Wings have to deal with it. Now the players can head home and occasionally remember what they were doing last year at this time. They can consider where the Cup is now, and where it would have been had they been able to sustain the energy from Game 5 for just three more periods. Hopefully the same pain you feel as a fan is consuming them. Hopefully it’s ten times worse.

While you and I can escape it, Marian Hossa won’t be able to. And if he stays, that will be a good thing. Same with Brad Stuart and even Chris Osgood, who will think of Talbot’s second goal all summer.

And now? Decisions have to be made.

A roster has to be formed and in Tick Tock’s mind I’ll bet it already is. You already know who I believe will be on it...and his sweater includes the numbers 1 and 8 but not the name “Maltby.” Who else? Remains to be seen. I’m hoping Andres Lilja, but we literally have no idea about that. Had he been aboard for this run? Could have been different. Just look at the PK in Game 3 and 4 and imagine Lilja in there.

Come to think of it, could have been worse too. Insert a smiley face there if you’re so inclined.

So Ken Holland and Mike Babc0ck have to find a balance, especially if keeping Hossa is a priority...which it should be.

They have to reconcile the idea of losing a popular Jiri Hudler and an inconsistent but at times clutch Mikael Samuelsson. Questions have to be raised about a sudden lack of depth on the blue line and whether Ville Leino and Justin Abdelkader are actually ready for the big time. Another question may center around why there seems to be some institutional mandate that Jimmy Howard be granted a roster spot he hasn’t earned.

But most of all, these two architects need to put their heads together and determine how they’re going to re-introduce the hunger of ‘08 to the team of ‘09, while keeping in mind that this team has played more hockey the last four years (include the Olympics in there too) than any team in NHL history.

While they’re at it...this: Time to tell Brad McCrimmon goodbye. Interestingly, he’s never been fully identified as the guy behind the Wing penalty kill. But I think it’s safe to assume that he is. Uncle Mike needs to find the best penalty killing mind in the business who isn’t an NHL head coach and get him to Detroit STAT.

Chris Osgood was the best goalie in the playoffs, yet our PK was disgusting. And it had been all year. It wasn’t a blip or a ten-game stretch. It was an abomination all season long and that needs to be rectified. Find a genius Mike. Find him and bring him to our home.

I don’t know if the Cap is going to decrease. I don’t know what moves the Wings will have to make in order to keep Hossa. I’m also not positive that Hudler and Samuelsson have to be the guys who leave. Darren Helm has to have the organ-I-zation considering a few more options other than the obvious.

So changes are in order, but here’s the thing that is going to gnaw and nag at you all year.

It makes no difference what kind of shakeup Holland orchestrates, or what kind of change in motivation this team has over the next ten months if Pavel Datsyuk, Nick Lidstrom, Brian Rafalski, Kris Draper all get hurt at roughly the same time like they did this season.

If they had all been healthy for the Final? Who knows.

If Sergei Gonchar had been completely healthy maybe our PK would have been exposed far more than it was.

Changes are coming.

The roster’s going to be different. And I would bet that the intensity is going to be off the charts, and not just in late Spring of 2010.

I would think that the Wings have one wish, and it’s very specific. Not just a return to the Final, and not just Cup #12.

I’m betting that soon, once the physical hurt wears off, an entire organ-I-zation is going to do whatever it can to keep a deeper pain alive until a chance at redemption presents itself. Every move made this summer should be accomplished with that in mind.

35What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:55 pm

davetherave

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Wings columnist Ansar Khan spells out some of the issues and option for Detroit.

Marian Hossa, others wonder if they will return as Red Wings clear out lockers after Game 7 loss
Ansar Khan, MLive.com, June 15, 2009

DETROIT -- Detroit Red Wings captain Nicklas Lidstrom couldn't help but feel a tinge of sadness Monday as teammates packed their gear and headed separate ways, some of them never to return.

"There are always going to be changes during the offseason because of the (salary) cap or players testing the market," Lidstrom said after the team photo at Joe Louis Arena. "It's still sad seeing those guys here for the last time."

Nobody wants to leave, but changes are inevitable, not only because of the team's Game 7 loss to the Pittsburgh Penguins in the Stanley Cup finals, but mainly because of salary-cap restrictions.

The Red Wings have 19 players signed for next season at roughly $53.5 million.


