It's time ~~~~~!!!!! P-A-N-I-C !!!!!~~~~~~

How much though? Battling droughts and inconsistent play just to finish 9th is not good. Our chances at anything more than 4th in the conference are already all but eliminated with the way Boston is playing. We are something like 14 points behind already.

If we are going to suck...do it right and suck hard enough to land a blue chipper like Hedman, Cowen, Tavares, etc in the draft. How hard did we as Sens fans laugh at the Leafs for battling there way into 9th place a couple of seasons ago?

I guarantee that won't look so funny when that shoe is on our foot, and we miss out on a blue chipper because of it.

I don't disagree, but that's a fan perspective. I don't think hockey players decide to tank it and get a high pick rather than finish 9th.

With that in mind I figure the Sens will make a push for the playoffs (unless there is a significant roster change). The east is so tight they could finish 7th-12th (just an example) depending on a couple of individual hot streaks or cold stretches. That was pretty much my point, that I still like this team on paper more than I've liked them on the ice so far this season.

They're either underproducing for their talent level and due for more production, or this is how it's going to be all year (no I don't think this is news to anyone).

My home team bias will have me hanging on to the hope that they have more to give. I did the same thing last year in the playoffs and I was very wrong. Actually, I'm still not over it. It's my biggest weakness in judging our hockey team. I probably remember players for who they were, and not who they are right now.

beerandsens wrote:

How much though? Battling droughts and inconsistent play just to finish 9th is not good. Our chances at anything more than 4th in the conference are already all but eliminated with the way Boston is playing. We are something like 14 points behind already.

If we are going to suck...do it right and suck hard enough to land a blue chipper like Hedman, Cowen, Tavares, etc in the draft. How hard did we as Sens fans laugh at the Leafs for battling there way into 9th place a couple of seasons ago?

I guarantee that won't look so funny when that shoe is on our foot, and we miss out on a blue chipper because of it.

I don't disagree, but that's a fan perspective. I don't think hockey players decide to tank it and get a high pick rather than finish 9th.

With that in mind I figure the Sens will make a push for the playoffs (unless there is a significant roster change). The east is so tight they could finish 7th-12th (just an example) depending on a couple of individual hot streaks or cold stretches. That was pretty much my point, that I still like this team on paper more than I've liked them on the ice so far this season.

They're either underproducing for their talent level and due for more production, or this is how it's going to be all year (no I don't think this is news to anyone).

My home team bias will have me hanging on to the hope that they have more to give. I did the same thing last year in the playoffs and I was very wrong. Actually, I'm still not over it. It's my biggest weakness in judging our hockey team. I probably remember players for who they were, and not who they are right now.

Finish 8th and we'll get pummelled. Finish 7th and we're still probably one and done.

I'd rather get a nice draft pick.

asq2 wrote:

hemlock34 wrote:

beerandsens wrote:I might be wearing those rose colored glasses Neely was talking about 8) , but I can't shake the idea that our team could just "get it" one day and that a player or two coming out of their offensive slumps will significantly improve our position in the standings.

How much though? Battling droughts and inconsistent play just to finish 9th is not good. Our chances at anything more than 4th in the conference are already all but eliminated with the way Boston is playing. We are something like 14 points behind already.

If we are going to suck...do it right and suck hard enough to land a blue chipper like Hedman, Cowen, Tavares, etc in the draft. How hard did we as Sens fans laugh at the Leafs for battling there way into 9th place a couple of seasons ago?

I guarantee that won't look so funny when that shoe is on our foot, and we miss out on a blue chipper because of it.

Fortunately, Heatley and Spezza are very valuable assets (still), better than anyone the Leafs had.

I don't want to add anything to the current roster unless it's a younger player acquired via trade of an older one.

But I'm content to sit back and watch this team lose.

Agreed.

"John Tavares is the best 18 year old in the world."

DashRiprock wrote:"John Tavares is the best 18 year old in the world."

Says who?

Doug Anderson, Brampton Battalion commentator.

DashRiprock wrote:Doug Anderson, Brampton Battalion commentator.

tell him to watch a Modo game then

DashRiprock wrote:"John Tavares is the best 18 year old in the world."

Well, I guess that settles it then.



I'm not denying that he's good, I'm denying that he's better than Hedman and I'm denying there being a probability that he'll be better than Spezza while on his rookie contract, which are two things you've insinuated.

If Ottawa drafted John Tavares, could they hypothetically trade Spezza and have Tavares step in and make an impact?

"yes."

Why not just make us both happy and draft both of them? Trade Spezza and others to ensure a 1st and second pick.

Hedman is 17

as is MSP

Hedman is also a defenceman, would you like him to play center?

What I don't understand is why some of you are so insistent on arguing that Hedman is much better and/or ready than Tavares is? Did anyone question or criticize Sidney Crosby before he got drafted? Was there any doubting him? LEt's look at what Tavares has done. He had a rule bent to allow him to play in the OHL at 14. He broke Wayne "F'n" Gretzky's goal record at 16. He's proven he is a consistent point getter, both as a scorer and playmaker. He played with NHLers as an undrafted, underager in the WHC.

Tavares - best forward not in the NHL.

Hedman - the best defenceman not in the NHL

Let's just leave it at that.

