Nail Yakupov Thread

NEELY wrote:

Dash wrote:Washington has done almost everything right. They set themselves up and have the best winger in the NHL and a franchise center, but until recently, they did not have great goaltender. I think Vokoun will make a difference. It's once you have those key players that you need your role players.

Debatable. As far as I know they still have Semin there.

Then you have a team like Colorado who is drafting all the right talent it seems but is making all the wrong decisions off the ice. That team will fail because of awful coaching and managment.

Hence the "almost" ....

Dash wrote:Ward has won a Conn Smythe and Stanley Cup. Skinner won the Calder, that says quite a lot. Ryan has scored no less than 30 goals in his past 3 seasons in the NHL. That's something not to many Sens picks can say in the past 5 years.

Only thing any Sens have done, is win the Calder Cup, and that was only a few guys that actually played in Ottawa. Last Senator two win an award was Aflie? I know that awards are individual and the only hardware that matters is Stanley, but teams that have a player worthy of an award are good teams.

Wasn't a lotto pick, I believe he was 25th or around there. Skinner was a nice draft pick, no doubt about it. Staal was one player drafted in the top 3 that they have on their team, that's it. They won a Cup because of a lot of other moves and because Ward pulled the "once every 20 years or so" BS.

There are more top 5 picks that have not turned into franchise players than actually have.

Oh I agree with the Sens having done nothing to prove that they are going to be contenders soon. Winning the Calder Cup isn't the biggest deal as most players on that team will not play in the NHL.

This year though, you will be able to get a potential star forward later than usual as this is the year of the defenseman, so Ottawa does not need to tank. I don't even think Yakupov will go first overall this year...

22_4_ever wrote:There is a flip side, a team like Washington. I know they have yet to produce in the playoffs, but 2 bad years set this team up. Ovechkin picked 1st overall in 2004 (? I think ?) and then 2 years later Backstrom picked 4th overall.

Those two players are a HUGE reason (IMHO) for them turning into a contender. Just an aside but losing Bradely to me is a huge issue and will show this year in that I don't think they have a shot.

Not sure if serious.

NEELY wrote:

22_4_ever wrote:There is a flip side, a team like Washington. I know they have yet to produce in the playoffs, but 2 bad years set this team up. Ovechkin picked 1st overall in 2004 (? I think ?) and then 2 years later Backstrom picked 4th overall.

Those two players are a HUGE reason (IMHO) for them turning into a contender. Just an aside but losing Bradely to me is a huge issue and will show this year in that I don't think they have a shot.

I'm not gonan sit here and say that drafting in the top 5 won't help a franchise long term, but the best teams (long terms) always find a way to draft the best players and develop them.

For every Pitts there is a Florida, for every Chicago there is a Columbus. The point is failing doesn't gaurantee anything.

Is this years 1st overall going to be an Ovechkin or a Daigle? Will he fall somewhere in the middle? Will the best player from the draft even be a top 10 pick? Winning organizations try to win every night, week, year.

Agreed...

I guess the point we're all making is you have to have a great scouting staff and every once in a while draft in the top 10. But more than anything make the right moves away from the draft. Teams like Detroit who are always in the playoffs yet don't draft in the top 10 are obviously doing something better than teams who consistently draft in the top 10.

Then again i'm 40+ so what the hell do I know.

This thread is officially DEREAILED! :D

And I can also make the argument that for every Florida, Islanders and Columbus, that there are teams that will spend more money and have a better scouting staff. Florida has had some good players, they just can't afford to keep them and they haven't done anything as a franchise to keep them satisfied.

Here are the first overall picks from the past 10 years.

Ilya Kovalchuk
Rick Nash
Marc-Andre Fleury
Alexander Ovechkin
Sidney Crosby
Erik Johnson
Patrick Kane
Steven Stamkos
John Tavares
Taylor Hall
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins

The last two are still in the air. Hall played well for the short season he had. Erik Johnson is not elite, but he could still be decent. Picks 1,2,4,5 and 8 are franchise IMO. I'd take Nash any day of the week. He encompasses everything from skill, speed and size.

So yeah, again, holding the top pick is normally a very good thing. There are exceptions and a lot of those are blamed on the team, not the player. And yeah, there are players taken later in those rounds, or even in later rounds that are as god or better than the guy taken 1st.

Evan, if 2012 is a defenceman's draft, how many teams will actually take D? Fowler, Gormley, and others have dropped a lot in favour of forwards. Still early, but I think Yakupov will go #1.