They need to sign three or four forwards and settle on a backup goaltender. They can re-sign veteran Ty Conklin or give young Jimmy Howard a chance.

The cap is not expected to change much from $56.7 million.

The first order of business is determining whether to re-sign star right wing Marian Hossa, whose value dropped after a poor playoff performance. He reaffirmed his desire to sign a long-term contract with the Red Wings but realizes he must accept less- than-market value to stay.

"Detroit is at the top of my list, for sure," Hossa said. "But with today's economy, it's hard to plan something ahead. We're going to try our best to figure something out. Obviously, if you want to stay on a great team, you're willing to take less."

Lidstrom and Detroit coach Mike Babc0ck voiced their support for Hossa.

"I'd like to see him stay. He's been a great addition to our team," Lidstrom said. "A 40-goal scorer isn't something that's easy to find. Even though he didn't score the way he wanted to in the playoffs, he means a lot to our team."

Said Babc0ck: "I'd love to have him back. I was very impressed with his contributions, how he was a good teammate and how hard he works. We would have liked to have gotten it done for him."

If Hossa re-signs, the Red Wings still would need to shed payroll elsewhere. And they would not have the cap space to retain forwards Jiri Hudler and Mikael Samuelsson.

Hudler is a restricted free agent who might attract an offer sheet from another team. The Red Wings would have the option to match it or receive draft picks, depending on the value of the deal. They also could elect to trade his rights.

"I feel like this is home," Hudler said. "Hopefully, we're going to get a deal done."
Samuelsson is unrestricted and wouldn't cost as much as Hudler.

"I don't try to think so much about it. ... I'd go nuts," Samuelsson said. "We have a great team here. We're going to be great in the future, too, and I hope I'm going to be part of it."

Tomas Kopecky, whose season ended after he sustained a fractured orbital bone in a fight with Anaheim's Francois Beauchemin in the second round, is an unrestricted free agent who might not be re-signed.

Kopecky said he would love to stay, even though he would have a better opportunity to play more minutes elsewhere. The Atlanta Thrashers showed interest in him in the past.

"You think about it (leaving for a better opportunity), but on the other hand, you always try to put yourself in a position where you can win every year," Kopecky said.

Ville Leino, a restricted free agent, anticipates getting a deal done with Detroit.

But he wants an assurance he won't be sent down to Grand Rapids. "I don't want to play in the AHL anymore, and I won't do that anymore," Leino said.

Babc0ck confirmed that Leino will be with the Red Wings next season. He said Justin Abdelkader likely will start the season in Grand Rapids.

Conklin, who had a strong season as Chris Osgood's backup, said he would like to re-sign.

"I enjoyed it here. I was able to play a decent amount," Conklin said. "It's a hard locker room not to like, lot of good people here. People take less to play here for a reason."

Conklin said several factors, including playing time, will weigh into his decision, but added, "A lot of those questions for me are satisfied here in Detroit."

If the Red Wings bring back Conklin, they would need to trade Howard, who is out of minor-league options.

36What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:20 pm

davetherave

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WINGS HOSSA WANTS TO HAVE A LONG TERM DEAL
He'd like to stay with Wings, but knows salary cap poses a problem
Tim Twentyman, The Detroit News, June 16, 2009

When Marian Hossa came to Detroit, he had Monday playing out a little different.
Hossa turned down more lucrative, multiyear contracts -- including with Pittsburgh -- to sign a one-year deal with Detroit.

In doing so, Hossa, a forward, envisioned Monday he'd be riding down Woodward Avenue atop a convertible to thousands of Detroiters screaming his name after a Stanley Cup title run.

Instead, Hossa and the other Wings were left cleaning out their lockers and wondering what went wrong.

Now, for Hossa, it also might mark the last time he puts on a Wings jersey.

Hossa, a free agent to be, made it clear Monday he would not sign another one-year contract like the $7.45 million deal he signed last offseason. He's looking to cash in on a long-term deal and wants the security that goes with that type of deal.

Whether that's with Detroit -- or another team -- is yet to be determined.

"Detroit is on the top of my list, for sure," he said. "I don't feel like moving all the time."

With Henrik Zetterberg, Pavel Datsyuk, Johan Franzen, Valtteri Filppula, Brian Rafalski and Dan Cleary signed to large, long-term deals, the Wings don't have the cap space to be large players in the free-agent market this offseason. They will have around $4 million to play with.

