Melnyk's Financial Woes: Melnyk's Budget Edition

tim1_2 wrote:

NEELY wrote:
PS looks like the willingness to spend and Spezza's BS excuse was just another lie coming from his mouth.  They wanted to spend just not on Spezza.  God it feels good to be a Sens fan again.

I agree, exciting times indeed.

Murray said that his first reaction to Spezza when he said he wanted to move was to offer him a contract extension.

shabbs wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:I hope that as time goes on, Melnyk continues to increase the payroll.  I am not sure how you declare the #budget issue over while we're still one of the lowest spending teams in the league.  

Check our payroll after this season...

There's spending money and there's spending money wisely.

Totally agree, and I like the direction of the team. Next year, we could still be among the bottom-spenders in the league. There is nothing wrong with this, assuming the long-term plan is to keep our young guys and commit big dollars to them as they warrant it. The one problem in all this is Melnyk...no one can be sure what he's going to do, so I am advising caution instead of just blindly assuming that any financial problems are long gone. I know ticket sales aren't going very well. Still tons of tickets available for the first home game vs the Leafs on Oct 22.

tim1_2 wrote:

shabbs wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:I hope that as time goes on, Melnyk continues to increase the payroll.  I am not sure how you declare the #budget issue over while we're still one of the lowest spending teams in the league.  

Check our payroll after this season...

There's spending money and there's spending money wisely.

Totally agree, and I like the direction of the team.  Next year, we could still be among the bottom-spenders in the league.  There is nothing wrong with this, assuming the long-term plan is to keep our young guys and commit big dollars to them as they warrant it.  The one problem in all this is Melnyk...no one can be sure what he's going to do, so I am advising caution instead of just blindly assuming that any financial problems are long gone.  I know ticket sales aren't going very well.  Still tons of tickets available for the first home game vs the Leafs on Oct 22.

I've never been convinced of any actual financial problems. Just that Melnyk is a cheap bastard and a wino.

I expect a spike in ticket sales after yesterdays announcements. If not, then I'd worry a little.

Well, yeah...by "financial problems" I mean "Melnyk's willingness to spend". I think he and his business practices are sketchy at best.

yeah just like Matt Moulson signed in Buffalo because they're committed to winning

tim1_2 wrote:

shabbs wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:I hope that as time goes on, Melnyk continues to increase the payroll.  I am not sure how you declare the #budget issue over while we're still one of the lowest spending teams in the league.  

Check our payroll after this season...

There's spending money and there's spending money wisely.

Totally agree, and I like the direction of the team.  Next year, we could still be among the bottom-spenders in the league.  There is nothing wrong with this, assuming the long-term plan is to keep our young guys and commit big dollars to them as they warrant it.  The one problem in all this is Melnyk...no one can be sure what he's going to do, so I am advising caution instead of just blindly assuming that any financial problems are long gone.  I know ticket sales aren't going very well.  Still tons of tickets available for the first home game vs the Leafs on Oct 22.

See, this is also a sensible thing to say. The thing with the budget narrative is that it consistently implied that we were losing core guys because we refused to pay them. There is no evidence that was ever the case -- meanwhile, the team gave us 120+ million reasons this summer to believe that they would spend on their core. It was always a matter of interpretative slippage, in which people misread 'OTT not spending on UFAs and with a low payroll' for 'OTT isn't willing to spend." Plain and simple.

All that had to happen in Ottawa was a fresh start and then determining who the core is... they did that. Alfie leaving wasn't money related and never was and anyone who suggests it was over the finances of the team is kidding themselves. Spezza leaving is great because he's a trash captain and one of the hardest players in the league to play and work with, both players and coaches. Then he comes out with this BS they aren't committed to winning, well that's true because they can't win with him but he fails to realize that even after almost 2 decades of failure being the go to guy on every team he's been on.

The budget is there but all smart teams have a budget, they don't go out and waste money. If the Sens are competing for Cups every year they will be near the top of the league in payroll again.

Let this season play out and let the youth get the games and experience and hopefully they are playing meaningful games well into March and April, no guarantee they make the playoffs but they can push. If things really go off the rails well the most talented draft since 08 (D men) is coming and there is something to look forward to there.

Worry about budgets when it actually affects the on ice product, thus far there has been nothing to suggest it has or will. It's like worrying about dieing, what's the point?

Michallica wrote:

Oglethorpe wrote:While it is currently a wasteland, there are 2 large retail developments going in across the 417, the Tangier outlet mall with restaurants and a hotel, as well as a new Broccolini mall which will likely resemble the Vaughn Mills mall.  Minto is building 1700 homes between the 2 new retail developments and Terry Fox.   I would imagine that the Gene will enter into a development partnership with someone now that the casino is a no go.  He owns lots of land which is now used for parking that could generate higher revenues than 12 bucks a spot 41 nights a year.

Now imagine with all the stuff, there was also a casino?  That would be friggin' great.  

Also south side sucks.  Sorry neely but it sucks, and you shoudl just accept it.