Im getting a little tired of people insisting that Spezza be traded, like they expect to get an equivalent player back. I can assure you not. You can get a 1st round pick, and hope that you get someone like Tavares, who can fill his shoes right now. How would trading Spezza, and drafting Hedman help us? Tell me why any team right now would take Spezza, someone who's constantly abused by fans and hockey personalities of being a one way player, a defensive liability, immature, etc?

DashRiprock wrote:Doug Anderson, Brampton Battalion commentator.

One man's opinion? Has he seen every 18 year old in the world play live?

I'd much rather go with the opinion of ISS, who have a team of scouts worldwide.

All things being equal, I think if you have two players of equal talent, always take the D-man.

DashRiprock wrote:Hedman is also a defenceman, would you like him to play center?

What I don't understand is why some of you are so insistent on arguing that Hedman is much better and/or ready than Tavares is? Did anyone question or criticize Sidney Crosby before he got drafted? Was there any doubting him? LEt's look at what Tavares has done. He had a rule bent to allow him to play in the OHL at 14. He broke Wayne "F'n" Gretzky's goal record at 16. He's proven he is a consistent point getter, both as a scorer and playmaker. He played with NHLers as an undrafted, underager in the WHC.

Tavares - best forward not in the NHL.

Hedman - the best defenceman not in the NHL

Let's just leave it at that.

Im getting a little tired of people insisting that Spezza be traded, like they expect to get an equivalent player back. I can assure you not. You can get a 1st round pick, and hope that you get someone like Tavares, who can fill his shoes right now. How would trading Spezza, and drafting Hedman help us? Tell me why any team right now would take Spezza, someone who's constantly abused by fans and hockey personalities of being a one way player, a defensive liability, immature, etc?

Except that it's a pretty big leap of faith to assume the he fills Spezza's shoes right now. You are just assuming that he steps in and we don't miss a beat without Spezza? I'm not prepared to make that jump. Look at Stamkos, who has struggled, even though he's behind on of the league's top five centres. Speaking of which, did Lecavalier start like a house on fire? No.

Regardless of Spezza's shortcomings, there is a market for a big, 25 year old centreman with a couple of 90 point seasons under his belt. Anyone who has THAT much talent will never be without a job. Hell, Yanic Perrault has hung around the league for a couple of years for no other reason that he can win faceoffs. Do you really think Spezza has no market? Please....

And as far as the question of how does trading Spezza and drafting Hedman help us? Well, we'd have a possible generational defenceman on our hands. Sounds pretty good to me.

Except we'd have no #1 center.

If Spezza's as great as you say he is, which I know he is, why is there this outcry for him to be traded?

DashRiprock wrote:Hedman is also a defenceman, would you like him to play center?

What I don't understand is why some of you are so insistent on arguing that Hedman is much better and/or ready than Tavares is? Did anyone question or criticize Sidney Crosby before he got drafted? Was there any doubting him? LEt's look at what Tavares has done. He had a rule bent to allow him to play in the OHL at 14. He broke Wayne "F'n" Gretzky's goal record at 16. He's proven he is a consistent point getter, both as a scorer and playmaker. He played with NHLers as an undrafted, underager in the WHC.

Tavares - best forward not in the NHL.

Hedman - the best defenceman not in the NHL

Let's just leave it at that.

Im getting a little tired of people insisting that Spezza be traded, like they expect to get an equivalent player back. I can assure you not. You can get a 1st round pick, and hope that you get someone like Tavares, who can fill his shoes right now. How would trading Spezza, and drafting Hedman help us? Tell me why any team right now would take Spezza, someone who's constantly abused by fans and hockey personalities of being a one way player, a defensive liability, immature, etc?

Crosby wasn't questioned because in addition to his skill and vision, he is a fantastic skater and has ridiculous, Jagr-esque lower-body strength. Ovechkin, too, is built like a bull and can skate like Pavel Bure.

Hedman is 6-7 and skates like he's 5-7. He's pretty ready. Regardless, that's irrelevant.

You have the impression that we'd just trade Spezza, draft Tavares (who again we're not sure will be a first-liner on his rookie deal) and go on like nothing's changed.

I have a different outlook. Rebuilding is more than a one-year deal. If you look at this draft, Hedman gives you the chance at not only a franchise defenceman, but a generational defenceman.

He won't turn a team that's bad enough to get him around in one season. Crosby couldn't, Ovechkin couldn't. So, you then look at the top of the next draft, and what do you see?

Taylor Hall, Kirill Kabanov, Teemu Pulkkinen. All forwards. There's your replacement Spezza.

Now you have a franchise forward in addition to your potential generational defenceman.

Again, I don't have anything against Tavares, I just think he's slightly over-rated and isn't as good a prospect as Hedman. I don't think there's much question that he's in the top 2 of this draft, despite the strong play of Cowen and MSP.

DashRiprock wrote:Except we'd have no #1 center.

If Spezza's as great as you say he is, which I know he is, why is there this outcry for him to be traded?

because some people have a personal problem with him

Tukker wrote:

DashRiprock wrote:Except we'd have no #1 center.

If Spezza's as great as you say he is, which I know he is, why is there this outcry for him to be traded?

because some people have an irrational problem with him

Fixed.