2011 NHL Entry Draft Watch

SDH89 wrote:I still think a couple of the lottery teams: Islanders, Oilers and Devils could use defenceman, so you never know.

I missed your post, but yes, I just said the same thing. Not sure what they think, but from my point of view, those 3 teams should be looking defence first.

The problem lies in the fact that there is only 2 stud defencemen in the draft and 3 teams want them IMO. Something has to give; maybe we will see Garth Snow trade down again.

Big Ev wrote:I'd be shocked if the Oilers and Devils don't draft a d-man. NYI on the other hand have some good D already (Streit, MacDonald) and some intriguing D prospects (de Haan, Hamonic), so they my be better off picking a forward (and it could be Couturier, who would be really nice as a 2nd line centre behind Tavares. I've read that his pro game could be like Jordan Staal's so he may be perfect in that role for the Isles.

So we can still get Landeskog or RNH!

The Oilers need a centre for Hall and Eberle.

marakh wrote:Hopefully RNH keeps it quiet til the end of the season and falls a bit in the 4-6 range. TO me he's still easily the most skilled player in the draft.

RNH is my choice out of this draft, too. A lot of people are getting swept up in the Landeskog hype, which is understandable:

• Swedish but also seemingly Canadian
  
• Leadership + intangibles
  
• Power-forward style
  
• Scores goals, at least at the Junior level
  
• Beastly defensively
  
• I'm told he's quite handsome

But the fact remains, at least in my opinion, that RNH's offensive ceiling is (maybe quite a bit) higher than GL's. Where Landeskog should succeed is in a position like Skinner this year, on a team already featuring a big-time centre. I guess some could argue we have that in Spezza, but the injuries on his part are starting to get worrisome/irritating to me and I'd rather take the opportunity to move away from our dependency on Spezza rather than continue to build around him.

Of course, the problem with RNH from a fan perspective is he's way less NHL-ready than Landeskog. Duchene is often cited as a comparable in style to RNH, but MD was considerably more physically developed at the draft. This also brings up the fact that RNH is a bit of a risk - whereas Landeskog possibly has the upside of being a 2005-2008 Morrow or Mike Richards type, he also comes with an NHL-calibre downside, and a middle that's good as well (say, 20-25 goal, 20-25 assist-style good Fisher from last decade). RNH has more bust potential because of question marks about his weight/strength and his low goal-totals at the Junior level. On the flip side, though, if RNH can get significantly stronger and overcome his pass-first, pass-only mentality, he could be a really special player in the NHL.

This draft is fairly good as far as depth picks in the first are concerned, but it doesn't boast much by way of super-elite prospects, with the possible exception of Larsson. I'd rather have Hall, Seguin, Tavares, Duchene, Stamkos, Kane etc. over any of the forwards in this draft. But I will say that the character of the forwards seems to me less questionable than in years past. There were questions, especially about Hall, last year, for example. But RNH in his interviews really strikes me as a humble, down-to-earth, nice kid. And obviously no one's questioning Landeskog's character.

EDIT: Of course, I'd be ecstatic to land either of these guys and I doubt we're in that position on draft day.

Another gem from Asq2.

Haha, I was coming in here to pronounce my undying love for Landeskog until I read Asq's write-up.

I don't know if people have noticed but we have a legitimate shot at the 2nd overall pick this year. The Oilers and Islanders both have 2 games in hand on us and are 5 and 6 points back of the Sens respectively. With a lot of games to play we could realistically be looking at the second overall pick.

Edit: I know it could be worse or maybe even better depending on how the lottery goes of course.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:I don't know if people have noticed but we have a legitimate shot at the 2nd overall pick this year. The Oilers and Islanders both have 2 games in hand on us and are 5 and 6 points back of the Sens respectively. With a lot of games to play we could realistically be looking at the second overall pick.

Edit: I know it could be worse or maybe even better depending on how the lottery goes of course.

