GAME DAY: Toronto Maple Leafs @ Ottawa Senators - 7:00pm ET - SAT. Jan. 1 2011

wprager wrote:I'm with you. Posted this in another thread -- we need a veteran on D with Karlsson, Cowen and possibly Rundblad all lacing them up with the big club next season. While Kuba is signed, I'd prefer Phillips as he *is* a leader. You don't throw away 10+ years because of one bad one. The guy's 32!!!! Give him a $4+$3+$2+$2 with a limited NTC and let him retire a Senator. Kuba, with just one year left, should be a fairly easy piece to move -- after all, a season that starts with a broken leg because of bad ice is easy enough to rationalize away.

Rebuilding isn't just dealing all your established players away and hoping your prospects magically develop. Culture of losing + lack of veteran advice usually = prolonged lousiness and poor player development.

Keep Phillips for next year but trade him at the deadline for some picks or prospects. Pretty easy decision, IMO.

asq2 wrote:

wprager wrote:I'm with you. Posted this in another thread -- we need a veteran on D with Karlsson, Cowen and possibly Rundblad all lacing them up with the big club next season. While Kuba is signed, I'd prefer Phillips as he *is* a leader. You don't throw away 10+ years because of one bad one. The guy's 32!!!! Give him a $4+$3+$2+$2 with a limited NTC and let him retire a Senator. Kuba, with just one year left, should be a fairly easy piece to move -- after all, a season that starts with a broken leg because of bad ice is easy enough to rationalize away.

Rebuilding isn't just dealing all your established players away and hoping your prospects magically develop. Culture of losing + lack of veteran advice usually = prolonged lousiness and poor player development.

Phillips doesn't draw fans, though. Nor is he married to a famous entertainer. He's a family man with roots in the area. Boooooooring.

asq2 wrote:So we move the 32 year old Phillips...who teaches Cowen the tricks of the NHL trade specific to his position? Matt Carkner?

Kind of like Gonchar teaching Karlsson you mean?

Who taught Phillips the tricks to play NHL D? I have no recollection who was on those past Senator teams...

SeawaySensFan wrote:

asq2 wrote:

wprager wrote:I'm with you. Posted this in another thread -- we need a veteran on D with Karlsson, Cowen and possibly Rundblad all lacing them up with the big club next season. While Kuba is signed, I'd prefer Phillips as he *is* a leader. You don't throw away 10+ years because of one bad one. The guy's 32!!!! Give him a $4+$3+$2+$2 with a limited NTC and let him retire a Senator. Kuba, with just one year left, should be a fairly easy piece to move -- after all, a season that starts with a broken leg because of bad ice is easy enough to rationalize away.

Rebuilding isn't just dealing all your established players away and hoping your prospects magically develop. Culture of losing + lack of veteran advice usually = prolonged lousiness and poor player development.

Phillips doesn't draw fans, though. Nor is he married to a famous entertainer. He's a family man with roots in the area. Boooooooring.

Oh, I dunno. Erin's easy on the eyes and you don't really need a good singing voice for Country; just some "twang" and that "hurt but pensive" look.



Although she maybe into some kinky stuff:

Big Ev wrote:Who taught Phillips the tricks to play NHL D? I have no recollection who was on those past Senator teams...

Lance Pitlick

Big Ev wrote:Who taught Phillips the tricks to play NHL D? I have no recollection who was on those past Senator teams...

Either Phil Von Stefinelli or Lance "Romance" Pitlick. It's been awhile.

Big Ev wrote:Who taught Phillips the tricks to play NHL D? I have no recollection who was on those past Senator teams...

Phillips was a #1 overall pick. He had the likes of Kravchuk, Laukkanen, York, Pitlick and Vial as "veterans" (only Kravchuk was 30). Redden was a sophomore.

hemlock wrote:

asq2 wrote:So we move the 32 year old Phillips...who teaches Cowen the tricks of the NHL trade specific to his position? Matt Carkner?

Kind of like Gonchar teaching Karlsson you mean?

Well first, I think Karlsson's hockey IQ is quite a bit higher than Cowen's. Second, we don't really know everything that goes on on the bench and in practices, but I'd bet Gonchar is a valuable mentor for EK, looking at what he did for Letang.

I dunno. Cowen will need someone to show him the ropes, IMO, and neither Carkner nor Gonchar is the guy to do it.

seriously, you guys think we'd be better off without phillips? he isn't playing well i grant ou but who is? something is off within the organization and it's putting this whole team out on the curb. i wouldn't throw the towel in with phillips. he's only 32.
what i would do is trade him wink wink/nudge nudge and re-sign him july 1st.
i agree with asq2, there's a reason florida, columbus and other bottom dwellers can seem to get out of the last spots and when their players leave to go somewhere else they flourish.

asq2 wrote:

hemlock wrote:

asq2 wrote:So we move the 32 year old Phillips...who teaches Cowen the tricks of the NHL trade specific to his position? Matt Carkner?

Kind of like Gonchar teaching Karlsson you mean?

Well first, I think Karlsson's hockey IQ is quite a bit higher than Cowen's. Second, we don't really know everything that goes on on the bench and in practices, but I'd bet Gonchar is a valuable mentor for EK, looking at what he did for Letang.

I dunno. Cowen will need someone to show him the ropes, IMO, and neither Carkner nor Gonchar is the guy to do it.

I was partially kidding. Off the ice, Gonchar is probably a good mentor, but I was referring to his less than stellar play, and his even worse effort. Those are the things I don't want rubbing off on Karlsson, or anyone else.

