Spezza won't be traded.

MurderOnIce wrote:
It's not like you get the same shot every year. You start game one on the road (after a nine day layoff)... and the rules are changed while you aren't looking... you lose by one in a tough game. Second game again you lose by one but one of your key forwards is knocked out by an absolutely vicious hit. Seriously should have been a 5 game suspension and would have been during the season, not even having the history of the suspension 2 WEEKS EARLIER. You go back home and win a solid game 3... 5 to 3. You lose game 4 by one goal again and then it was basically the team saying uncle... 6 to 2 loss in the finals...

I am sorry but all the bounces, calls and supplementary discipline went the way of the Ducks. After 4 games there was a one goal differential and they were down 3 games to one... the reality is that series could have gone either way even though it was a 4 to 1 result....

There will forever be the regret from me that one of our guys didn't end Pronger's career. What would the NHL say? You're suspended for 5 games for kneeing? Fine. Diddle you, you can't suspend me more than that because Pronger only got 1 for elbowing McAmmond so hard in the head that he was concussed. Screw that noise man, knee to knee. And if Pronger misses it, you try again. And again. And again until his ligaments are torn and tangled. Pronger did what he had to do and I'll never get why we didn't do what we had to do.

Neely4Life wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:In all honesty MOI, could things have gone any more perfectly during that cup run? EVERYTHING went the Sens way. Every bounce, every call, every missed call up until the finals. I dont think there has ever been a team to just role through their conferance like the Sens did that year.

Thats where the problem is in Ottawa, when things go their way, they can't be stopped, but teams have figured out to get in their way like the Ducks did and you have seen the results. Just like in the finals that year, onced faced with adversity the Sens fold it up along with Spezza.

Sure everything went fine.. I wouldn't go as far as to say every call bounce etc... I give the team some credit, don't you? Things were running along fine and then hey guys we aren't playing 2005 rules we are going with 1983 rules... k... Oh and BTW, Pronger getting a second suspension in one playoff year and the second one being only one game is a travesty...

Obviously I give the team credit for getting their but they had more then their fair share of luck. Look at the finals now, there is tons more being let go then there was in the regular season and first 3 rounds, but you fight through it. That's what winners do!

People blame this and that, but the only guys that are going to be able to get it done are the guys in the mirror for Ottawa. It takes a special kind of person to accept the blame and responsibility and show that they want to be better and prove it vs someone who just says it.

It's not like you get the same shot every year. You start game one on the road (after a nine day layoff)... and the rules are changed while you aren't looking... you lose by one in a tough game. Second game again you lose by one but one of your key forwards is knocked out by an absolutely vicious hit. Seriously should have been a 5 game suspension and would have been during the season, not even having the history of the suspension 2 WEEKS EARLIER. You go back home and win a solid game 3... 5 to 3. You lose game 4 by one goal again and then it was basically the team saying uncle... 6 to 2 loss in the finals...

I am sorry but all the bounces, calls and supplementary discipline went the way of the Ducks. After 4 games there was a one goal differential and they were down 3 games to one... the reality is that series could have gone either way even though it was a 4 to 1 result....

It could have gone either way but The Ducks had the better goaltending, better defense, and by the looks of things now the better offense. You make you're own breaks and the Sens did that in the 1st, 3 rounds along with some luck. In the finals it was fairly evident the best team won.

As for Pronger, like it or, what he did worked and he now has the cup ring on his finger. At the end of the day he will be remembered for being a Hart Trophy winner and a Stanley Cup Champion. Whatever it takes to win.

You can't have it both ways. The Sens had all the bounces getting to the final but after that only the best team wins. The games were played with entirely different rules. Shame on the Sens for not adjusting but bigger shame on the league for inconsistency especially in the big 'Crackdown Year' on the biggest stage....

Boo Boo was saying on the Healthy Scratches that Spezza being moved depends on what happens with Vinny. Probably a good move on Murray to see what the market demand is for Vinny.

Take what he says with a big grain of salt though, but teams are still kicking the tires with Murray. Also, after what Murray said on Feb 26th about obtaining a goaltender, then making the first trade of the day on the 27th should also be noted.

Fine. In terms of hockey ability, we won't find another centre that approaches him.

All we need now is someone to kick him in the @$$ so that he keeps his feet moving all the time. His regular speed isn't terrible, but his acceleration is. Keep moving all the time and that isn't a problem, though. He can be a dominant defensive player as long as he keeps that in mind: he's got a great sense for the game (even if he makes too many risky plays) and a long reach.

