The New Centaurs: Murray's Makeover

Phoenix30 wrote:Could you imagine the return at that time if we traded either one.

Redden, Chara, Pothier, Preissing all gone for nothing. Add into that mix, Mez and Corvo and it's no mystery why our blueline is in shambles.

There is no easy fix here. Adding a Jay-Bo helps, but we are looking at rebuilding this defense from within. Wiercioch and Karlsson are a great start, but a stud like Cowen or Hedman would go a long way towards getting our defense back to being the strength of this team.

I am now convinced that we will be rebuilding. Murray has be burned too much by UFAs to allow a guy like Kuba to leave for nothing. I think he and Melnyk are giving lip service until they can finally come out and admit the season is lost and this team is broken. I figure once we get close to the deadline, we'll be all but out of it, and then they can risk fan anger by announcing that they will be rebuilding.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and to think that we can just make a couple of moves to return to being a serious competitor is laughable. We have too many holes. Sure we could trade Heatley, but that isn't necessarily making us better now. It's pulling the plug on one hole to cover another.

We wouldn't be starting from scratch, like the Leafs and Islanders are doing. If we can get value for some of our assets like Heatley, Vermette, Kuba, and Fisher, we'd be well on our way back to competitiveness. I doubt it's a Philly style rebuild that happens overnight, but we'll certainly get there quicker than the Leafs or Islanders.

hemlock wrote:Redden, Chara, Pothier, Preissing all gone for nothing. Add into that mix, Mez and Corvo and it's no mystery why our blueline is in shambles.

There is no easy fix here. Adding a Jay-Bo helps, but we are looking at rebuilding this defense from within. Wiercioch and Karlsson are a great start, but a stud like Cowen or Hedman would go a long way towards getting our defense back to being the strength of this team.

I am now convinced that we will be rebuilding. Murray has be burned too much by UFAs to allow a guy like Kuba to leave for nothing. I think he and Melnyk are giving lip service until they can finally come out and admit the season is lost and this team is broken. I figure once we get close to the deadline, we'll be all but out of it, and then they can risk fan anger by announcing that they will be rebuilding.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and to think that we can just make a couple of moves to return to being a serious competitor is laughable. We have too many holes. Sure we could trade Heatley, but that isn't necessarily making us better now. It's pulling the plug on one hole to cover another.

We wouldn't be starting from scratch, like the Leafs and Islanders are doing. If we can get value for some of our assets like Heatley, Vermette, Kuba, and Fisher, we'd be well on our way back to competitiveness. I doubt it's a Philly style rebuild that happens overnight, but we'll certainly get there quicker than the Leafs or Islanders.

Trading those guys would get us more than half way there I'd say.

Heatley = top three forward/top two dman + prospect + first round pick
Vermette = prospect + mid-round pick or top six forward/top four dman
Kuba = first round pick (from a contending team)
Fisher = top six forward/top 4 defenseman

Not too shabby for a rebuild. Add in there our own two first round picks, and a second that will almost be a first, and you have a team that looks extremely different next year.
You pay to get Bouwmeester, and suddenly your blueline doesn't look as ridiculous.

Bouwmeester - Volchenkov
Phillips - Lee
Picard - rookie/UFA/Smith

That looks like a good start to a nice turnaround on the backend. In a year you move out a couple of guys to possibly make room for Weircioch/Karlsson/Cowen/Hedman.

PKC wrote:

hemlock wrote:Redden, Chara, Pothier, Preissing all gone for nothing. Add into that mix, Mez and Corvo and it's no mystery why our blueline is in shambles.

There is no easy fix here. Adding a Jay-Bo helps, but we are looking at rebuilding this defense from within. Wiercioch and Karlsson are a great start, but a stud like Cowen or Hedman would go a long way towards getting our defense back to being the strength of this team.

I am now convinced that we will be rebuilding. Murray has be burned too much by UFAs to allow a guy like Kuba to leave for nothing. I think he and Melnyk are giving lip service until they can finally come out and admit the season is lost and this team is broken. I figure once we get close to the deadline, we'll be all but out of it, and then they can risk fan anger by announcing that they will be rebuilding.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and to think that we can just make a couple of moves to return to being a serious competitor is laughable. We have too many holes. Sure we could trade Heatley, but that isn't necessarily making us better now. It's pulling the plug on one hole to cover another.

We wouldn't be starting from scratch, like the Leafs and Islanders are doing. If we can get value for some of our assets like Heatley, Vermette, Kuba, and Fisher, we'd be well on our way back to competitiveness. I doubt it's a Philly style rebuild that happens overnight, but we'll certainly get there quicker than the Leafs or Islanders.

Trading those guys would get us more than half way there I'd say.

