Last weekend for Murray / Clouston

As much as I hate Toronto I'd say they are ahead of us. They've been 'rebuilding' under Burke for a while now.

Sens only decided halfway this year to rebuild.

The uncertainty in the GM and coaching positions makes it harder to call. If Murray sticks around we know roughly what to expect.

I'm not sure any other GM could do better than Murray given our situation right now.

Hoags wrote:As much as I hate Toronto I'd say they are ahead of us. They've been 'rebuilding' under Burke for a while now.

Sens only decided halfway this year to rebuild.

The uncertainty in the GM and coaching positions makes it harder to call. If Murray sticks around we know roughly what to expect.

I'm not sure any other GM could do better than Murray given our situation right now.

Leafs have been re-building for 6 yrs.
Sens have been re-building for 2 months. (not including the last couple of drafts)

Yeah I would say the Leafs are ahead of the Sens in the re-build. At that rate.. they should be.

But their prospects on the Marlies will not see playoffs this year... and with 1 more win.. Ottawa prospects will.. And most of those prospects in Bingo are rookies -- and for the last 6 weeks their best players have been in Ottawa... but they still made that playoff push... so whose prospects are better right now?

sandysensfan wrote:

Hoags wrote:As much as I hate Toronto I'd say they are ahead of us. They've been 'rebuilding' under Burke for a while now.

Sens only decided halfway this year to rebuild.

The uncertainty in the GM and coaching positions makes it harder to call. If Murray sticks around we know roughly what to expect.

I'm not sure any other GM could do better than Murray given our situation right now.

Leafs have been re-building for 6 yrs.
Sens have been re-building for 2 months. (not including the last couple of drafts)

Yeah I would say the Leafs are ahead of the Sens in the re-build. At that rate.. they should be.

But their prospects on the Marlies will not see playoffs this year... and with 1 more win.. Ottawa prospects will.. And most of those prospects in Bingo are rookies -- and for the last 6 weeks their best players have been in Ottawa... but they still made that playoff push... so whose prospects are better right now?

Toronto has not been rebuilding for 6 years. They only really started when Burke took over.

How well your AHL team is doing doesn't necessarily show how good your prospects are. I honestly couldn't care less if Binghamton was a basement dweller - most of the players on that team will never see NHL ice. Hamilton won the Calder Cup a couple of years back, that didn't mean the Habs had the best prospects. Toronto's forward prospects kill ours right now.

Case in point, Ottawa's two best prospects are not in the AHL.

Maybe not "kills" but certainly looking better (depending on who we pick this year).

Kadri and Colborne alone > any two forward prospect we have (at the moment).

I'm listening to McGuire right now. Nothing about being the Sens GM though for some raisin.

Either because he knows he is the GM (so why bother talking about it) or he knows that BM is there for another year.

I'm not sure why we're saying the Leafs are ahead of the Sens in terms of rebuilding. Yeah, the Leafs have a couple decent forward prospects in Kadri and Colborne, but those guys are both unproven commodities right now. Much like Ottawa's D prospects are still unproven. We can't judge the "success" of a rebuild until…well…the team's been "rebuilt". Given the fact that it's taken the Leafs YEARS to get where they are now, you gotta think Ottawa has done the better job thus far, given the D prospects, cap space, and # of picks for this draft. We should compare the depth of the talent pools on both teams AFTER the draft and free agency, then let's have this conversation again.

The Leafs might be a better team than The Sens right now, I don't see how they are in a better position in terms of rebuilding than The Sens are though.

They are being built to be a middle of the pack team right now. Their downside is probably only 9th ro 10th best in The East, their upside is probably only 6th-8th in The East as well. They are built to be average once again.

Ottawa is going to add a potential franchise player in this years draft along with what is already a number 1 center in Spezza, a number 1 goalie in Anderson, and the deepest group of blueline talent Ottawa has seen in 10 years.

It won't be close in 5 or 6 years who the better team is, right now though and probably for the next year or two, Toronto is up a little on Ottawa and even then, next year will be tight between the two.

Just wish Murray blew up the team sooner. Trying to prop that team up with the likes of Gonchar and Kovalev

Leafs have 3 30g scorers, we don't even have one and Spezza is the only one who could conceivably do it right now. Kadri and Colborne should improve them further. We're hoping Foligno and Regin get it together (again).

Our defence should be better and cheaper than theirs in the future.

Our goaltending is better and more proven.

Really depends on who we get this draft, should be good !

Has the transition of power been initiated yet?

Big Ev wrote:Maybe not "kills" but certainly looking better (depending on who we pick this year).

Kadri and Colborne alone > any two forward prospect we have (at the moment).

Really? I tend to disagree... who is Colbourne?