As far as Phillips mentoring Cowen, you're right that he'll need a mentor just as Karlsson did/does, but I really wonder if it's worth it to have a guy who's on-ice play is less than good just to have an off-ice mentor.

EDIT: Is there anyone here that could make a reasonable argument that Gonchar is worth what we are paying him now and for two more years factoring everything in (on-ice play and mentoring Karlsson et al.)? Because I sure can't justify it.

hemlock wrote:I was partially kidding. Off the ice, Gonchar is probably a good mentor, but I was referring to his less than stellar play, and his even worse effort. Those are the things I don't want rubbing off on Karlsson, or anyone else.

As far as Phillips mentoring Cowen, you're right that he'll need a mentor just as Karlsson did/does, but I really wonder if it's worth it to have a guy who's on-ice play is less than good just to have an off-ice mentor.

Well, we have to ask a couple of questions:

A) Will we get a better defenceman for equal/less money?
B) Will we be able to find another equally good/better mentor?

Cowen looks locked in to the LD spot opposite Karlsson in the future, so his development is quite important to this team long-term (that pairing could potentially play like 24/25+ minutes a night for us in all situations).

Also, if Phillips is the only D who is bad, then we'll be alright next season (we won't be competing for the Cup regardless). If the D in general is bad, then we'll be getting another high pick while developing our young players. Win-win (without any actual wins).

hemlock wrote:

asq2 wrote:

hemlock wrote:

asq2 wrote:So we move the 32 year old Phillips...who teaches Cowen the tricks of the NHL trade specific to his position? Matt Carkner?

Kind of like Gonchar teaching Karlsson you mean?

Well first, I think Karlsson's hockey IQ is quite a bit higher than Cowen's. Second, we don't really know everything that goes on on the bench and in practices, but I'd bet Gonchar is a valuable mentor for EK, looking at what he did for Letang.

I dunno. Cowen will need someone to show him the ropes, IMO, and neither Carkner nor Gonchar is the guy to do it.

I was partially kidding. Off the ice, Gonchar is probably a good mentor, but I was referring to his less than stellar play, and his even worse effort. Those are the things I don't want rubbing off on Karlsson, or anyone else.

As far as Phillips mentoring Cowen, you're right that he'll need a mentor just as Karlsson did/does, but I really wonder if it's worth it to have a guy who's on-ice play is less than good just to have an off-ice mentor.

EDIT: Is there anyone here that could make a reasonable argument that Gonchar is worth what we are paying him now and for two more years factoring everything in (on-ice play and mentoring Karlsson et al.)? Because I sure can't justify it.

who knows? maybe he'll play better next year. all i see this year is a team(an entire team) that looks like it's given up. i don't want to make excuse for the guy but i imagine it might feel like Dung to come from a team who's done more winning then not to a team like ottawa that is on the verge of a rebuild.

I would say the fact that he's a lock for the HOF and a regular 50-60 point producer means that he's in a slump and on a crappy team. Gonchar will be fine, he's a worry, but he's not the biggest worry right now.

kovalev is another matter. i'm suprised that anyone is suprised with the effort we are getting from him. from the start i knew this was going to be one big failed experiment.
i'm just happy he'll be gone at the end of the year. at least he took some of the heat off spezza from the media.

SpezDispenser wrote:I would say the fact that he's a lock for the HOF and a regular 50-60 point producer means that he's in a slump and on a crappy team. Gonchar will be fine, he's a worry, but he's not the biggest worry right now.

Not on this team. Not by a long shot. I'll be surpised if he cracks 40 points, which considering his defensive play is probably not what Murray thought he was getting when he signed this guy to a $5 million contract for 3 (what appears to be) painfully long years.

I'd love to see Gonchar turn things around but the team sucking seems like an excuse to me. His effort is downright deplorable at times. Jesse Winchester busts his Donkey every single second he's on the ice. Now I don't expect that sort of thing from Gonchar, but he ought to look like he gives a dman!

Flo The Action wrote:

hemlock wrote:

asq2 wrote:

hemlock wrote:

asq2 wrote:So we move the 32 year old Phillips...who teaches Cowen the tricks of the NHL trade specific to his position? Matt Carkner?

Kind of like Gonchar teaching Karlsson you mean?

Well first, I think Karlsson's hockey IQ is quite a bit higher than Cowen's. Second, we don't really know everything that goes on on the bench and in practices, but I'd bet Gonchar is a valuable mentor for EK, looking at what he did for Letang.

I dunno. Cowen will need someone to show him the ropes, IMO, and neither Carkner nor Gonchar is the guy to do it.

I was partially kidding. Off the ice, Gonchar is probably a good mentor, but I was referring to his less than stellar play, and his even worse effort. Those are the things I don't want rubbing off on Karlsson, or anyone else.

As far as Phillips mentoring Cowen, you're right that he'll need a mentor just as Karlsson did/does, but I really wonder if it's worth it to have a guy who's on-ice play is less than good just to have an off-ice mentor.

EDIT: Is there anyone here that could make a reasonable argument that Gonchar is worth what we are paying him now and for two more years factoring everything in (on-ice play and mentoring Karlsson et al.)? Because I sure can't justify it.

who knows? maybe he'll play better next year. all i see this year is a team(an entire team) that looks like it's given up. i don't want to make excuse for the guy but i imagine it might feel like Dung to come from a team who's done more winning then not to a team like ottawa that is on the verge of a rebuild.

And if he doesn't? Then what.

This wasn't a reasonable argument to the question I asked by the way. He doesn't feel good to come to a less succesful team? Boo Cussing Hoo. He has $15 million reasons to show up at the rink and put in an honest day's work.