All Hockey talk all the time

davetherave wrote:
504H, again, all these are hypotheticals...but here is the logic:

Giguere is from Montreal, and he has a son who has been receiving, and will I understand continue to receive, specialized medical treatment in Montreal. He has two more years on his contract. Gainey has excellent assets to offer the Ducks in return.

Beauchemin is a product of the Canadiens' organization. He is well known and highly esteemed, and was lost to them because of a surplus of personnel at the time. Beauchemin was born in Sorel-Tracy, where Vincent Lecavalier's fiancee is from.

As for Vinnie--who has already said it would be 'a dream tp play in Montreal'--for the Canadiens to make him the centrepiece of a revamped Habs club would be a win-win investment, for all the reasons stated above.

For players from Quebec, especially francophones and especially from the Montreal region, the chance to wear the Bleu Blanc Rouge is an extremely powerful motivator.

None of this logic dictates any of this will happen of course.

I understand where you're coming from for sure, but if I had a choice, Montreal would be the absolute bottom of the list - not because it's a bad city or anything - but because the media/fan microscope is so intense that I believe it can end up having an adverse effect on players.

Is that a cop out? Probably a little bit, but at the same time, being under constant scrutiny can start to become overwhelming I would imagine. Even if you were born in or around the area. I believe we saw the first example of it with Briere, and I believe we'll continue to see players who have a choice - make another team their destination.

As for Giguere, I thought Anaheim had the facilities and the doctor that was second to none in treating his son? I thought I had read that several times to be honest. I might be wrong though.

How bad was Osgood last night? Holy Moly, did anyone watch that game? It was over before it even began.

How are they going to get anywhere with him? This year will be a complete bust for them if they can't get him playing at least a little bit better.

What was the final score in that game anyway? Anyone know? I can't find it.

SensGirl11 wrote:How bad was Osgood last night? Holy Moly, did anyone watch that game? It was over before it even began.

How are they going to get anywhere with him? This year will be a complete bust for them if they can't get him playing at least a little bit better.

What was the final score in that game anyway? Anyone know? I can't find it.

he was pulled 5 mins into the 2nd period

How far will they go in the playoffs? IMO, Cup Repeat. Ozzy will be nice and steady once the games mean something, have no fear, Let his career playoff 2.11 GAA and his .915 save% sooth your concerns

504Heater wrote: I understand where you're coming from for sure, but if I had a choice, Montreal would be the absolute bottom of the list - not because it's a bad city or anything - but because the media/fan microscope is so intense that I believe it can end up having an adverse effect on players.

Is that a cop out? Probably a little bit, but at the same time, being under constant scrutiny can start to become overwhelming I would imagine. Even if you were born in or around the area. I believe we saw the first example of it with Briere, and I believe we'll continue to see players who have a choice - make another team their destination.

As for Giguere, I thought Anaheim had the facilities and the doctor that was second to none in treating his son? I thought I had read that several times to be honest. I might be wrong though.

Danny Briere is from Gatineau...a long way from the pressure cooker of Montreal...which may explain in part his reticience.

But the tradition of 'La Sainte Flanelle' runs deep. And it's not that long ago that Le Canadien boasted a plethora of French Canadian stars...for those who admired Beliveau Et Compagnie, the mystique may still be there...

IMHO Gainey and Boivin may seek to resurrect that reverence--by choosing players who 'get it'--in the next edition of the team.

davetherave wrote:

504Heater wrote: I understand where you're coming from for sure, but if I had a choice, Montreal would be the absolute bottom of the list - not because it's a bad city or anything - but because the media/fan microscope is so intense that I believe it can end up having an adverse effect on players.

Is that a cop out? Probably a little bit, but at the same time, being under constant scrutiny can start to become overwhelming I would imagine. Even if you were born in or around the area. I believe we saw the first example of it with Briere, and I believe we'll continue to see players who have a choice - make another team their destination.

As for Giguere, I thought Anaheim had the facilities and the doctor that was second to none in treating his son? I thought I had read that several times to be honest. I might be wrong though.

Danny Briere is from Gatineau...a long way from the pressure cooker of Montreal...which may explain in part his reticience.