If Hossa is going to remain with the Wings, he'll have to take less money to do it.

"With today's economy and the salary cap and these things, it's hard to plan something ahead," Hossa said. "We are going to try the best to figure things out the next week or few days.

"Obviously, we're going to have a talk. Ken (Holland, general manager) and my agent are going to have a talk together, and we'll see what's going to happen."

Hossa did not play well in the Stanley Cup Finals against the Penguins, getting three assists. He was, however, an offensive force during the regular season, leading the Wings with 40 goals.

"It's still early for him to come up with an answer to (coming back for less money), but we've told him we'd like to have him back," captain Nicklas Lidstrom said. "I think he was a great addition to our team and 40-goal scorers are hard to find."

Coach Mike Babc0ck made it clear he'd like Hossa back.

"I think he is a great man, and I was very impressed with his contributions to our team this year and his commitment to his teammates and how hard he worked," Babc0ck said.

"I also have a lot of respect for a guy that makes a decision and stands by that. That was impressive."

37What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:22 am

wprager

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Hossa is pretty much saying he doesn't think Detroit can afford him. His next best chance is Boston, but they have no cap room. Since he's looking for a long-term deal, how long will it take for Montreal to be Cup contenders again? Same question about Toronto. If I was him I'd think long and hard about Toronto.

38What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Thu Jun 18, 2009 8:03 am

Cap'n Clutch

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What about LA? They're an up and coming team that could make a splash with Hossa and they have the cap room to spare. A long term deal with them seems like a safe bet.


_________________
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39What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:18 am

asq2

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Cap'n Clutch wrote:What about LA? They're an up and coming team that could make a splash with Hossa and they have the cap room to spare. A long term deal with them seems like a safe bet.

Or St. Louis.

40What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:22 am

Cap'n Clutch

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asq2 wrote:
Cap'n Clutch wrote:What about LA? They're an up and coming team that could make a splash with Hossa and they have the cap room to spare. A long term deal with them seems like a safe bet.

Or St. Louis.

Both could be solid landing places for Hossa and in a few years both will be threats.


_________________
"A child with Autism is not ignoring you, they are waiting for you to enter their world."

- Unknown Author

41What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:55 pm

wprager

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Cap'n Clutch wrote:
asq2 wrote:
Cap'n Clutch wrote:What about LA? They're an up and coming team that could make a splash with Hossa and they have the cap room to spare. A long term deal with them seems like a safe bet.

Or St. Louis.

Both could be solid landing places for Hossa and in a few years both will be threats.

He might want something a little quicker. Not that either the Leafs or the Habs seem to be going in theat direction, but Burke is a decent enough GM, he's aggressive, and he's got no limits other than the cap.

42What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:24 pm

davetherave

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ESPN's EJ Hradek and Puck Prospectus' Iain Fyffe decipher Detroit's decisions to be made.

WINGS HAVE LITTLE CASH TO ADDRESS NEEDS
PK was West Champs' lone weakness

EJ Hradek, Iain Fyffe/ESPN INSIDER, June 18, 2009

Plugging Holes - Detroit Red Wings

What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Det
The Hole: Penalty-killing forward

The Red Wings had only one real weakness in 2008-09: their penalty killing. They ranked 25th in the NHL with a 78.29 percent kill rate. It's difficult to blame the defensemen, with Nicklas Lidstrom, Andreas Lilja, Brad Stuart and Niklas Kronwall doing solid work. The blame must fall on the forwards. The Wings' primary penalty killers were Kris Draper (2:05 short-handed minutes per game) and Daniel Cleay (2:01), followed by Henrik Zetterberg (1:49), Valteri Filppula (1:45) and Pavel Datsyuk (1:36). Erstwhile, Draper's defensive crony Kirk Maltby played only 1:15 per game short-handed. The issues here are that Draper is getting old (38), and some of the team's main penalty killers are also its best offensive players. No disrespect to Zetterberg's or Datsyuk's defensive skills, but they're more valuable at even strength or with the man advantage.

The Fix: Sign Samuel Pahlsson (UFA, Blackhawks)
Although Pahlsson's short-handed defensive GVT wasn't great (0.9 GVT, the same as Draper but better than every other Wings' forward), he ate up short-handed minutes last year like they were candy, playing 4:11 per game in that situation. He is much younger than Draper (31), and can be had relatively inexpensively (he made $1.4 million in each of the last two seasons). A $1.5 million investment here would free up Datsyuk and Zetterberg for more offensive roles and end the reliance on an aging Draper.

