Murray Appreciation Thread

SpezDispenser wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

caissie_1 wrote:He just keeps realing in some good young players... His trades could have been misses at time but everybody agreed that they were smart move's, they just backfired (Leclaire)..

Karlsson, Weirchoch, Cowen, Petterson, Silverberg, Lehner,

Sutton and Cullen

Im a believer!

Don't forget, it was Leclaire and Lehner from Columbus for a guy we weren't gonna pay 4 million.

He just got re-signed for 4 million a year by Columbus.

You make it seem like we moved him because of some outrageous salary demands.

SeawaySensFan wrote:
You make it seem like we moved him because of some outrageous salary demands.

Well, it was coming as well as Fisher taking his spot, 2nd line center.

3 more years? Murray is good at drafting and building a core, but we still need another GM to come in and tweak the team here and there to build a serious contender.

SpezDispenser wrote:

SeawaySensFan wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

caissie_1 wrote:He just keeps realing in some good young players... His trades could have been misses at time but everybody agreed that they were smart move's, they just backfired (Leclaire)..

Karlsson, Weirchoch, Cowen, Petterson, Silverberg, Lehner,

Sutton and Cullen

Im a believer!

Don't forget, it was Leclaire and Lehner from Columbus for a guy we weren't gonna pay 4 million.

He just got re-signed for 4 million a year by Columbus.

I know it's just a cap money for you, but $250,000 a year is a lot of money...

SpezDispenser wrote:

caissie_1 wrote:He just keeps realing in some good young players... His trades could have been misses at time but everybody agreed that they were smart move's, they just backfired (Leclaire)..

Karlsson, Weirchoch, Cowen, Petterson, Silverberg, Lehner,

Sutton and Cullen

Im a believer!

Don't forget, it was Leclaire and Lehner from Columbus for a guy we weren't gonna pay 4 million.

I need to temper expectations in here. Vermette's looking at a ~65 point season. We've got Leclaire, who was a resounding bust this year, and a kid who's still finding his way in junior hockey.

Maybe in a few years, or even possibly next year, we can look back on this trade and say "yeah, we did pretty good." But for now, it's obvious who won this trade. Whether he's getting paid $4 million or not, at least he's playing like it. Unlike the guy we're paying almost $4 million for.

PKC wrote:
I need to temper expectations in here. Vermette's looking at a ~65 point season. We've got Leclaire, who was a resounding bust this year, and a kid who's still finding his way in junior hockey.

Maybe in a few years, or even possibly next year, we can look back on this trade and say "yeah, we did pretty good." But for now, it's obvious who won this trade. Whether he's getting paid $4 million or not, at least he's playing like it. Unlike the guy we're paying almost $4 million for.

I doubt you need to temper expectations with many people here. Vermette's a good player, I liked him a lot, but it's safe to say there was little to no room for him here. Nice 2nd line center to have, but when he plays 2nd line center, he'll get 50 points, when he's setting up Nash and co., he'll get 65, basically the exact same as Fisher without the size. Remember how wildly inconsistent Vermette was? No way we were going down that road again after Fisher. Leclaire was a nice idea, we had high hopes for him, he crashed and burned. Given the choice, I'd trade him if I could find someone to take him, but if not, you'll have to admit that once given proper playing time he could be something pretty interesting.

Lehner to me is the key to the deal though. I like his pedigree and I like his work ethic. And yes, I realize he's still a prospect, but again, his work ethic and motivating factors - his dad especially - make me think we got a huge winner.

I'd do this deal again tomorrow if prompted.

Antoine Vermette was horribly frustrating here in Ottawa. Sure, he was flashy as hell, and every year I was ready to witness his "breakout" year. Never happened, and I believe it wasn't going to happen here. He needed a change of scenery and the ability to play with a top line guy in Nash, which was something he was unable to do here in Ottawa. He was decent here, but I can't really say we miss him all that much. Sure Leclaire can be labelled a "bust" (if you want to write him off after only 26 games with the sens) but as Spez was saying this trade will pay off in the long run with Lehner.

