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GM Hockey » Ottawa Senators » Sens this season's 'Biggest Disappointment'

Sens this season's 'Biggest Disappointment'

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davetherave
LeCaptain
PTFlea
wprager
shabbs
dennycrane
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504Heater wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
Lecailver has been totally screwed over in Tampa, big difference. They have taken everything that made him and that team successful away. Heatley is given every chance to produce and succeed.

I don't follow. How has he been screwed over? You mean he's lost the will to be good?

Lost the will to play in Tampa, for sure. Who wouldnt. You trade your best D, one of your best friends and team mates, hire a coach that has no business being in the NHL, so on.

Lecailver has been totally screwed over, not to mention the fact they rushed him back from injury this year.

PTFlea


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Neely4Life wrote:Lost the will to play in Tampa, for sure. Who wouldnt. You trade your best D, one of your best friends and team mates, hire a coach that has no business being in the NHL, so on.

Lecailver has been totally screwed over, not to mention the fact they rushed him back from injury this year.

Why the heck did he sign his extension then?

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504Heater wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:Lost the will to play in Tampa, for sure. Who wouldnt. You trade your best D, one of your best friends and team mates, hire a coach that has no business being in the NHL, so on.

Lecailver has been totally screwed over, not to mention the fact they rushed him back from injury this year.

Why the heck did he sign his extension then?


Signed with good faith... mistake on his part obviously.

PTFlea

PTFlea
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Neely4Life wrote:
Signed with good faith... mistake on his part obviously.

Good faith? After they had traded Boyle and Melrose was running the team into the ground?

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504Heater wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
Signed with good faith... mistake on his part obviously.

Good faith? After they had traded Boyle and Melrose was running the team into the ground?

If you're told one thing and believe it, then thats a tough break. Again, mistake on his part but that would have been a lot of cash to turn down as well.

davetherave

davetherave
All-Star
All-Star

504Heater wrote:
davetherave wrote:IMHO Clouston will have to make do with what he has, and Sens fans will have to patient.

Emotions are starting to wilt a little, which is very bad news for Jason Spezza and Dany Heatley - and possible Mike Fisher. What can the Sens do to become more competitive next year? Or is this a long term fix (like 2010-11 or 11/12)?

IMHO it depends on a number of factors that are very difficult to evaluate right now.

With limited cap room, getting, for example, a UFA D-man (6-7MM for a true Top 4, maybe more) is hard to imagine.

A trade? There are lots of scenarios we can postulate as fans, but if you take a real hard look around, there's not many teams willing, ready and able to assume the megacontracts of Ottawa's big stars.

Draft? Yes, there are a number of good looking kids, but no 'quick fixes'.

The pipeline? Until Ottawa starts giving their prospects NHL ice time, there's not a sure way to know what they're really worth.

IMHO making a real committment to Clouston--who seems to have a pretty head for knowing the true value of players, and getting them to play--is a good start.

Deciding on a blueprint for the team, and following that, is next. Build a squad of players totally committed to excellence, and get rid of the ones who don't fit. It doesn't matter what they're paid, or what they've done in the past, or what you think they might be able to do.

Make some tough decisions. The players who remain will respond.

How long does that take? I don't know who can answer that question.

TeamRenzo


Rookie
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Neely4Life wrote:
shabbs wrote:And if the Pens get bounced in 4 straight in the first round....?

Wont happen, but they would have still played 4 more games than Ottawa with their two highest paid players, playing like it and putting the effort in every night.

Imagine if Crosby and Malkin has Spezza and Heatley's supporting cast? They would almost be a garentee to win the East again. Sens are easily the biggest disapointment in the league, not just this year, last year as well.

Its getting pathetic.

Kunitz, Guerin, Staal, Dupuis etc

Not a bad supporting cast

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TeamRenzo wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
shabbs wrote:And if the Pens get bounced in 4 straight in the first round....?

Wont happen, but they would have still played 4 more games than Ottawa with their two highest paid players, playing like it and putting the effort in every night.

Imagine if Crosby and Malkin has Spezza and Heatley's supporting cast? They would almost be a garentee to win the East again. Sens are easily the biggest disapointment in the league, not just this year, last year as well.

Its getting pathetic.

Kunitz, Guerin, Staal, Dupuis etc

Not a bad supporting cast

Ya, now. Took them getting Geurin and Kunitz to get it going didnt it? Now they look like they might be coming out of the East again this year.

They are def my fav's in the East going into the playoffs.

PTFlea

PTFlea
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Neely4Life wrote:
Ya, now. Took them getting Geurin and Kunitz to get it going didnt it? Now they look like they might be coming out of the East again this year.

They are def my fav's in the East going into the playoffs.

By that rationale, shouldn't the Sens focus on getting a couple of 2nd liners to support Spezza and Heatley?

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504Heater wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:
Ya, now. Took them getting Geurin and Kunitz to get it going didnt it? Now they look like they might be coming out of the East again this year.

They are def my fav's in the East going into the playoffs.

By that rationale, shouldn't the Sens focus on getting a couple of 2nd liners to support Spezza and Heatley?

