Pre-Season Game 6 - Ottawa @ Montreal - Sept 26

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:Wasn't a dump and change, he stopped at the blueline because he was afraid to take a hit and then started to skate into the zone.  He's afraid, plain and simple.  

May be the case but need a bigger sample size. Especially after his collar bone injury. That can take some time, like Karlsson last playoffs.

Being mental more than physical is a huge issue and he is ALWAYS hurt.  Too tiny and he's not smart enough to avoid the physical play.  Either way, he showed some decent things at the NHL level like his shot and skating but there are a ton of guys like that.  

He's not made for the NHL game mentally or physically.  Europe is screaming his name because he will be pretty successful there.

Ok, but this was Andre Petersson exactly a year ago (and still is even though he is getting praised again). Always injured and they were done with him, now he's getting back in the good books and looks decent.

They just signed Hoffman to a new deal, they won't just give up on him like that. They will give him this year to prove something.

There are a lot of difference between Peterson and Hoffman.  1, Peterson is has a lot more hockey sense and everything is NHL level on him except his size.  2, Peterson came over from Europe which is a huge transition.  3, Peterson has been impressive this year vs Hoffman being very unimpressive.  

They are not giving up on Hoffman but fact is he has done a lot more to hurt himself this pre-season than help.  Peterson jumped him for sure as he has been pretty impressive all around and hopefully has figured it out.

There aren't that many differences in the situations, in fact Petersson's situation was a lot worse given his attitude (and Hoffman was Binghamton's best player. Petersson was awful last year). They didn't give up on any of these players (including SDC), and they are all softer players. Hoffman is more complete of a player than Petersson though and is actually less injury-prone. Petersson is more talented but it just shows you that they will stick with the player if they have invested time and money into him and if they like him (which management has said about Hoffman). Hoffman is probably still superior to Petersson and other prospects in their mind. A poor pre-season after a serious injury doesn't change that IMO.

The year hasn't even started. Bottom line, give it time. That's all I'm saying. Hoffman had little chance to make the team anyway no matter what MacLean and co were saying. Grow down in Binghamton some more and see where he is at in a few months.

NEELY wrote:

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:Wasn't a dump and change, he stopped at the blueline because he was afraid to take a hit and then started to skate into the zone.  He's afraid, plain and simple.  

May be the case but need a bigger sample size. Especially after his collar bone injury. That can take some time, like Karlsson last playoffs.

Being mental more than physical is a huge issue and he is ALWAYS hurt.  Too tiny and he's not smart enough to avoid the physical play.  Either way, he showed some decent things at the NHL level like his shot and skating but there are a ton of guys like that.  

He's not made for the NHL game mentally or physically.  Europe is screaming his name because he will be pretty successful there.

Ok, but this was Andre Petersson exactly a year ago (and still is even though he is getting praised again). Always injured and they were done with him, now he's getting back in the good books and looks decent.

They just signed Hoffman to a new deal, they won't just give up on him like that. They will give him this year to prove something.

There are a lot of difference between Peterson and Hoffman.  1, Peterson is has a lot more hockey sense and everything is NHL level on him except his size.  2, Peterson came over from Europe which is a huge transition.  3, Peterson has been impressive this year vs Hoffman being very unimpressive.  

They are not giving up on Hoffman but fact is he has done a lot more to hurt himself this pre-season than help.  Peterson jumped him for sure as he has been pretty impressive all around and hopefully has figured it out.

There aren't that many differences in the situations, in fact Petersson's situation was a lot worse given his attitude (and Hoffman was Binghamton's best player. Petersson was awful last year). They didn't give up on any of these players (including SDC), and they are all softer players. Hoffman is more complete of a player than Petersson though and is actually less injury-prone. Petersson is more talented but it just shows you that they will stick with the player if they have invested time and money into him and if they like him (which management has said about Hoffman). Hoffman is probably still superior to Petersson and other prospects in their mind. A poor pre-season after a serious injury doesn't change that IMO.