If it means cutting his ice-time, I'm all for it. He'd still have an equal, if not greater impact on the game.

He has to want to be that kind of player and all I know, so far he has shown he just wants to be a guy that has great stats. I also know that has been siad by former team mates that it is all he really cares about... sad but true.

Spezza limit's are mental, not physical.

i have to admit to being somewhat excited about reading that article this morning... it sounded great, murray was investigating spezza, spezza was already working out... then all the talk around that article did get me thinking... why would murray bless the ground spezza was walking on with all this admiration...

"He's a top-end forward," said Murray. "I watched him at the world championships and I thought he was really good. I believe Team Canada has to look at him as a real candidate for the Olympic team. Our judgment of Jason is somewhat fair: We see a level of play that he can get to some nights and other nights he's not quite there.

"I've watched him. He's in the gym every day. He's working with our strength coach. He wants to be a real top-end guy and be more consistent. To be there, he has to be stronger and he recognizes that. I don't see any need to do anything other than to get him to play at the top level every night."

murray is an intelligent man, if there is any sort of bidding at the moment for spezza he's putting the icing on there. of course he's putting it in a realistic light saying he's not being 100% that he could be cuz then noone would want him. so like N4L as remarked it sounds like a sells pitch the same as when murray said we weren't going after a goaltender.

it will still be interesting to see if anything comes out of it and obviously rumours will still fly.
if it is just an article for murray to say quit thinking spezza is on his way out, then hey! i like that spezza seems to take it more seriously. either way it was a positive read.

i'm all for keeping spezza, and i hope he develops a "need to win" attitude, cuz the way the fanbase and media behave (and previously stated) he will be chased out of ottawa.

I took that article with a big grain of salt, and like I mentioned, remember what Murray said about Leclaire before obtaining him at the deadline. "We will not be dealing for a goaltender" and long behold.

I just cant believe Murray TRULY believes Canada should be looking at him for the Olympics after the season he had. That still boggles my mind a bit and do think there is more behind him saying all that publicly than meets the eye.

asq2 wrote:Fine. In terms of hockey ability, we won't find another centre that approaches him.

All we need now is someone to kick him in the @$$ so that he keeps his feet moving all the time. His regular speed isn't terrible, but his acceleration is. Keep moving all the time and that isn't a problem, though. He can be a dominant defensive player as long as he keeps that in mind: he's got a great sense for the game (even if he makes too many risky plays) and a long reach.

If it means cutting his ice-time, I'm all for it. He'd still have an equal, if not greater impact on the game.

ASQ, where would Spezza fit on YOUR favourite team, the Detroit Red Wings?

davetherave wrote:

asq2 wrote:Fine. In terms of hockey ability, we won't find another centre that approaches him.

All we need now is someone to kick him in the @$$ so that he keeps his feet moving all the time. His regular speed isn't terrible, but his acceleration is. Keep moving all the time and that isn't a problem, though. He can be a dominant defensive player as long as he keeps that in mind: he's got a great sense for the game (even if he makes too many risky plays) and a long reach.

If it means cutting his ice-time, I'm all for it. He'd still have an equal, if not greater impact on the game.

ASQ, where would Spezza fit on YOUR favourite team, the Detroit Red Wings?

If he had been brought up in that system, and joined Steve Yzerman's team, he'd be one of the top-4 forwards in hockey right now.

As it stands, he doesn't keep his feet moving enough to fit into their scheme. However, despite its great appeal, we cannot simply swap rosters with the Red Wings.

Neely4Life wrote:In all honesty MOI, could things have gone any more perfectly during that cup run? EVERYTHING went the Sens way. Every bounce, every call, every missed call up until the finals. I dont think there has ever been a team to just role through their conferance like the Sens did that year.

Thats where the problem is in Ottawa, when things go their way, they can't be stopped, but teams have figured out to get in their way like the Ducks did and you have seen the results. Just like in the finals that year, onced faced with adversity the Sens fold it up along with Spezza.

Something to consider. During the SCF run was the 1st year we didnt have Chara. Who knows how things would have turned out if Chara was on the team to off set Pronger.

asq2 wrote:

davetherave wrote:

asq2 wrote:
All we need now is someone to kick him in the @$$ so that he keeps his feet moving all the time. His regular speed isn't terrible, but his acceleration is. Keep moving all the time and that isn't a problem, though. He can be a dominant defensive player as long as he keeps that in mind: he's got a great sense for the game (even if he makes too many risky plays) and a long reach.

If it means cutting his ice-time, I'm all for it. He'd still have an equal, if not greater impact on the game.

