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cash wrote:Jay Bouwmeester would handcuff this team in ways you can't even imagine. Terrible idea imo in this salary-capped world of ours.

Considering Murray was willing to spend almost 7 million per year on Campbell, I can't possibly envision how Bouwmeester would handcuff our team. We have approximately (by my early, rough estimations) 18 million dollars to spend on 1 starting goaltender (assuming Elliott doesn't succeed the role), 1 free agent defenseman (Bouwmeester, potentially) and depending on whether Winchester or Foligno excel at their play, a potential top 6 forward.

And all that also assumes that we can't fill some roles with some rookies as well. Spending that money on a guy who will be the cornerstone of our defense for the next decade is hardly handcuffing anyone. In as little as two years, our top 4 defenders could be:

Phillips-Bouwmeester
Volchenkov-Lee
Karlsson-Weircioch/whoever

That has the potential to be one of the most elite defenses in the league. Money very, very, very well spent if you ask me.

PKC wrote:

cash wrote:Jay Bouwmeester would handcuff this team in ways you can't even imagine. Terrible idea imo in this salary-capped world of ours.

Considering Murray was willing to spend almost 7 million per year on Campbell, I can't possibly envision how Bouwmeester would handcuff our team. We have approximately (by my early, rough estimations) 18 million dollars to spend on 1 starting goaltender (assuming Elliott doesn't succeed the role), 1 free agent defenseman (Bouwmeester, potentially) and depending on whether Winchester or Foligno excel at their play, a potential top 6 forward.

And all that also assumes that we can't fill some roles with some rookies as well. Spending that money on a guy who will be the cornerstone of our defense for the next decade is hardly handcuffing anyone. In as little as two years, our top 4 defenders could be:

Phillips-Bouwmeester
Volchenkov-Lee
Karlsson-Weircioch/whoever

That has the potential to be one of the most elite defenses in the league. Money very, very, very well spent if you ask me.

How much cap space do you think there is?
Given the cost of our top-4 forwards (23M) I don't see how you can possibly expect to pay all those D that kind of defence and put anything other than rookie salary's everywhere else.
Volchenkov (4+) - Bouwmeester (6+)
Phillips (3.5) - Lee (3+)
Karlsson (1) - Whoever (.6)
Thats 18M on conservative increases + the locked in 25 (including Kelly) from 5 forwards and you've got 41M locked with 2 goalies and 7 forwards to sign.
So lets say the cap is at 60M (Its going to level off very soon) that means you've got 19M to ice those 9 players.
So now lets project Foligno and Winchester to take up another 2.5M each (which is a meager raise, by todays standards) Now you've got 13M to sign 2 goalies and 5 forwards. Now imagine you sign a goalie for 5M and a backup for 1M, you've got 7M left for 5 forwards. Each gets 1M and and there's 2M left for injuries, callups, and acquisitions.
On the surface, that looks fine, but there's no guarantee we can keep any of those players at those prices. Amazing as it is, paying that much for those 5 signings (Bouwmeester, Volchenkov, Lee, Foligno, Winchester) and only 5M on a FA goalie is extremely hopeful.
I'll agree that it sounds more plausible than I originally thought, but its still a stretch imo.
If anyone can get it done, though, its Murray.

Two years from now perhaps that might be the case but I was only referring to next year.

Next year we have 11 F, 6 D and 1 G signed to a cap hit of 43.7 million. The forward position can easily be filled by promoting from the minors either Zubov, Nikulin, Regin, Daugavins, O'Brien or Hennessey. And even that forward position depends on where Schubert plays this year and next. It's very possible that we might only need to fill a spot on D and sign a goalie if Elliott doesn't take over full time duties.

Down the road in a few years, sure, maybe if our young guys step up and become big time contributors they will most likely need to get paid, but its not like we can't trade a guy here or there to keep replenishing the farm. I just can't possibly see any way that Bouwmeester is a cap hindrance to this team given his calibre of play and elite level of potential.