I think last time I looked into it Kanata was getting close to 90K. The 2006 Census put them at 69K. Another 1,700 homes at 2.3 per and you can honestly say Kanata is approaching 100K. Add-in Stittsville (19K in 2006) and you're talking about 120K or more (there's also been significant development out in Stittsville and between Kanata South and Stittsville -- where the new WalMart super center went in).

Why am I saying all this? Certainly not because I feel a city of 120K people deserve their own NHL team. But don't you think they deserve some consideration for light rail expansion plans? And I'm talking about plans that would affect at least my children, not my grand-children.

shabbs wrote:

tim1_2 wrote:I hope that as time goes on, Melnyk continues to increase the payroll.  I am not sure how you declare the #budget issue over while we're still one of the lowest spending teams in the league.  

Check our payroll after this season...

There's spending money and there's spending money wisely.

I already analyzed that yesterday. Ryan's extension puts us almost $2M over the floor. Methot will put us $6.5M over, and extension to the three big RFAs (Zibanejad, Stone and Chiasson) will put us $12+M over, and then there's Lazar and the likes of Puemple, Claesson -- but in those cases they'd likely be replacing someone on the roster who is making more than they will.

That said, the floor will be going up (don't think the Cap Geek page uses projected cap numbers for future years.

NEELY wrote:All that had to happen in Ottawa was a fresh start and then determining who the core is... they did that.  Alfie leaving wasn't money related and never was and anyone who suggests it was over the finances of the team is kidding themselves.  Spezza leaving is great because he's a trash captain and one of the hardest players in the league to play and work with, both players and coaches.  Then he comes out with this BS they aren't committed to winning, well that's true because they can't win with him but he fails to realize that even after almost 2 decades of failure being the go to guy on every team he's been on.

The budget is there but all smart teams have a budget, they don't go out and waste money.  If the Sens are competing for Cups every year they will be near the top of the league in payroll again.  

Let this season play out and let the youth get the games and experience and hopefully they are playing meaningful games well into March and April, no guarantee they make the playoffs but they can push.  If things really go off the rails well the most talented draft since 08 (D men) is coming and there is something to look forward to there.  

Worry about budgets when it actually affects the on ice product, thus far there has been nothing to suggest it has or will.  It's like worrying about dieing, what's the point?

Alfie leaving was all money related. We didn't pay him what we apparently promised.

SpezDispenser wrote:

NEELY wrote:All that had to happen in Ottawa was a fresh start and then determining who the core is... they did that.  Alfie leaving wasn't money related and never was and anyone who suggests it was over the finances of the team is kidding themselves.  Spezza leaving is great because he's a trash captain and one of the hardest players in the league to play and work with, both players and coaches.  Then he comes out with this BS they aren't committed to winning, well that's true because they can't win with him but he fails to realize that even after almost 2 decades of failure being the go to guy on every team he's been on.

The budget is there but all smart teams have a budget, they don't go out and waste money.  If the Sens are competing for Cups every year they will be near the top of the league in payroll again.  

Let this season play out and let the youth get the games and experience and hopefully they are playing meaningful games well into March and April, no guarantee they make the playoffs but they can push.  If things really go off the rails well the most talented draft since 08 (D men) is coming and there is something to look forward to there.  

Worry about budgets when it actually affects the on ice product, thus far there has been nothing to suggest it has or will.  It's like worrying about dieing, what's the point?

Alfie leaving was all money related. We didn't pay him what we apparently promised.  

That's not what Alfie himself said, nor is it what BM said, and I can dig up the quotes / stories for those. By contrast, here can I go to verify this story you're peddling?

SpezDispenser wrote:

NEELY wrote:All that had to happen in Ottawa was a fresh start and then determining who the core is... they did that.  Alfie leaving wasn't money related and never was and anyone who suggests it was over the finances of the team is kidding themselves.  Spezza leaving is great because he's a trash captain and one of the hardest players in the league to play and work with, both players and coaches.  Then he comes out with this BS they aren't committed to winning, well that's true because they can't win with him but he fails to realize that even after almost 2 decades of failure being the go to guy on every team he's been on.

The budget is there but all smart teams have a budget, they don't go out and waste money.  If the Sens are competing for Cups every year they will be near the top of the league in payroll again.  

Let this season play out and let the youth get the games and experience and hopefully they are playing meaningful games well into March and April, no guarantee they make the playoffs but they can push.  If things really go off the rails well the most talented draft since 08 (D men) is coming and there is something to look forward to there.  

Worry about budgets when it actually affects the on ice product, thus far there has been nothing to suggest it has or will.  It's like worrying about dieing, what's the point?

Alfie leaving was all money related. We didn't pay him what we apparently promised.  

Alfie said it wasn't money, Murray said it wasn't money, every rumour you hear isn't money, and from what I know from the people I know it wasn't money. There is literally nothing out there that says it was about money. Even the lies about Alfie wanting to "win" as the reason leaving wasn't about money.

rooneypoo wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

NEELY wrote:All that had to happen in Ottawa was a fresh start and then determining who the core is... they did that.  Alfie leaving wasn't money related and never was and anyone who suggests it was over the finances of the team is kidding themselves.  Spezza leaving is great because he's a trash captain and one of the hardest players in the league to play and work with, both players and coaches.  Then he comes out with this BS they aren't committed to winning, well that's true because they can't win with him but he fails to realize that even after almost 2 decades of failure being the go to guy on every team he's been on.