Dash wrote:And I can also make the argument that for every Florida, Islanders and Columbus, that there are teams that will spend more money and have a better scouting staff. Florida has had some good players, they just can't afford to keep them and they haven't done anything as a franchise to keep them satisfied.

Here are the first overall picks from the past 10 years.

Ilya Kovalchuk
Rick Nash
Marc-Andre Fleury
Alexander Ovechkin
Sidney Crosby
Erik Johnson
Patrick Kane
Steven Stamkos
John Tavares
Taylor Hall
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins

The last two are still in the air. Hall played well for the short season he had. Erik Johnson is not elite, but he could still be decent. Picks 1,2,4,5 and 8 are franchise IMO. I'd take Nash any day of the week. He encompasses everything from skill, speed and size.

So yeah, again, holding the top pick is normally a very good thing. There are exceptions and a lot of those are blamed on the team, not the player. And yeah, there are players taken later in those rounds, or even in later rounds that are as god or better than the guy taken 1st.

How many of those teams actually finished deadlast? Also, Kovalchuk is as much a franchise player as Semin us. Nash, sure, but he's been in the playoffs exactly once in the last what? 8, 9 years?

You are looking at individual players and their talent, not what their teams have done in the last decade. If that list shows anything in terms of results (winning), it's that the 1st overall gauarentee's nothing but jersey sales.

Stamkos was a huge part of Tampa's success, Hall almost brought Edmonton out of the basement, then got injured and the team plummeted to the bottom. I think if Hall had stayed healthy, Ottawa's got a top 3 pick.

Crosby and Fleury, enough said. Ovechkin's single handedly provided the majority of Washington's offence and saved the team from bankruptcy and relocation.

Nash is unfortunately on Columbus, and the team as a whole has not done anything.

Kovalchuk was an offensive beast. Having him on your team usually meant 50 goals guaranteed.

Ottawa doesn't have to finish dead last, but it helps. They finished 4th or 5th and lost the lottery and thus picked 6th.

Hall got hurt in March. I think the Oilers were terrible before then too.

Big Ev wrote:This thread is officially DEREAILED! :D

Yeah, we should nail it up again.

Nicely played Prager.

According to TSN's profile page, Taylor Hall was injured March 5. Was later than I thought it was. Missed last 17 games of season and still led the team with 22 goals.

Trying to find out what their record was, but I do remember they were ahead of Ottawa for a while, but then combined with Hall's injury and Anderson's arrival in Ottawa, things changed.

Edit: I was attempting to calculate their record from Oct. 7, 2010 - Mar. 5, 2011 using Yahoos! scores/schedule but everytime I try to view January 2011, it takes me to September, 2011 for the 2011-12 season, and despite a few attempts to bypass and view January 2011, I cannot. Any help?

At the end of Dec, they were, according to my results, 17-22-10, which would have given them.... 44 pts.

Edmonton won't win without any D men or goaltending. Put all the offense together you want but Stanley Cup winning teams are not all offense, they have solid goaltending and usually fantastic to great defense.

Ottawa is actually ahead of Edmonton in the rebuild, they just don't have that huge name upfront.

True, which is why many thought Larsson would have been the better pick for Edmonton, who already had Horcoff, Gagner and Eberle on their depth charts as C's. (Does Eberle even play C?)

They have Tuebert who could be a solid shutdown guy. Add another top 5 pick that they could use for a defenceman. As for a goalie, yeah they don't have too many prospects. Olivier Roy is probably their best on, maybe Bunz.

Edit: Edmonton also suffers from not being able to attract any free agents, at least not the top ones. They had to sign Dustin Penner via offer sheet which set them back in their rebuild. They lost a future HOF d-man in Pronger. But they do have an amazing owner. With time, they should have no issues luring free agents to play with Hall, Eberle, Nugent-Hopkins, Paajarvi, etc.

Florida cannot retain their young players for long, and seems that only old players want to play out their careers in Florida.

We'll see what Edmonton does but D men take longer to develop and who knows how long it will take for them to really compete in their own division, let alone in the conferance.

I'll take Ottawa's prospects over Edmonton's because Ottawa is developing them the correct way and building the team with a focus of defense first and team toughness... they also are not desperate for a number 1 center... Edmonton is.

I prefer Lian Vopukay. He's gonna be a stud. Plays for Dynamo.

I think it's a slightly better chance (to be safe) that Hall and RNH are more likely to be #1LW and #1C than any of Ottawa's prospects.

Ottawa's only (recently and still far from) grand slam is Karlsson. Guys like Prince, Peumpel, Noesen and Zibanejad and Silfverberg and Petersson are still unknown.