SDH89 wrote:Antoine Vermette was horribly frustrating here in Ottawa. Sure, he was flashy as hell, and every year I was ready to witness his "breakout" year. Never happened, and I believe it wasn't going to happen here. He needed a change of scenery and the ability to play with a top line guy in Nash, which was something he was unable to do here in Ottawa. He was decent here, but I can't really say we miss him all that much. Sure Leclaire can be labelled a "bust" (if you want to write him off after only 26 games with the sens) but as Spez was saying this trade will pay off in the long run with Lehner.

He was the only guy who ever frustrated me more than Fisher I think.

SpezDispenser wrote:

SDH89 wrote:Antoine Vermette was horribly frustrating here in Ottawa. Sure, he was flashy as hell, and every year I was ready to witness his "breakout" year. Never happened, and I believe it wasn't going to happen here. He needed a change of scenery and the ability to play with a top line guy in Nash, which was something he was unable to do here in Ottawa. He was decent here, but I can't really say we miss him all that much. Sure Leclaire can be labelled a "bust" (if you want to write him off after only 26 games with the sens) but as Spez was saying this trade will pay off in the long run with Lehner.

He was the only guy who ever frustrated me more than Fisher I think.

Just so much potential, he was just never able to reach it fully here unfortunately. I hold no ill will towards the guy though, happy he's finally hitting his stride.

SDH89 wrote:
Just so much potential, he was just never able to reach it fully here unfortunately. I hold no ill will towards the guy though, happy he's finally hitting his stride.

I actually still cheer for him. One of the few ex-Sens I actually cheer for that I can think of.

SpezDispenser wrote:

PKC wrote:
I need to temper expectations in here. Vermette's looking at a ~65 point season. We've got Leclaire, who was a resounding bust this year, and a kid who's still finding his way in junior hockey.

Maybe in a few years, or even possibly next year, we can look back on this trade and say "yeah, we did pretty good." But for now, it's obvious who won this trade. Whether he's getting paid $4 million or not, at least he's playing like it. Unlike the guy we're paying almost $4 million for.

I doubt you need to temper expectations with many people here. Vermette's a good player, I liked him a lot, but it's safe to say there was little to no room for him here. Nice 2nd line center to have, but when he plays 2nd line center, he'll get 50 points, when he's setting up Nash and co., he'll get 65, basically the exact same as Fisher without the size. Remember how wildly inconsistent Vermette was? No way we were going down that road again after Fisher. Leclaire was a nice idea, we had high hopes for him, he crashed and burned. Given the choice, I'd trade him if I could find someone to take him, but if not, you'll have to admit that once given proper playing time he could be something pretty interesting.

Lehner to me is the key to the deal though. I like his pedigree and I like his work ethic. And yes, I realize he's still a prospect, but again, his work ethic and motivating factors - his dad especially - make me think we got a huge winner.

I'd do this deal again tomorrow if prompted.

Fisher and Vermette are not the same players at all IMO.
Vermette is a real center, not someone who's gonna try to enter the zone and go passed 3 players without looking at who is available. He was tearing it up with Stillman, basically the only real solid guy he was given playtime with in 3 years.
The mojo in Ottawa was always to get Fisher going. Vermette never had his chance. He was given a good player for 3 games and was sent back with Chris Kelly. TBH I still don't see what make Fisher a center. His playmaking is basically non existant, and when Kovalev is not playing well, he's anemic offensively.
Vermette was a good player whose contract year was just at the worst time for the Sens.

Seriously, where does this Vermette inconsistency comes from? WHen he was given the minutes he had 53 points. Hartsburg year is not debatable for any SEns player.

EDIT: You guys are frustrated with Vermette because Kelly and NEil have 0 finish. Vermette has a very good vision of the game and is a very good passer.
He is putting points this year because his wingers can hit the net. He has more poitns than Nash for God's sakes. Again, go back to the Stillman/Vermette months.

marakh wrote:Fisher and Vermette are not the same players at all IMO.
Vermette is a real center, not someone who's gonna try to enter the zone and go passed 3 players without looking at who is available. He was tearing it up with Stillman, basically the only real solid guy he was given playtime with in 3 years.
The mojo in Ottawa was always to get Fisher going. Vermette never had his chance. He was given a good player for 3 games and was sent back with Chris Kelly. TBH I still don't see what make Fisher a center. His playmaking is basically non existant, and when Kovalev is not playing well, he's anemic offensively.
Vermette was a good player whose contract year was just at the worst time for the Sens.