But the tradition of 'La Sainte Flanelle' runs deep. And it's not that long ago that Le Canadien boasted a plethora of French Canadian stars...for those who admired Beliveau Et Compagnie, the mystique may still be there...

IMHO Gainey and Boivin may seek to resurrect that reverence--by choosing players who 'get it'--in the next edition of the team.

That's why they may elect to trade for Lecavalier, to ignite the French Canadian pride again. I swear that guy would be damn close to god-like in that city

beedub wrote:
That's why they may elect to trade for Lecavalier, to ignite the French Canadian pride again. I swear that guy would be damn close to god-like in that city

I caution him to think it through - although again, he has no choice right now. He'd be a god on good days and the whipping boy the rest of the days.

The pressure level would be unlike anything he's ever come close to experiencing before. But...yeah...by all means...go for it.

davetherave wrote:Danny Briere is from Gatineau...a long way from the pressure cooker of Montreal...which may explain in part his reticience.

But the tradition of 'La Sainte Flanelle' runs deep. And it's not that long ago that Le Canadien boasted a plethora of French Canadian stars...for those who admired Beliveau Et Compagnie, the mystique may still be there...

IMHO Gainey and Boivin may seek to resurrect that reverence--by choosing players who 'get it'--in the next edition of the team.

They're gonna try for sure. Larry Brooks of the NY Post has said he'll pay for people's internet service (for how long? not sure) if Vinny is not a member of the Habs on draft day.

beedub wrote:

SensGirl11 wrote:How bad was Osgood last night? Holy Moly, did anyone watch that game? It was over before it even began.

How are they going to get anywhere with him? This year will be a complete bust for them if they can't get him playing at least a little bit better.

What was the final score in that game anyway? Anyone know? I can't find it.

he was pulled 5 mins into the 2nd period

How far will they go in the playoffs? IMO, Cup Repeat. Ozzy will be nice and steady once the games mean something, have no fear, Let his career playoff 2.11 GAA and his .915 save% sooth your concerns

Really? You think he'll be back to good once the playoffs start? I'm not sure I can buy into it, but you could be right. He just seems to have lost it completely. I know that it's rare for goalies to just all of a sudden lose it, but in his case, he was never really that good, except for last year, when it mattered most.

Ok...so I guess I see your point. Time will tell.

Detroit IMO should have looked at a guy like Craig Anderson.

I just don't like their goaltending. The D behind Lidstrom and Rafalski has taken a step back this year as well.

Still, hard to argue with: Datsyuk, Hossa, Holmstrom, Zetterberg, Hudler, Franzen, Filpulla, Cleary, Samuelsson, Maltby, Draper, Kopecky.

asq2 wrote:Detroit IMO should have looked at a guy like Craig Anderson.

I just don't like their goaltending. The D behind Lidstrom and Rafalski has taken a step back this year as well.

Still, hard to argue with: Datsyuk, Hossa, Holmstrom, Zetterberg, Hudler, Franzen, Filpulla, Cleary, Samuelsson, Maltby, Draper, Kopecky.

Datsyuk and Franzen made some unreal plays last night leading to Wings goals...but the issue there--this year--is in the inconsistency of Detroit's defensive play as a team. There seems to be a disconnect that happens with no rhyme or reason.

Babs has talked about this over and over in his postgame comments. He has suggested, at different times, that it might be a residual effect from the level of intensity necessary to win the Cup, and/or just the length of the season and difficulty in maintaining focus.

IMHO it is also a function of other teams studying Detroit's style and finding ways to counter it.

Another factor may be--and I suspect this from watching him and noticing his reduced icetime--that Nick Lidstrom is no longer the totally dominating D-man he has been for so many years. When you're a Norris winner as often as he has been, inevitably there's a drop off, sometime. And the competitive level of teams gets closer all the time; the players get younger and more skilled...the hitting harder...the wear and tear, the travel, etc etc...

Not a question of dismissing the Red Wings by any means; Big Red just isn't the 'monster' it was last year...even with Hossa on board. But they are still a singularly impressive hockey machine.

The real benchmark will be, of course, the second season, and the as many as 28 games left before the Cup is hoisted.

davetherave wrote:

504Heater wrote: I understand where you're coming from for sure, but if I had a choice, Montreal would be the absolute bottom of the list - not because it's a bad city or anything - but because the media/fan microscope is so intense that I believe it can end up having an adverse effect on players.