I can say that over the next decade, with the way that this team is being built, Bouwmeester has the potential to be win 2 Norris trophies and be a perennial candidate for the award. That's just how I feel and see his talent level.

lol how do you build your trade ideas on a one year premise? What happens next year will affect the following year; its highly unlikely that we'll sign an FA on a one year deal because all of them are looking for long term. Imo if Bouwmeester at 6M costs us Lee at 3M (on a Burns type contract) then I am NOT for it. Its all cap numbers, dude...thats the very first thing a GM takes into consideration when deciding how to build and manage a team.
Having 5 players cost this team 30M doesn't really make sense. They may be a great 5, but a Dung 16 following them is not the ideal way to run things. Home grown talent costs less, too - especially when Bryan Murray is your GM.

That doesn't mean we can't go after an impact player like Bouwmeester at this years deadline and improve our chances in the playoffs.

Well I'm not going to sit down and map out our cap situation for the next 5 years (although I might at some point this year) right now just because I think we can and should sign Bouwmeester.

The fact is, we can fit him in and any parts that need to be replaced can be replaced. Signing Bouwmeester doesn't cost you Lee over the long-term, I don't know where you'd get that from. I highly doubt once Lee's entry-level contract is done that he's going to be commanding 5+ million as an RFA. He'll most likely sign a contract that doubles his salary for the next 3 years, which would put him at around 2.5-2.7 million per for 3 years.

Our team defense gets infinitely better with the addition of Bouwmeester. Besides, why would the other 16 players have to be Dung. The only parts that need to be replaced 2+ years from now are the bottom 6 players and we seem to have built a very strong farm, not to mention it wouldn't be expensive at all to bring in some veterans for the league minimum that can play a role.

I think you're overstating our cap situation. Trust me, just by looking at the preliminary figures, its not as bad as you think it is.

PKC wrote:Well I'm not going to sit down and map out our cap situation for the next 5 years (although I might at some point this year) right now just because I think we can and should sign Bouwmeester.

The fact is, we can fit him in and any parts that need to be replaced can be replaced. Signing Bouwmeester doesn't cost you Lee over the long-term, I don't know where you'd get that from. I highly doubt once Lee's entry-level contract is done that he's going to be commanding 5+ million as an RFA. He'll most likely sign a contract that doubles his salary for the next 3 years, which would put him at around 2.5-2.7 million per for 3 years.

Our team defense gets infinitely better with the addition of Bouwmeester. Besides, why would the other 16 players have to be Dung. The only parts that need to be replaced 2+ years from now are the bottom 6 players and we seem to have built a very strong farm, not to mention it wouldn't be expensive at all to bring in some veterans for the league minimum that can play a role.

I think you're overstating our cap situation. Trust me, just by looking at the
preliminary figures, its not as bad as you think it is.

Agreed. If there's a chance to get a guy like J-Bo, you go for it.

We should be able to afford it, too, short and long term. The cap keeps going up, and while I think it will stabilize very shortly at something like $60 mil / season or so, I do think we have a decent core locked up. Additionally, Alfie is 36 and he unfortunately won't play with us forever. He will probably retire at around the time when we'll have to start paying some of our future players (Lee, Karlsson, Zubov, etc.).

The reality of the cap era is that you're always going to have huge discrepancies in pay and talent in the line ups of every NHL team. Everyone blows most of their money on 4-5 forwards, 2-3 D, and 1 goalie. It's pretty standard, and I don't see how you can avoid the model. The better your team does, the better the stats of your players, and the more you have to pay them. Look what the cap did to Buffalo, who 2 short years ago what positively loaded with forward talent. You pick your 8 or so core guys and you run with them, and then you fill your line up with cheaper players, whether via youth or 3rd and 4th line grinders picked up for cheap on the UFA market. Run up and down the rosters of every team in the NHL and you'll see how this is almost invariably the case, at least with teams that can compete.

Exactly. Its not like we'd be doing something completely different from everyone else in the league by having a bunch of star players (who are compensated as such) surrounded by the best supporting talent we can afford with the rest of our money.

This is how professional sports work in a salary cap era.