God, I hope so. My loins literally ache for Gabriel Landeskog. Of course, I'd be happy with RNH, but Landeskog has it all. Top two guarantees us that we'll get one of them (or the guy we want). Maybe, we'll luck out and have someone a couple spots lower trade up for our 2nd overall to grab Larsson and we still get one of RNH/Landeskog/Couturier.

hemlock wrote:

God, I hope so. My loins literally ache for Gabriel Landeskog. Of course, I'd be happy with RNH, but Landeskog has it all. Top two guarantees us that we'll get one of them (or the guy we want). Maybe, we'll luck out and have someone a couple spots lower trade up for our 2nd overall to grab Larsson and we still get one of RNH/Landeskog/Couturier.

That's going a little far ... maybe you need to look into other sources of entertainment...

TheAvatar wrote:

hemlock wrote:

God, I hope so. My loins literally ache for Gabriel Landeskog. Of course, I'd be happy with RNH, but Landeskog has it all. Top two guarantees us that we'll get one of them (or the guy we want). Maybe, we'll luck out and have someone a couple spots lower trade up for our 2nd overall to grab Larsson and we still get one of RNH/Landeskog/Couturier.

That's going a little far ... maybe you need to look into other sources of entertainment...

Haha. The draft is what? 6 months away and I'm already counting down the days. It will be exciting time as a Sens fan. By then, it'll have been a decade since we drafted a blue chip forward prospect. Kinda sad actually.

SpezDispenser wrote:Haha, I was coming in here to pronounce my undying love for Landeskog until I read Asq's write-up.

Hey, Landeskog's awesome, no question. But I see him more as a guy who could take over a playoff game, and less so as a guy you could build an offence around. Granted I'm not even sure RNH is a guy you can build an offence around, but his ultimate upside is higher and I think being a centre gives him a leg-up on developing into the focal point of his line.

But RNH is a much bigger candidate to fall on draft day than Landeskog, IMO.

hemlock wrote:God, I hope so. My loins literally ache for Gabriel Landeskog. Of course, I'd be happy with RNH, but Landeskog has it all. Top two guarantees us that we'll get one of them (or the guy we want). Maybe, we'll luck out and have someone a couple spots lower trade up for our 2nd overall to grab Larsson and we still get one of RNH/Landeskog/Couturier.

I'm like 80% sure the Devils will take Larsson. They already have Kovalchuk (lol), Parise (potentially), Zajac, Tedenby, Josefson etc. up front and they're dying for lack of defencemen. Plus I still think Larsson is the best prospect in the draft.

A lot of Isles fans seem pretty confident they'll take Couturier, although some have mentioned that Landeskog has all the Garth Snow qualities in a draft pick. From a position stand-point, though, they have Okposo, Tavares (whom the Isles fans seem to think should end up at wing), Niederreiter, Petrov, Joensuu, Kabanov, Comeau etc. on the wings and only Bailey and Nelson at centre. It probably makes more sense for them to add Couturier.

If Edmonton's picking next and Larsson or Couturier are off the board, they might see Landeskog as the BPA but they might also see that they need a centre (RNH) or defenceman (Murphy, though he's dropping) considerably more than another winger. RNH is a good candidate to go to E-Town IMO, to play between Hall and Eberle.

If we were picking fourth, we'd be in a position to draft Landeskog. I strongly suspect Boston would take him if Toronto were ahead of (below) us, but they could also desperately use a defenceman like Murphy.

Getting Landeskog would give us our future captain, an all-situations guy, a guy who would not put up with any rough stuff against his team-mates, and a guy with the potential to score timely goals and be a big factor in the playoffs, but probably not someone who could be the #1 offensive option on a successful team (or arguably even #2, depending on the #1 option).

Best-case scenario for Landeskog is he becomes like the winger version of Toews or Richards in terms of role (and I think they're both better offensive players than Landeskog is), but even they have only been successful with guys like Kane, Giroux, Carter, Hossa/Havlat, Briere, Sharp etc. around them.