Heatley = top three forward/top two dman + prospect + first round pick
Vermette = prospect + mid-round pick or top six forward/top four dman
Kuba = first round pick (from a contending team)
Fisher = top six forward/top 4 defenseman

Not too shabby for a rebuild. Add in there our own two first round picks, and a second that will almost be a first, and you have a team that looks extremely different next year.
You pay to get Bouwmeester, and suddenly your blueline doesn't look as ridiculous.

Bouwmeester - Volchenkov
Phillips - Lee
Picard - rookie/UFA/Smith

That looks like a good start to a nice turnaround on the backend. In a year you move out a couple of guys to possibly make room for Weircioch/Karlsson/Cowen/Hedman.

Nice assessment. With trading those guys, we'd easily be able to absorb a contract like Jay-Bo. You're probably right in that we'd be more than halfway. Personally, I'd rather do this sooner rather than later. Do it while certain guys have nice value, rather than pulling a Leafs and trying in vain to hang on too long. Do it now, and the length of time it takes to get back to competitiveness is shortened considerably. Hell, we'd be alot younger and more exciting right away. Being a playoff team making just the move you mentioned isn't out of the question, and on top of that the future would be brighter. This is definitely the direction I'd like to see the team take.

Why on earth would JayBo come here?

That ship may have sailed.

Hem, regarding Chara, I used the phrase 'grow into' as a metaphor. I think you would agree that Chara has measurably and visibly refined and improved his game since becoming a Bruin.

Again, my chances to see him play as a Senator were limited, but he certainly didn't have the kind of all around impact then that he has now.

As always, hindsight is 20/20.

But, while we're on the subject, was Hossa for Heatley a 'good deal'? One of the finest to-way forwards in hockey for a 50-goal man?

asq2 wrote:Why on earth would JayBo come here?

That ship may have sailed.

JayBo has apparently said he wants to play for a contender. There's your answer.

Thanks davetherave & asq2, I wasn't sure of that. Now that JayBo appears to be out of the picture, who is your dream UFA PMD? Or do you suggest a trade is the only way to get a great PMD into the organization?

beerandsens wrote:Thanks davetherave & asq2, I wasn't sure of that. Now that JayBo appears to be out of the picture, who is your dream UFA PMD? Or do you suggest a trade is the only way to get a great PMD into the organization?

Well I think we may very well have a great PMD in the organization - problem is, he's 18. This coming draft also presents an opportunity of the Swedish variety.

We've never really been big players on the FA market and we're far more unattractive now than we're used to being. Trade-wise we only have three real chips on the roster (19, 15, 24) that could be used for a good PMD and 24 is a FA himself.

I'd rather try to develop our own. Lee, Karlsson, Wiercioch and potentially Hedman would comprise a brilliant defence puck-movement-wise.

I agree with asq. If Ottawa can draft a brilliant young d-man like Hedman or Cowen, that is highly preferable.

Look at Schenn with the TMLs and Doughty with the Kings. Bogosian is the rock the Thrashers will rebuild around.

IMHO Murray should do whatever it takes to load up on the best young defensemen he can get. You can never have too many.

PS Kuba and Neil to Montreal for...? Gainey has a basket full of assets.

Thanks guys, so would we have any UFA focus at a different position? Or is the real focus getting young dmen for now and getting young inexpensive players to take the place of the mid range contracts on our rostor? I guess I'm back to the original topic of discussion, but I'm curious what people who were going for a UFA PMD will say if JayBo can't be had...

beerandsens wrote:Thanks guys, so would we have any UFA focus at a different position? Or is the real focus getting young dmen for now and getting young inexpensive players to take the place of the mid range contracts on our rostor? I guess I'm back to the original topic of discussion, but I'm curious what people who were going for a UFA PMD will say if JayBo can't be had...

I don't think we should be looking at UFAs at all. Even when we were successful we weren't really attracting big-time UFAs.

With the market as it is, we'd have to drastically overpay, especially now that we suck. And overpaying free agents can mean being forced to get rid of younger, better talent like Briere might be forcing the Flyers to do in Philadelphia.

Agreed with asq2.

asq2 wrote:

beerandsens wrote:Thanks guys, so would we have any UFA focus at a different position? Or is the real focus getting young dmen for now and getting young inexpensive players to take the place of the mid range contracts on our rostor? I guess I'm back to the original topic of discussion, but I'm curious what people who were going for a UFA PMD will say if JayBo can't be had...

I don't think we should be looking at UFAs at all. Even when we were successful we weren't really attracting big-time UFAs.

With the market as it is, we'd have to drastically overpay, especially now that we suck. And overpaying free agents can mean being forced to get rid of younger, better talent like Briere might be forcing the Flyers to do in Philadelphia.

That Briere contact is well beyond awful. I agree though, I don't think we'll be huge buyers on July 1. Use FA's to fill some holes, but I'm a firm believer that you build a core, you don't buy one.