GAME DAY: Pittsburgh Penguins @ Ottawa Senators - 7:30pm EST - Thu. Nov. 19th, 2009

shabbs wrote:Maybe it's time for Clouston to give Kovy and Spezza a real chance together... once Kovy returns from Russia that is.

I think Spezza will get it going. I don't mind going through this "transistion" if his game ends up being better all around and it helps the team. I don't write the cheques so I just want wins.

Right now, the so-called second line is helping us win. You can easily tinker with all 3 of the others and in the case of the first, you MUST tinker. Never mind Spezza, that line has to work as a line. It's pretty important if you ask me.

Yeah, the risk of mixing it up too much up is high, and the Fish-Kovy thing is working well.

Maybe Spezza just needs a breakout game to get his mojo going... Buffalo on Sat night would be nice... light 'em up and get it going on.

Spezza usually lights up Buffalo so that could very well be in the cards.

N4L wrote:Spezza usually lights up Buffalo so that could very well be in the cards.

Let us pray.

*prays*

I think Yzerman is our dream comparison for Spezza. Remember when he came into the league he was a top ten scorer. I think he scored something like 142 pts (didn't check but someone can correct that). Anyway, he committed himself to improving his defensive game and became a cup winning leader. He didn't make the transition overnight and his offense hurt through the transition. (Probably his defense took time as well).

The well rounded player who came out the other end is the guy you can build your team around. (Alfie will retire sometime) So we can either be patient and allow some maturation here or we can abandon the effort to develope him into a well rounded player and let him go tag points as his most important/only contribution.

Great game last night....I wasn't expecting the victory, but to get it in such a fashion is a bonus. Hopefully the sens can see the light at the end of the tunnel and just keep moving forward.

I thought everyone played well (or not harmful) hockey yesterday, so I'm gonna pass today on the 'Lets dump on ______ for underachieving".

Onto the next game: Looks like Sens will be without kovy and donovan for a few games, so both Regin and Shannon draw in then...I just hope clouston doesn't put shannon with fish and foligno. Rather I'm hoping for this:

Michalek-Spezza-Cheechoo
Foligno-Fisher-Alfie
Regin-Winchester-Neil
Ruutu-Kelly-Shannon

MurderOnIce wrote:I think Yzerman is our dream comparison for Spezza. Remember when he came into the league he was a top ten scorer. I think he scored something like 142 pts (didn't check but someone can correct that). Anyway, he committed himself to improving his defensive game and became a cup winning leader. He didn't make the transition overnight and his offense hurt through the transition. (Probably his defense took time as well).

The well rounded player who came out the other end is the guy you can build your team around. (Alfie will retire sometime) So we can either be patient and allow some maturation here or we can abandon the effort to develope him into a well rounded player and let him go tag points as his most important/only contribution.

I'm curious, what was Yzerman's salary during those times relative to the team?

Michallica wrote:Great game last night....I wasn't expecting the victory, but to get it in such a fashion is a bonus. Hopefully the sens can see the light at the end of the tunnel and just keep moving forward.

I thought everyone played well (or not harmful) hockey yesterday, so I'm gonna pass today on the 'Lets dump on ______ for underachieving".

Onto the next game: Looks like Sens will be without kovy and donovan for a few games, so both Regin and Shannon draw in then...I just hope clouston doesn't put shannon with fish and foligno. Rather I'm hoping for this:

Michalek-Spezza-Cheechoo
Foligno-Fisher-Alfie
Regin-Winchester-Neil
Ruutu-Kelly-Shannon

It was definitely a great game. I thought we were dead with the way it started but then they really turned it on. I'm quite pleased with the effort, and if I'm not mistaken, we find ourselves back in the race this morning.

Good lines, hopefully that's what CC will go with. We shall see.

MurderOnIce wrote:I think Yzerman is our dream comparison for Spezza. Remember when he came into the league he was a top ten scorer. I think he scored something like 142 pts (didn't check but someone can correct that). Anyway, he committed himself to improving his defensive game and became a cup winning leader. He didn't make the transition overnight and his offense hurt through the transition. (Probably his defense took time as well).

The well rounded player who came out the other end is the guy you can build your team around. (Alfie will retire sometime) So we can either be patient and allow some maturation here or we can abandon the effort to develope him into a well rounded player and let him go tag points as his most important/only contribution.

Or you could build a balanced team and let the scorers score, the playmakers playmake and the plumbers plumb.

SeawaySensFan wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:I think Yzerman is our dream comparison for Spezza. Remember when he came into the league he was a top ten scorer. I think he scored something like 142 pts (didn't check but someone can correct that). Anyway, he committed himself to improving his defensive game and became a cup winning leader. He didn't make the transition overnight and his offense hurt through the transition. (Probably his defense took time as well).