The budget is there but all smart teams have a budget, they don't go out and waste money.  If the Sens are competing for Cups every year they will be near the top of the league in payroll again.  

Let this season play out and let the youth get the games and experience and hopefully they are playing meaningful games well into March and April, no guarantee they make the playoffs but they can push.  If things really go off the rails well the most talented draft since 08 (D men) is coming and there is something to look forward to there.  

Worry about budgets when it actually affects the on ice product, thus far there has been nothing to suggest it has or will.  It's like worrying about dieing, what's the point?

Alfie leaving was all money related. We didn't pay him what we apparently promised.  

That's not what Alfie himself said, nor is it what BM said, and I can dig up the quotes / stories for those. By contrast, here can I go to verify this story you're peddling?

While you're at it see if you can find this quote "He just wanted to make sure we were ready to commit to try to be a winning team here." or similar because I'm pretty sure it came up with respect to Alfie, then Spezza and now Bobby Ryan.

SeawaySensFan wrote:

rooneypoo wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:

NEELY wrote:All that had to happen in Ottawa was a fresh start and then determining who the core is... they did that.  Alfie leaving wasn't money related and never was and anyone who suggests it was over the finances of the team is kidding themselves.  Spezza leaving is great because he's a trash captain and one of the hardest players in the league to play and work with, both players and coaches.  Then he comes out with this BS they aren't committed to winning, well that's true because they can't win with him but he fails to realize that even after almost 2 decades of failure being the go to guy on every team he's been on.

The budget is there but all smart teams have a budget, they don't go out and waste money.  If the Sens are competing for Cups every year they will be near the top of the league in payroll again.  

Let this season play out and let the youth get the games and experience and hopefully they are playing meaningful games well into March and April, no guarantee they make the playoffs but they can push.  If things really go off the rails well the most talented draft since 08 (D men) is coming and there is something to look forward to there.  

Worry about budgets when it actually affects the on ice product, thus far there has been nothing to suggest it has or will.  It's like worrying about dieing, what's the point?

Alfie leaving was all money related. We didn't pay him what we apparently promised.  

That's not what Alfie himself said, nor is it what BM said, and I can dig up the quotes / stories for those. By contrast, here can I go to verify this story you're peddling?

While you're at it see if you can find this quote "He just wanted to make sure we were ready to commit to try to be a winning team here." or similar because I'm pretty sure it came up with respect to Alfie, then Spezza and now Bobby Ryan.

What that means precisely is entirely up for debate. It is entirely speculation that that comment has anything to do with questions about spending, especially spending right now, to the cap.

EDIT: also, that line never came up with Alfie. And with Alfie and Spezza, after the moves of the winter of 2011, they knew they were signing up to be a part of a rebuild. If either of them thought that we'd move from a rebuilding team in June 2011 to a cup contender in September 2013, they were really not thinking. Pretty sure we were spending to the cap the other two times Spezza asked for a trade as well.

Why did he leave then? They never tabled him a competitive offer is what I thought it was. Just never bothered getting him signed even though he had repeatedly asked them to get it done.

What a strange thread. Of course it was money - as in he wanted too much and we balked.

Didn't Alfie have that huge press conference at the royal Ottawa and basically said that word for word?

Melnyk's insulting email about him not being worth what he was asking? The frustration of being on a team who wouldn't \ couldn't go for it for the last few years he had in him?(money or timing in contending)
I think those are two factors. To say money played no factor I think is a bit naive. I don't think it was about a pay check to him but rather that they weren't gonna invest enough short term to have a chance to compete. Probably that and ownership arrogance.

SpezDispenser wrote:Why did he leave then?  They never tabled him a competitive offer is what I thought it was.  Just never bothered getting him signed even though he had repeatedly asked them to get it done.  

What a strange thread.  Of course it was money - as in he wanted too much and we balked.  

Didn't Alfie have that huge press conference at the royal Ottawa and basically said that word for word?

Alfie said he left because he wanted a chance to play for a cup before he retired, and he felt like DET offered that. Simple as that. By all accounts, Alfie was offered a blank cheque and still left. So, no, don't think it had anything to do with money.

rooneypoo wrote:

SpezDispenser wrote:Why did he leave then?  They never tabled him a competitive offer is what I thought it was.  Just never bothered getting him signed even though he had repeatedly asked them to get it done.  

What a strange thread.  Of course it was money - as in he wanted too much and we balked.  

Didn't Alfie have that huge press conference at the royal Ottawa and basically said that word for word?

Alfie said he left because he wanted a chance to play for a cup before he retired, and he felt like DET offered that. Simple as that. By all accounts, Alfie was offered a blank cheque and still left. So, no, don't think it had anything to do with money.

the real reason was the drunken e-mail. The Cup argument was bogus lol.