Is that a cop out? Probably a little bit, but at the same time, being under constant scrutiny can start to become overwhelming I would imagine. Even if you were born in or around the area. I believe we saw the first example of it with Briere, and I believe we'll continue to see players who have a choice - make another team their destination.

As for Giguere, I thought Anaheim had the facilities and the doctor that was second to none in treating his son? I thought I had read that several times to be honest. I might be wrong though.

Danny Briere is from Gatineau...a long way from the pressure cooker of Montreal...which may explain in part his reticience.

But the tradition of 'La Sainte Flanelle' runs deep. And it's not that long ago that Le Canadien boasted a plethora of French Canadian stars...for those who admired Beliveau Et Compagnie, the mystique may still be there...

IMHO Gainey and Boivin may seek to resurrect that reverence--by choosing players who 'get it'--in the next edition of the team.

Players like Dryden, Gainey and Robinson *got it*. They were not Francophones. Players like Nilan, Green, McPhee, Naslund, Ludwig, Leclair (Jon) all got it. I think Boivin may not *get it*. And neither do the fans. There was a reason why they were called Habs. That part of their history is lost on fans living in their downtown condos, sipping their lattes on the way to the boardroom. The may speak the language but they have no connection to Nos Glorieux. If they did, they'd be too ashamed to sing "Ole, Ole", especially in the first 5 minutes of a road game.

Thrashers are doubling the Habs in shots. Yeah, it's just 2-1, but if that's a trend ... :D

Edit: 4-1, it's a trend!

1-0 Habs.

1-0 for the Habs on a pretty goal by Tangay.

Thrashers tie it up 1-1

wprager wrote:

davetherave wrote:IMHO Gainey and Boivin may seek to resurrect that reverence--by choosing players who 'get it'--in the next edition of the team.

Players like Dryden, Gainey and Robinson *got it*. They were not Francophones. Players like Nilan, Green, McPhee, Naslund, Ludwig, Leclair (Jon) all got it. I think Boivin may not *get it*. And neither do the fans. There was a reason why they were called Habs. That part of their history is lost on fans living in their downtown condos, sipping their lattes on the way to the boardroom. The may speak the language but they have no connection to Nos Glorieux. If they did, they'd be too ashamed to sing "Ole, Ole", especially in the first 5 minutes of a road game.

Absolutely right...Dryden et al 'got it'...so did Dickie Moore, Ralph Backstrom, and many 'anglos'...including Bob Gainey...when language was not the 'red herring' that clouds discussions of hockey in Montreal.

I hope you know my reference to Gainey choosing players who 'get it' is about players who understand the tradition of excellence and competition that used to be the raison d'etre of Le Canadien...and not their mother tongue. The club, was after all, originally founded by a lumber magnate from Arnprior named O'Brien...

...as a bilingual French-Canadian, I have always found lamentable to observe the theatre created around this issue...but from a marketing perspective, I understand--whether I agree or not--the motivation of Boivin's statements.

Thing is, what percentage of the new Habs fans are truly Quebecois? The Ole Ole chant is soccer -- European.

And what's with the comments about the next coach being Francophone? Carbo was Francophone, so was Julien and Therrien and Vigneault and Tremblay and Lemaire and Burns (yeah, Irish name and all) and Demers. I know I'm might be missing one or two (and I'm definitely sure I've got the order mostly wrong), but who was the last non-Francophone coach? Is he talking about Gainey? If so, then he really has no clue.

Edit: Looked on Wikipedia and you have to go all the way back to Bowman, unless you consider the non-French names (Burns, Berry). All of them were Francophones.

wprager wrote:Thing is, what percentage of the new Habs fans are truly Quebecois? The Ole Ole chant is soccer -- European.

And what's with the comments about the next coach being Francophone? Carbo was Francophone, so was Julien and Therrien and Vignault and Tremblay and Lemaire and Burns and Demers. I know I'm might be missing one or two (and I'm definitely sure I've got the order mostly wrong), but who was the last non-Francophone coach? Is he talking about Gainey? If so, then he really has no clue.

It's all more Grand Guignol--theatre of the absurd--in Montreal...