Rome wasn't built in a day, though.

asq2 wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:Haha, I was coming in here to pronounce my undying love for Landeskog until I read Asq's write-up.

Hey, Landeskog's awesome, no question. But I see him more as a guy who could take over a playoff game, and less so as a guy you could build an offence around. Granted I'm not even sure RNH is a guy you can build an offence around, but his ultimate upside is higher and I think being a centre gives him a leg-up on developing into the focal point of his line.

But RNH is a much bigger candidate to fall on draft day than Landeskog, IMO.

hemlock wrote:God, I hope so. My loins literally ache for Gabriel Landeskog. Of course, I'd be happy with RNH, but Landeskog has it all. Top two guarantees us that we'll get one of them (or the guy we want). Maybe, we'll luck out and have someone a couple spots lower trade up for our 2nd overall to grab Larsson and we still get one of RNH/Landeskog/Couturier.

I'm like 80% sure the Devils will take Larsson. They already have Kovalchuk (lol), Parise (potentially), Zajac, Tedenby, Josefson etc. up front and they're dying for lack of defencemen. Plus I still think Larsson is the best prospect in the draft.

A lot of Isles fans seem pretty confident they'll take Couturier, although some have mentioned that Landeskog has all the Garth Snow qualities in a draft pick. From a position stand-point, though, they have Okposo, Tavares (whom the Isles fans seem to think should end up at wing), Niederreiter, Petrov, Joensuu, Kabanov, Comeau etc. on the wings and only Bailey and Nelson at centre. It probably makes more sense for them to add Couturier.

If Edmonton's picking next and Larsson or Couturier are off the board, they might see Landeskog as the BPA but they might also see that they need a centre (RNH) or defenceman (Murphy, though he's dropping) considerably more than another winger. RNH is a good candidate to go to E-Town IMO, to play between Hall and Eberle.

If we were picking fourth, we'd be in a position to draft Landeskog. I strongly suspect Boston would take him if Toronto were ahead of (below) us, but they could also desperately use a defenceman like Murphy.

Getting Landeskog would give us our future captain, an all-situations guy, a guy who would not put up with any rough stuff against his team-mates, and a guy with the potential to score timely goals and be a big factor in the playoffs, but probably not someone who could be the #1 offensive option on a successful team (or arguably even #2, depending on the #1 option).

Best-case scenario for Landeskog is he becomes like the winger version of Toews or Richards in terms of role (and I think they're both better offensive players than Landeskog is), but even they have only been successful with guys like Kane, Giroux, Carter, Hossa/Havlat, Briere, Sharp etc. around them.

Rome wasn't built in a day, though.

Nice write up as usual.

The key for me as far as Landeskog goes is that he's got everything you look for in a player. If we start trading guys like Fisher and Phillips and The Alfie retires, we'll be in need of some leadership and character.

Like you said, he's probably not the #1 option offensively, but I am fine with that because of everything else he brings. RNH is a higher risk/higher reward selection, but still one I'd welcome with open arms.

Actually, if we pick fourth (I don't think 2nd or 3rd is out of the realm of possibility now that the Islanders are playing better) we'll land our best offensive prospect since Jason Spezza was drafted. Something to get excited about for sure.

hemlock wrote:Nice write up as usual.

The key for me as far as Landeskog goes is that he's got everything you look for in a player. If we start trading guys like Fisher and Phillips and The Alfie retires, we'll be in need of some leadership and character.

Like you said, he's probably not the #1 option offensively, but I am fine with that because of everything else he brings. RNH is a higher risk/higher reward selection, but still one I'd welcome with open arms.

Actually, if we pick fourth (I don't think 2nd or 3rd is out of the realm of possibility now that the Islanders are playing better) we'll land our best offensive prospect since Jason Spezza was drafted. Something to get excited about for sure.

Oh, definitely. There's so much to like about Landeskog.