E.J.'s Take: I don't see Pahlsson as a fit in Detroit. I don't know if he was hurt, but he looked a step slow during the playoffs. I think the Wings will be moving youngster Darren Helm into the club's third-line pivot role. The veteran Draper, under contract for two more seasons, figures to work as a fourth-line center who will slide to the wing in different situations. That leaves no role for Pahlsson.

I think the full-time promotions of Helm and Jonathan Ericsson will help improve the club's penalty-killing unit. The PK also would benefit from a better regular season performance by starting goalie Chris Osgood.

Iain Fyffe is a writer for Puck Prospectus. E.J. Hradek is a senior writer for ESPN The Magazine.

Note: A mainstay of Puck Prospectus's metrics is "Goals Versus Threshold" (GVT). The stat blends an array of offensive and defensive figures to measure the value, in terms of goals, a player contributes above what the marginal player would over the course of the season. A marginal player is one that could be replaced with a player of equivalent skill, e.g. from the minors. For instance, Evgeni Malkin had an offensive GVT of +18.9, a defensive GVT of +4.5 and a total GVT of +23.4 for the 2008-9 regular season, meaning that Malkin was worth 23.4 goals more than a marginal player over the course of the season, or worth about 0.3 additional goals per game. In the team context, GVT refers to performance above an NHL average team. For the regular season, the Detroit Red Wings had a +30.8 offensive GVT, a +15.1 defensive GVT, a -21.5 goaltending GVT, for a +24.4 total GVT. Therefore, at even strength, Detroit was 24.4 goals better than the average team.



Last edited by davetherave on Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:14 pm; edited 1 time in total

43What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:13 pm

davetherave

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Given our contingent of diehard Detroit fans, surprised no one's responded yet to Fyffe and Hradek's analysis...

44What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:13 pm

asq2

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I really don't think there's anything to say other than "stay the course."

Sign Pahlsson, or don't. They're fine either way.

45What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:15 pm

asq2

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One thing that doesn't get talked about as much is how good Detroit's farm looks right now. Obviously everyone knows how good the scouts are, but prospect-wise they're deep at every position.

46What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:42 am

davetherave

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asq2 wrote:I really don't think there's anything to say other than "stay the course."

Sign Pahlsson, or don't. They're fine either way.

According to you, and your above statement, there are no areas on the Red Wings that need improvement.

OK, let's compare.

2007-08:
Stanley Cup Champions
President's Trophy
Record: 54-21-7, 115 points
257 GF, 1st in the West, 3rd overall
184 GA, 1st overall
PP 20.8% 1st in the West, 3rd overall
PK 84.0 % 7th in the West, 8th overall
Finished last ten games 7-2-1

2008-09:
Stanley Cup--lost to Pittsburgh in Final
No President's Trophy--finished 3rd overall, 2nd in West
Record: 51-21-10, 112 points
295 GF, 1st in the West, 1st overall
244 GA, 10th in the West, 19th overall
PP 25.5% 1st in the West, 3rd overall
PK 78.3% 13th in the West, 25th overall
Finished last ten games 3-6-1

So...areas where Detroit declined:
Lost Stanley Cup Championship
Lost President's Trophy
Slipped in West standings from 1st to 2nd, overall 1st to 3rd
GA ballooned from 184 to 244, from 1st overall to 19th
PK declined almost 6%, slipped from 8th overall to 25th
Finished season losing 7 of last 10 games

Should the Wings 'stay the course'--as you suggest--that would mean they would decline further next year in the above areas.

As for your casual "fine either way" attitude...that is not how teams build champions.

Given Mr. Holland's proven insistence on excellence and consistent improvement, one doubts he feels the Wings are "fine either way".

47What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:05 am

PKC

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I wonder if they'd be interested in a Jiri Hudler for Chris Kelly swap.

48What's Next for the Red Wings? - Page 3 Empty Re: What's Next for the Red Wings? Sun Jun 21, 2009 11:52 am

rooneypoo

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PKC wrote:I wonder if they'd be interested in a Jiri Hudler for Chris Kelly swap.

LOL. I'm gonna take a stab in the dark and say "no." Smile

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