ASQ, where would Spezza fit on YOUR favourite team, the Detroit Red Wings?

If he had been brought up in that system, and joined Steve Yzerman's team, he'd be one of the top-4 forwards in hockey right now.

As it stands, he doesn't keep his feet moving enough to fit into their scheme.

So, ASQ, as a Wings fan, where do you rate Spezza? Are you saying he wouldn't make the Red Wings roster?

Phoenix30 wrote:

Neely4Life wrote:In all honesty MOI, could things have gone any more perfectly during that cup run? EVERYTHING went the Sens way. Every bounce, every call, every missed call up until the finals. I dont think there has ever been a team to just role through their conferance like the Sens did that year.

Thats where the problem is in Ottawa, when things go their way, they can't be stopped, but teams have figured out to get in their way like the Ducks did and you have seen the results. Just like in the finals that year, onced faced with adversity the Sens fold it up along with Spezza.

Something to consider. During the SCF run was the 1st year we didnt have Chara. Who knows how things would have turned out if Chara was on the team to off set Pronger.

MUCKLER

I will go to my grave a bitter old man cursiong Muckler for letting Chara go instead of Redden. I said it at the time (perhaps partially because Chara was my favourite player) but I think that they would all have cup rings if you subtract Redden and add Chara to that club. Not only because he would have been capable (and surely willing) to exact a pound of flesh from Pronger but because he would have slowed down the relentless forecheck of the Ducks. They were hammering Redden to the point I felt sorry for him. The rest of the ladies on 'D' could not withstand it either... Priessing, Corvo, Meszaros...

I agree with Murder, letting Chara go instead of Redden was a bad move and I'm sure he would of helped a lot against the Ducks.

davetherave wrote:
So, ASQ, as a Wings fan, where do you rate Spezza? Are you saying he wouldn't make the Red Wings roster?

I won't put words in his mouth, but for me, if Spezza had been drafted and developed by the Wings, he'd be...Pavel Datsyuk.

The similarities are striking.

Datsyuk didn't put it all together until he was around 26, which is exactly where Spezza is heading on the 13th on June. Until then, Datsyuk was considered dash and flash, but very little substance - especially defensively.

Just something to consider...

MurderOnIce wrote:I will go to my grave a bitter old man cursiong Muckler for letting Chara go instead of Redden. I said it at the time (perhaps partially because Chara was my favourite player) but I think that they would all have cup rings if you subtract Redden and add Chara to that club. Not only because he would have been capable (and surely willing) to exact a pound of flesh from Pronger but because he would have slowed down the relentless forecheck of the Ducks. They were hammering Redden to the point I felt sorry for him. The rest of the ladies on 'D' could not withstand it either... Priessing, Corvo, Meszaros...

At some point, we have to let this go. I want to break something every time we talk about this.

However, I remember thinking that Chara could easily be exploited by smaller, faster forwards and I also remember the awe-inspiring year Redden had leading up to their UFAs. Redden was the consummate, Scott Neidermayer, Olympic Team, puck-moving, slick D-man that you absolutely and positively needed to win a Cup, whereas Chara was a big, lumbering - at times easily beaten defender, whos game was still raw around the edges. The choice was harder than it appeared is all.

However ( :^^^^: ), when ALL the coaching staff tells you that it's hands down Chara over Redden and you Dung in their face and go the exact opposite way....you're an idiot. That's right Muckler - an idiot.

MurderOnIce wrote:I will go to my grave a bitter old man cursiong Muckler for letting Chara go instead of Redden. I said it at the time (perhaps partially because Chara was my favourite player) but I think that they would all have cup rings if you subtract Redden and add Chara to that club. Not only because he would have been capable (and surely willing) to exact a pound of flesh from Pronger but because he would have slowed down the relentless forecheck of the Ducks. They were hammering Redden to the point I felt sorry for him. The rest of the ladies on 'D' could not withstand it either... Priessing, Corvo, Meszaros...

What about Jason Yorks vague inference that Chara left because he wanted to "be the man"?

You know and I know that "being the man" simply meant not being second banana to No-Trade Redden, which is what Chara had to endure.

Muckler Diddle up. Big.

If Spezza was developed by the Wings and was FORCED to take his time like the rest of the players in their organization were, he would be a different player.

I dont blame Spezza for the way he has turned out, The Senators (and mostly Muckler) rushed him through, gave him everything he wanted without much work for it, and spoiled him. He came onto a first place team and has learned that winning should just be expected, not earned. Thats the reality of it.