From a re-building perspective, though, I'm worried -- well, that's too strong a word -- that he's more a "make a good team great" than a "make a bad team good" type. Certainly the leadership and grit and defence and potential goal-scoring are going to help, but I just don't know if he can elevate a team as the focal point of its offence, rather than an awesome complementary piece who is the team leader in all other areas. Maybe I'm under-estimating his offensive abilities.

From a re-build perspective, I don't know if we aim to get a lottery pick in 2012. Granted, I don't know if we have a choice about that. But we should have some cap-space to work with, so we may try the fabled "Flyer Reload." With that in mind it's probably best to get an offensive focal point now -- I mean, who's going to centre Landeskog long-term, Silfverberg? Or do we go with Spezza, which would potentially be a nice combination? The downside there is we're still depending on Spezza and his injury issues rather than adding a potential replacement - which could, NTC and willing partner willing, let us trade him for some young wingers for RNH (of course, then Nugent-Hopkins wouldn't have any centre as a potential mentor figure on the team, but I don't know if Spezza is an ideal mentor anyway).

Probably the most hyped forward in the 2012 draft, Yakupov, is a winger. But there are some centres near the top in Galchenyuk and Grigorenko (I think he's a centre; he's listed as such on Russianprospects but I've never seen him play), so if we took Landeskog and promptly stunk again it's not like we'd have no options for finding him a centre.

I haven't really organized my thoughts (can you tell?) but jumping way back to the point about Landeskog being more of a complementary offensive player -- I think RNH's elite skating, both in terms of speed and maybe especially in terms of quickness/agility, coupled with his hands, shot, and vision, will allow him to create offence for himself. This is maybe more of a concern people might have with Couturier, and Landeskog although I wouldn't say he's a bad skater. But the Sens need speed (they need a lot of things, granted), and in general the game seems to be trending that way. Tavares, who is a better prospect than any of these guys, is struggling a bit (still has more points than any Sen) relative to Duchene in large part because of the difference in quality of their teams but also because his foot-speed limits his ability to create offence for himself, which is necessary for players on bad teams. But obviously foot-speed doesn't limit a player on a good team, although inequality in other areas could.

For RNH to be a focal point, he's got to get way stronger (like, 30-40 lbs stronger) while maintaining his agility and speed, and while learning to shoot more. But if he does that, he could be something else offensively, while boasting a pretty good, Datsyuk-style (though not calibre) defensive game. I think he can do it but there's also a risk that he struggles in the NHL because of how skinny he is.

This is almost like a Kane vs. Toews scenario, IMO. Except I don't think either is as good, but also the positions are reversed (I maintain that centre is a more important position than wing) and RNH strikes me as having much better character than PTK Jr.

I think the obvious solution is to just get them both.

BTW, here's Central Scouting's take on RNH. Apparently also Ken Hitchcock pointed to him at some on-ice thing and said "That's Sakic." Of course, a major difference is Sakic scored 60 goals in 72 games in the WHL in his draft year while RNH only has 10 so far, which legitimately raises some eye-brows.



EDIT: At least on HF, I should say that there is more of a divided opinion on RNH than there is on Landeskog. Some people really don't think he's special and above the "non-top-4" prospects in the draft. I don't know if that's a sentiment echoed amongst scouts.

Here's another list I found online. It's interesting to see the perspective of other people regarding the upcoming draft. Maybe there will be some hidden gems in there somewhere.

http://www.thescoutingreport.org/2011-nhl-entry-draft-preliminary-top-15/

I don't recognize some names mentioned in the top 10, but it's still early.

SensGirl11 wrote:Here's another list I found online. It's interesting to see the perspective of other people regarding the upcoming draft. Maybe there will be some hidden gems in there somewhere.

http://www.thescoutingreport.org/2011-nhl-entry-draft-preliminary-top-15/

I don't recognize some names mentioned in the top 10, but it's still early.

There's certainly 4 or so that I don't recognize. Musil's son is in there - I think - and if so, his pa was a work ethic freak, so I can see how he's rated so high.

Interesting stuff.