No, because their 2 best players are their highest paid players. Hardest workers too.,

wprager

wprager
Administrator
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Neely4Life wrote:I would say the 2 most inconsistant players this year and last were def Heatley and Spezza. Honestly, how many nights or games this year can you say "Heatley or Spezza were this teams best player" I can think of maybe 5 combined, even then its a stretch.

Fisher has played hard every night, and his effort is 100% consistant which IMO is more important than constantly putting up the points, because at the end of the day if everyone is puttin in the effort consistantly then the production from everyone will come.

This team is a direct reflection of Heatley and Spezza. They get paid to get this team into the playoffs and make them a contender, thats why they both make 7 million a year. You can say they need help, sure, maybe they do, but those 2 should be good enough on their own to get the Sens into the playoffs in a weak Eastern Conferance.

It took a rookie goaltender and a rookie coach to make the Sens 2nd 1/2 of the season somewhat respectable. The addition of Shannon also made things a little easier on the team.

EDIT: You need a hard working team before you have a winning team, and right now, even with Clouston, its not there from everyone, every night. Spezza's been better but still totally inconsistant and Healtey is invisable most nights.

I'd say Fisher has been the most inconsistent, scoring-wise.

Usually he is a streaky scorer, but this year his streaks have been mostly the 1-goal/1-game variety. 18 games without a goal was a "Wow what the hell was that" last year, but became the norm this year.

Also, at the risk of defending Murray, what were his options for getting a true #1 goalie? Gerber was Muckelr's signing. It was a $3.7M boat anchor that could not be moved. We don't know if he had suggested waiving him; personally, I think he had, but Melnyk wouldn't agree until it was too late.

I blame Murray for hiring two coaches that ended up being fired, and for underestimating the significance of losing Redden and Meszaros (and replacing them with Smith and Kuba).

PTFlea

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Neely4Life wrote:

No, because their 2 best players are their highest paid players. Hardest workers too.,

Same with us. Only Aflie eclipses Heatley and Spezza - and some nights it's close. Let's not go crazy here. Alfie's out best player hands down, then Spezza, then Heatley. No one else on our team is even in the same league. Hard-work wise, there are a lot of guys unfortunately who work harder, but not skill wise. Maybe one day Foligno will be as talented as Heatley - but I doubt that. One day perhaps Karlsson and/or Wiercioch will be as good on the back end as they are up front, but again, that's the best case scenario.

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504Heater wrote:
Neely4Life wrote:

No, because their 2 best players are their highest paid players. Hardest workers too.,

Same with us. Only Aflie eclipses Heatley and Spezza - and some nights it's close. Let's not go crazy here. Alfie's out best player hands down, then Spezza, then Heatley. No one else on our team is even in the same league. Hard-work wise, there are a lot of guys unfortunately who work harder, but not skill wise. Maybe one day Foligno will be as talented as Heatley - but I doubt that. One day perhaps Karlsson and/or Wiercioch will be as good on the back end as they are up front, but again, that's the best case scenario.

That is the WHOLE problem right there, our two highest paid guys are not even close to the hardest workers.

davetherave

davetherave
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Neely4Life wrote: That is the WHOLE problem right there, our two highest paid guys are not even close to the hardest workers.

IMHO it's all about the T-E-A-M.

Hard work is one thing, efficiency is another.

Putting up impressive individual stats is not enough.

For example, not to diminish the feat, but there have been many fifty goal scorers who didn't lead their teams to the Cup. Here's a thread from an HF board in 2006 listing the NHL's eighty two single season 50-goal scorers at that time.

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=248819

Interesting reading.

Urkie

Urkie
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Neely4Life wrote:That is the WHOLE problem right there, our two highest paid guys are not even close to the hardest workers.

Exactly, they need to realize that they are leaders on the team now and they have to start showing their teammates that they can be leaders. Until that happens then things probably won't get any better any time soon because Alfie can only do so much.

Cap'n Clutch

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Just to get back to this thread topic. I don't believe the Sens were this Season's biggest dissapointment personally. I thought they'd make the playoffs but in 7th or 8th. They sit in 12th right now. I would suggest that perhaps Dallas is a bigger dissappointment. Weren't the Stars pegged as a top 4 team? That's a pretty big drop from expectations to reality.


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davetherave

davetherave
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Cap'n Clutch wrote:Just to get back to this thread topic. I don't believe the Sens were this Season's biggest dissapointment personally. I thought they'd make the playoffs but in 7th or 8th. They sit in 12th right now. I would suggest that perhaps Dallas is a bigger dissappointment. Weren't the Stars pegged as a top 4 team? That's a pretty big drop from expectations to reality.

I would agree Dallas is a much bigger disappointment this year than the Senators...as they were indeed picked to be among the frontrunners in the West, and a Cup contender.

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Cap'n Clutch wrote:Just to get back to this thread topic. I don't believe the Sens were this Season's biggest dissapointment personally. I thought they'd make the playoffs but in 7th or 8th. They sit in 12th right now. I would suggest that perhaps Dallas is a bigger dissappointment. Weren't the Stars pegged as a top 4 team? That's a pretty big drop from expectations to reality.

Richards and Morrow both injured, Ottawa's stars were healthy most of the year.

There is no doubt Ottawa was this years biggest disapointment, same as last year.

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