If we're debating whether Fisher should be a wing or not, I'm all in. He should be a right wing for sure. Fisher and Vermette are very different - except when it comes to points. If Fisher plays with Nash, he ends up with 65 points. But he doesn't, he plays some of the year with Alfie and some of the year with Kovalev - the most inconsistent player in the league besides Fisher himself.

I'm not really defending Fisher here though, just that I'd do the trade again no problem.

marakh wrote:Seriously, where does this Vermette inconsistency comes from? WHen he was given the minutes he had 53 points. Hartsburg year is not debatable for any SEns player.

Oh, I don't agree at all. He's wildly inconsistent. He'll score 8 points in 2 games, then go scoreless for the next 8 games. That's how I remember Vermette playing, it frustrated the crap out of me.

SpezDispenser wrote:

marakh wrote:Seriously, where does this Vermette inconsistency comes from? WHen he was given the minutes he had 53 points. Hartsburg year is not debatable for any SEns player.

Oh, I don't agree at all. He's wildly inconsistent. He'll score 8 points in 2 games, then go scoreless for the next 8 games. That's how I remember Vermette playing, it frustrated the crap out of me.

Not sure about that. You mean he gets points when Chris Kelly decides to shoot?
Also, Vermette went a ton of games with points this year without Nash on the scoresheet, just saying^^.

marakh wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

marakh wrote:Seriously, where does this Vermette inconsistency comes from? WHen he was given the minutes he had 53 points. Hartsburg year is not debatable for any SEns player.

Oh, I don't agree at all. He's wildly inconsistent. He'll score 8 points in 2 games, then go scoreless for the next 8 games. That's how I remember Vermette playing, it frustrated the crap out of me.

Not sure about that. You mean he gets points when Chris Kelly decides to shoot?
Also, Vermette went a ton of games with points this year without Nash on the scoresheet, just saying^^.

I see your point but you can't fully blame Vermette's lack of production on Chris Kelly. Great players make their own shots as well, and it was something he wasn't doing enough here.

marakh wrote:
Not sure about that. You mean he gets points when Chris Kelly decides to shoot?
Also, Vermette went a ton of games with points this year without Nash on the scoresheet, just saying^^.

It's a tough arguement because I'd love to see what Vermette could do where Fisher is - and I support the fact that if Fisher had been more comfortable at wing, we could have had the neatest top six in the biz. But we didn't have that option, so I'm at least pleased with getting Lehner, who (to me) signifies a very bright future from the nets out for the Sens.

SDH89 wrote:

marakh wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

marakh wrote:Seriously, where does this Vermette inconsistency comes from? WHen he was given the minutes he had 53 points. Hartsburg year is not debatable for any SEns player.

Oh, I don't agree at all. He's wildly inconsistent. He'll score 8 points in 2 games, then go scoreless for the next 8 games. That's how I remember Vermette playing, it frustrated the crap out of me.

Not sure about that. You mean he gets points when Chris Kelly decides to shoot?
Also, Vermette went a ton of games with points this year without Nash on the scoresheet, just saying^^.

I see your point but you can't fully blame Vermette's lack of production on Chris Kelly. Great players make their own shots as well, and it was something he wasn't doing enough here.

Well he's not "great" and to be honest Spezza can't even do it consistently so...
I think alfie is the only great player on the Sens, that makes anyone "go".

Big Ev wrote:3 more years? Murray is good at drafting and building a core, but we still need another GM to come in and tweak the team here and there to build a serious contender.

very rare that a GM comes in and just tweaks. they like to mold teams the way they like it. besides does that mean you think murray is incapable of tweaking a team? i think he did just fine this year with his tweak. you have to know what to give up and what to keep. i think he's doing just fine.