The well rounded player who came out the other end is the guy you can build your team around. (Alfie will retire sometime) So we can either be patient and allow some maturation here or we can abandon the effort to develope him into a well rounded player and let him go tag points as his most important/only contribution.

Or you could build a balanced team and let the scorers score, the playmakers playmake and the plumbers plumb.

I hear what you are saying, however it is hard to argue with the success Detroit enjoyed when Yzerman expanded his role. In today's salary cap world it is hard to pay for the scorers who only score and compliment them with other players who are good enough to play the tough minutes unless you have a scouting staff/player development team that can churn out talent that matches player turnover.

shabbs wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:I think Yzerman is our dream comparison for Spezza. Remember when he came into the league he was a top ten scorer. I think he scored something like 142 pts (didn't check but someone can correct that). Anyway, he committed himself to improving his defensive game and became a cup winning leader. He didn't make the transition overnight and his offense hurt through the transition. (Probably his defense took time as well).

The well rounded player who came out the other end is the guy you can build your team around. (Alfie will retire sometime) So we can either be patient and allow some maturation here or we can abandon the effort to develope him into a well rounded player and let him go tag points as his most important/only contribution.

I'm curious, what was Yzerman's salary during those times relative to the team?

Not relative to the team but here are his career numbers. BIG $$$

$700,000
1990-91	$1,300,000	$600,000	86%
1991-92	$1,400,000	$100,000	8%
1992-93	$1,500,000	$100,000	7%
1993-94	$3,214,520	$1,714,520	114%
1994-95	$1,850,473 Contract = $3,190,470	($1,364,047)	-42%	Players' Strike: 48 out of 84 games played. Most players only received +/- 58% of the amount listed.
1995-96	$3,703,800	$1,853,327	100%
1996-97	$4,025,000	$321,200	9%
1997-98	$5,079,000	$1,054,000	26%
1998-99	$4,800,000	($279,000)	-5%
1999-00	$6,000,000	$1,200,000	25%
2000-01	$8,000,000	$2,000,000	33%
2001-02	$7,500,000	($500,000)	-6%
2002-03	$8,500,000	$1,000,000	13%
2003-04	$5,849,823	($2,650,177)	-31%
2004-05	Lockout	Complete season lockout: Some players joined various teams in North America and Europe and were paid to do so but none got an NHL salary.
2005-06	$1,250,000	($4,599,823)	-79%

MurderOnIce wrote:I hear what you are saying, however it is hard to argue with the success Detroit enjoyed when Yzerman expanded his role. In today's salary cap world it is hard to pay for the scorers who only score and compliment them with other players who are good enough to play the tough minutes unless you have a scouting staff/player development team that can churn out talent that matches player turnover.

Did Detroit's success have anything to do with an upgrade in personnel across the board?

Yzerman is a great player and perhaps a unique one. So I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Spezza to become Yzerman. There's nothing wrong with a player making the most of what he's got instead of trying to find something he doesn't have.

SeawaySensFan wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:I hear what you are saying, however it is hard to argue with the success Detroit enjoyed when Yzerman expanded his role. In today's salary cap world it is hard to pay for the scorers who only score and compliment them with other players who are good enough to play the tough minutes unless you have a scouting staff/player development team that can churn out talent that matches player turnover.

Did Detroit's success have anything to do with an upgrade in personnel across the board?

Yzerman is a great player and perhaps a unique one. So I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Spezza to become Yzerman. There's nothing wrong with a player making the most of what he's got instead of trying to find something he doesn't have.

I am not sure I agree. As I said in the initial post our dream scenario is that he is Yzerman. If he becomes a guy who can play in all situations effectively and still put up 80 points, he becomes much more effective. Look at Hossa as an example (although Hossa's speed is far better). Hossa plays PP, SH and 5 on 5 with equal success. Spezza has size, hockey sense, decptive speed to go along with great hands. Remember defence is taught and offense is instinct, there should be no problem having Spezza learn some defense.

Besides if he is playing in all situations, perhaps our #1 power play unit won't stay out for 1:50 of every 2:00 penalty. They are cooked for the last 50 seconds. That has been one of my pet peeves since the 'Pizza line' was established. Get the Diddle off the ice when you are tired.

MurderOnIce wrote:

I am not sure I agree. As I said in the initial post our dream scenario is that he is Yzerman.

OK so we're talking about Spezza and you typed dream so I hate to do this but it's pretty well inevitable....

Dare to dream.

SeawaySensFan wrote:

MurderOnIce wrote:

I am not sure I agree. As I said in the initial post our dream scenario is that he is Yzerman.

OK so we're talking about Spezza and you typed dream so I hate to do this but it's pretty well inevitable....

Dare to dream.