Big Ev wrote:

sandysensfan wrote:

Hoags wrote:As much as I hate Toronto I'd say they are ahead of us. They've been 'rebuilding' under Burke for a while now.

Sens only decided halfway this year to rebuild.

The uncertainty in the GM and coaching positions makes it harder to call. If Murray sticks around we know roughly what to expect.

I'm not sure any other GM could do better than Murray given our situation right now.

Leafs have been re-building for 6 yrs.
Sens have been re-building for 2 months. (not including the last couple of drafts)

Yeah I would say the Leafs are ahead of the Sens in the re-build. At that rate.. they should be.

But their prospects on the Marlies will not see playoffs this year... and with 1 more win.. Ottawa prospects will.. And most of those prospects in Bingo are rookies -- and for the last 6 weeks their best players have been in Ottawa... but they still made that playoff push... so whose prospects are better right now?

Toronto has not been rebuilding for 6 years. They only really started when Burke took over.

How well your AHL team is doing doesn't necessarily show how good your prospects are. I honestly couldn't care less if Binghamton was a basement dweller - most of the players on that team will never see NHL ice. Hamilton won the Calder Cup a couple of years back, that didn't mean the Habs had the best prospects. Toronto's forward prospects kill ours right now.

Case in point, Ottawa's two best prospects are not in the AHL.

I would think if you had bad prospects (like Sens had under Muckler - be that none) they would have a crappy AHL team.. which Bingo has had since the lockout until this year.
Good prospects win games. We don't know how many will make the NHL or not.. a lot of those guys are rookies. But some of the best are now with Ottawa in Greening, Butler, Condra, Weircoch -- I think those 4 will make the NHL -- do you?
To have any chance of prospects to make the NHL they have to be good in the AHL do they not?

sandysensfan wrote:

Big Ev wrote:Maybe not "kills" but certainly looking better (depending on who we pick this year).

Kadri and Colborne alone > any two forward prospect we have (at the moment).

Really? I tend to disagree... who is Colbourne?

Joe Colborne? Traded in the Kaberle deal?

Nobody can disagree with that, it's fact. If you do, you're just being blind, sorry. Name me two players better than those guys who we own. You can't. And don't say Colin Greening or Erik Condra

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I'm listening to McGuire right now. Nothing about being the Sens GM though for some raisin.

I guess McGuire is not going to be the new GM... all he does now is trash the team and any moves they make.

sandysensfan wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I'm listening to McGuire right now. Nothing about being the Sens GM though for some raisin.

I guess McGuire is not going to be the new GM... all he does now is trash the team and any moves they make.

Ottawa fans are so sensitive

sandysensfan wrote:
I guess McGuire is not going to be the new GM... all he does now is trash the team and any moves they make.

There's plenty of better candidates, Paul Fenton, Craig Billington etc.

I'm shocked McGuire gets so much mention.

Kadri has 3 goals in 26 games; Colborne has 0 in 0.

Greening has 6 in 22, has 37 lbs on Kadri while not giving up any speed. Condra has 6 in 23. Butler has 7 in 35.

While I'm not suggesting that Greening, Condra and Butler will play 82 games next season and score a combined 60 goals, I just don't see how Toronto's prospects are seen as way ahead of Ottawa's.

The Leafs have 3 30-goal scorers (I'll take 29 from Grabovski and Kulemin) and a 20 goal scorer. But if those guys take up the top-six then there's no way that Colborne or Kadri will get the ice time to score more than the mid-teens. And if Kadri/Colborne take ice time away from Grabovski/Kulemin/Macarthur I think their totals will take a hit, too.

The Sens, if they stay healthy, should get 30+ from Spezza and possibly from Alfie and Michalek, too. Foligno could get to 20+ and who knows what our lottery pick will get. But we could have the likes of Greening/Condra/Butler on the third line, with each of them contributing in the mid-to-high teens.

It will certainly be interesting to see how all of these meaningless stats will translate into a full season on-ice, but I just don't understand why everyone just nods their heads and "agrees" that the Leafs have better forward prospects.

Hoags wrote:Just wish Murray blew up the team sooner. Trying to prop that team up with the likes of Gonchar and Kovalev

Leafs have 3 30g scorers, we don't even have one and Spezza is the only one who could conceivably do it right now. Kadri and Colborne should improve them further. We're hoping Foligno and Regin get it together (again).

Our defence should be better and cheaper than theirs in the future.

Our goaltending is better and more proven.

Really depends on who we get this draft, should be good !

They had to wait to this year to do the re-build as before this year there was no prospects in Bingo to bring up to take the place of the traded players.
The depth of the prospects is now looking good -- both from Europe and NA. Sens have 3 prospects in the frozen four -- Blood, Caporusso & Costello (I believe).