The year hasn't even started. Bottom line, give it time. That's all I'm saying. Hoffman had little chance to make the team anyway no matter what MacLean and co were saying. Grow down in Binghamton some more and see where he is at in a few months.

Absolutely Peterson had some growing up and changing to do but fact of the matter is, being a prospect is 100% based on the "what have you done for me lately" mentality.  It's not "well, he was good the first 1/2 of last season in Bingo" vs "he was awful last year so no way this year".  It's who is going to make your team better right now and it's Peterson by a mile after the camp he has had.  

Like I said, they won't give up on him but a play like that IMO rings the alarm in terms of where someone is mentally.  Has Hoffman lost the ability to play without fear?  Looks like it to me.  That play last night speaks volumes in terms of where he is mentally as well as taking slap shots every time he enters the zone. He's totally lost.

NEELY wrote:1) Zibanejad still lacks some hockey sense and tops out at 25-30 goals... I've never waived from that.  

2) And prospects getting chances in the NHL is 100% based on who is playing the best right now and who helps the team the most right now.  Peterson is closer right now than Hoffman.

tim1_2 wrote:The time an organization declares someone as "done" is when their contract expires, and they have to decide whether or not to offer a new one.

tim1_2 wrote:The time an organization declares someone as "done" is when their contract expires, and they have to decide whether or not to offer a new one.

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:1) Zibanejad still lacks some hockey sense and tops out at 25-30 goals... I've never waived from that.  

2) And prospects getting chances in the NHL is 100% based on who is playing the best right now and who helps the team the most right now.  Peterson is closer right now than Hoffman.

That wasn't the point, it was the point of Zibanejad being called "mentally weak" for shooting after he entered the zone. And we have all seen hockey sense is not close to benig an issue for him. It was an issue after he was injured (like? you got it, Mike Hoffman!)

Still debatable. Petersson has looked good against rookies and AHL scrubs. Wait until they are both playing in Binghamton to make that call.

But again that isn't the point at all.

SpezDispenser wrote:I thought Hoffman was pretty effective.  No complaints about him really, but he's not gonna steal a spot from anyone right now.  Nor is Stone, so that's probably that.  Hope Hoff doesn't get claimed, he has an nhl future IMO.  

Ev wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:The time an organization declares someone as "done" is when their contract expires, and they have to decide whether or not to offer a new one.

And they offered Hoffman one this past summer.

NEELY wrote:

Ev wrote:

NEELY wrote:1) Zibanejad still lacks some hockey sense and tops out at 25-30 goals... I've never waived from that.  

2) And prospects getting chances in the NHL is 100% based on who is playing the best right now and who helps the team the most right now.  Peterson is closer right now than Hoffman.

That wasn't the point, it was the point of Zibanejad being called "mentally weak" for shooting after he entered the zone. And we have all seen hockey sense is not close to benig an issue for him. It was an issue after he was injured (like? you got it, Mike Hoffman!)

Still debatable. Petersson has looked good against rookies and AHL scrubs. Wait until they are both playing in Binghamton to make that call.

But again that isn't the point at all.

Again, players coming form Europe (especially a teen), has a lot more room for mistakes and evolving as a player.  Hockey sense isn't an issue but it will limit him to what he can and can't do going forward.  Again, he still looks exactly like Mike Fisher to me and he probably tops out at similar production playing a very similar game.  

This is and will be Hoffman's make it or break it year within the organization.  Peterson based on what he's done the last few months and this training camp has a lot more rope than he did before, enough to hang himself for sure.  Hoffman needs to show a lot more in the AHL than he did in camp to get a real shot again, he's playing scared and unless that changes he won't make it.  

NEELY wrote:

Ev wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:The time an organization declares someone as "done" is when their contract expires, and they have to decide whether or not to offer a new one.

And they offered Hoffman one this past summer.

Look at the contract Boroweicki received vs Hoffman.