GAME DAY: Minnesota Wild @ Ottawa Senators :: 7:30pm ET :: Wed. Nov. 20th, 2013

Rispek.

Ev wrote:Murray doesn't choose who plays and who doesn't. That's MacLean.

Agreed.

Ev wrote:He's making almost $1 million doing pretty much nothing. How is that a bad thing? He's not a star nor should he be guaranteed playing time. This is Joe Corvo, a 6-7 D who we knew wouldn't play every game (Corvo said this as well).

Murray doesn't choose who plays and who doesn't. That's MacLean.

You're right, being paid to sit at home isn't a bad thing, but there isn't one NHL player that wants to be paid to watch. They are all among the most competitive people you'll ever meet, and they all hate sitting. There is being a 6-7 and then there is plaing behind 3 young kids who are absolutely making brutal mistakes game in and game out, and still never drawing in. I'm not saying he should be playing every game, but you could easily make a big case for him having played 3 or 4 games recently.

Yeah, can't argue there. It doesn't look good on us at all. If Corvo sucked badly, then that's one thing, but he doesn't - and there are others who absolutely do deserve to be sitting.

Yah, I rip on Edmonton all the time but what's going on in Ottawa isn't much better either. Murray has seriously miscalculated his D at this and Corvo is sitting night in and night out for no reason other than they want the young guys to play. That is total BS. He's been fine to good when he's played and this is coming from someone who isn't crazy about the player.

They need to make a move to clear up some spots and do it quickly because right now you can tell there are bad attitudes and hurt feelings seeping into the locker room and it's translating on ice.

Start building the damn team again and create a focus for the group. Having guys pulling in 100 different directions is not a good thing.

I'm with buddy, Murray isn't taking nearly enough blame here. Moving Gonchar, then Alfie leaving, the Corvo signing, too many 4th liners taking up roster spots and 8 D... way too many cooks in the kitchen.

Ev wrote:He's making almost $1 million doing pretty much nothing. How is that a bad thing? He's not a star nor should he be guaranteed playing time. This is Joe Corvo, a 6-7 D who we knew wouldn't play every game (Corvo said this as well).

Murray doesn't choose who plays and who doesn't. That's MacLean.

He's not even the 6th, 7th D man. I guarantee you Murray said before he signed "you are going to be in the lineup some nights and out others, we are signing you to be the 6th, 7th D man". At no point in that convo did he say "yah, we are going to humiliate you and make sure you never play".

You can tell in MacLean's presser he isn't happy with what's going on either. He's being forced to play the guys he's been given, his hands are 100% tied.

Neely - are you suggesting Murray is telling PMac who he can and can't play? Or are you simply saying PMac doesn't like the players he has to choose from at the moment.

Two very different things.

shabbs wrote:Neely - are you suggesting Murray is telling PMac who he can and can't play? Or are you simply saying PMac doesn't like the players he has to choose from at the moment.

Two very different things.

I'm saying MacLean is stuck in who he can play and he has the players he likes (Cowen for example) and the players he doesn't (Wiercioch).  He wants his teams to skate, hit, pass, shoot, that's it.  He doesn't want them to screw around in their own zone, he doesn't want them to skate through the whole team but players refuse to listen.

The Sens last year were the best coached team in the NHL, no question.  Everyone bought in.  Right now Murray has handcuffed the Sens to players who either A) didn't need to be here like Corvo or B) giving Wiercioch way more than he was ready for, earned, or could handle.

The other thing MacLean is doing is showing Spezza for what he is to Murray right now IMO. Basically saying "this is what I have, it's up to you change it if you don't like it". Don't think things are rosey with MacLean and Murray right now, no chance.

And again, I look directly at Jason Spezza, Murray has stuck by the guy for his entire tenure in Ottawa as coach and GM. He's convinced him to stay, he's signed him to a super long term deal, he's made him the captain, at some point the guy is going to have to cut bait man because it isn't working.

If Murray truly believes if he trades Spezza or doesn't resign him he will have to go out and find another Jason Spezza then perhaps it's time he moves on as well.

NEELY wrote:The Sens last year were the best coached team in the NHL, no question.  Everyone bought in.  Right now Murray has handcuffed the Sens to players who either A) didn't need to be here like Corvo or B) giving Wiercioch way more than he was ready for, earned, or could handle.

But that's the problem I have, we've hardly changed the roster from last year outside of Alfie/Gonchar out and Ryan/Corvo in. We're healthier arguably as we aren't missing Anderson, Karlsson, Spezza and Michalek etc...

Why is there no buy in this year?

I think we're just turning this into a soap opera and exaggerating a little.

Let things play out.

 

That's pretty challenged considering Mac coached Spezza to a ridiculously good season where he and Karlsson pretty much led the team to the playoffs.  Murray would say - yeah, I know who you have, you've had him and had success.  Do your Cussing job.

This is becoming pretty crazy around here lol.

shabbs wrote:

NEELY wrote:The Sens last year were the best coached team in the NHL, no question.  Everyone bought in.  Right now Murray has handcuffed the Sens to players who either A) didn't need to be here like Corvo or B) giving Wiercioch way more than he was ready for, earned, or could handle.

But that's the problem I have, we've hardly changed the roster from last year outside of Alfie/Gonchar out and Ryan/Corvo in. We're healthier arguably as we aren't missing Anderson, Karlsson, Spezza and Michalek etc...

Why is there no buy in this year?

Did not play last year. They made the playoffs without him, they won a playoff round without him, everything the accomplished last year was without him. The other guys played good chunks of the season.

Michalek is an after thought at this point though.

SpezDispenser wrote: 

That's pretty challenged considering Mac coached Spezza to a ridiculously good season where he and Karlsson pretty much led the team to the playoffs.  Murray would say - yeah, I know who you have, you've had him and had success.  Do your Cussing job.

This is becoming pretty crazy around here lol.

Spezza always plays well for new coaches to start, always. Then he reverts, this is why he is a coach killer. 6 NHL coaches in 9-10 NHL seasons. That's insane.

He could coach the Sens last year with guys will to learn and buy in, this year he has a leader and captain that refuses to.

Ev wrote:I think we're just turning this into a soap opera and exaggerating a little.

Let things play out.

Gonna have to.

NEELY wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote: 

That's pretty challenged considering Mac coached Spezza to a ridiculously good season where he and Karlsson pretty much led the team to the playoffs.  Murray would say - yeah, I know who you have, you've had him and had success.  Do your Cussing job.

This is becoming pretty crazy around here lol.

Spezza always plays well for new coaches to start, always.  Then he reverts, this is why he is a coach killer.  6 NHL coaches in 9-10 NHL seasons.  That's insane.  

He could coach the Sens last year with guys will to learn and buy in, this year he has a leader and captain that refuses to.

Harstburg doesn't count, neither does Paddock. Both challenged. Murray left by his own volition. Really the only coaches I can remember was Martin, Murray (his own choice to leave) and MacLean. Who am I missing?

Can I add an aka to the GDT edition?
How about the - It's all Spezza's fault edition?

Spezza is the coach killer on the team that Alfie captained forever. lol