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What's Next for The Maple Leafs?

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mattshock
spader
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davetherave
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121What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:12 pm

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asq2 wrote:
cas wrote:
asq2 wrote:
cas wrote:
mattshock wrote:Who is going to score goals??... Will the puck ever see the other end of the ice?

Grabovski and Hagman are good for 30+ while Poni K and Blake are good for 20. Add in and average 10 apiece from the other 8 forwards + 30 from the defense and you're already in the 210 range as a conservative estimate. If they get even 35 from the 1st two + 25 from the 2nd two + an extra 15 from the rest of the regs + 5 from callups, thats 250 - well within respectability.

Grabovski's more of a playmaker than a goalscorer. I think they're hoping for Kulemin to score more this season.

That said, you have to anticipate that if the Leafs are serious about implementing a defensive system (at all), many of the forwards' numbers will go down from this season. Plus, they lost Kubina who is pretty good offensively.

Adding Kessel makes a lot of sense for them because they don't really have anyone who can carry an offence for them. Just a lot of second/third line scorers.

What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 229455 I see... Still you'd expect him to put up 20+ this season which puts the Leafs realistically within 200-240 goals. If they top 220 and lower their ga to somewhere in the 26-270 range, they could be a bubble team.
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That same defensive system got Cheechoo 56 goals, so we'll see if it really hurts their numbers that much. What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 42360

What I was trying to say is that Wilson did not have the Leafs playing a lick of defence this past season, and I think that inflated the team's numbers offensively (but obviously, they weren't great in the goals against category).

If they're still going to try to implement a run and gun system, they made completely counter-productive modifications to their blue-line this past off-season. This leads me to suspect that they're going to clamp it down a bit, which should lead to a decrease in scoring.

I still like how the team is set up for the future, but I have a hard time imagining they're going to be defensively honest and still score nearly as much as they did last season.

Fair enough. I'm sure you're right about that. Wilson now has reason to clamp down on other teams. Protecting the monster is the most important thing for that organization going forward.

122What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:12 pm

asq2


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davetherave wrote:Wilson is going to instruct his boys to mash the opposition to a pulp.

They'll be pretty good at that.

I don't know how good they'll be at the combination of stopping their opponents from scoring and scoring themselves. I think it's going to be a choice to be good at one or the other.

123What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:14 pm

davetherave


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asq2 wrote:
davetherave wrote:Wilson is going to instruct his boys to mash the opposition to a pulp.

They'll be pretty good at that.

I don't know how good they'll be at the combination of stopping their opponents from scoring and scoring themselves. I think it's going to be a choice to be good at one or the other.

I would say teams playing the Maple Leafs will be various shades of blue (and black) when they leave Toronto.

It's the Conn Smythe philosophy.

124What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:16 pm

Tuk Tuk

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No one on the leafs will sniff 56 goals. The Sharks had one of the best playmaker in the game, playing with a sniper who's all heart.

Leafs have neither.

125What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:19 pm

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I can't for the life of me figure out why Burke would even contemplate an offer sheet for Kessel. First, they are finally in a position where the fans would accept a true rebuild, which is what they ought to do. Giving away a small army of picks for a guy who is very one dimensional seems crazy. Furthermore, Kessel got 36 goals, but he had Savard feeding him the puck, one of the premier playmakers in the league, and Toronto has nothing remotely similar. This just reeks of a bad move all around.

126What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:19 pm

davetherave

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Hey, what's Nazem Kadri's upside?

127What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:23 pm

Tuk Tuk

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Bringing in a new fanbase...who is also on the no-fly list What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 455378

128What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:24 pm

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davetherave wrote:
asq2 wrote:
davetherave wrote:Wilson is going to instruct his boys to mash the opposition to a pulp.

They'll be pretty good at that.

I don't know how good they'll be at the combination of stopping their opponents from scoring and scoring themselves. I think it's going to be a choice to be good at one or the other.

I would say teams playing the Maple Leafs will be various shades of blue (and black) when they leave Toronto.

It's the Conn Smythe philosophy.

Without a Conn Smythe eligible team What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 78253

129What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:25 pm

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davetherave wrote:Hey, what's Nazem Kadri's upside?

70 point Mike Cammaleri.
Thats his potential.

130What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:28 pm

davetherave

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cas wrote:
davetherave wrote:Hey, what's Nazem Kadri's upside?

70 point Mike Cammaleri.
Thats his potential.

If B-Squared manages to trade for some decent forwards, watch out for Kadri.

131What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:28 pm

asq2

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davetherave wrote:Hey, what's Nazem Kadri's upside?

Probably at best he's a Derek Roy-esque 1a/1b centreman. Not a forward you can build an offence around, but definitely a good complementary scorer (well, passer).

That's basically what their offence consists of now, although his upside is better than any offenceman on the current roster is now (much as I like Hagman).

He, Kulemin and Bozak all have the potential to be pretty productive guys going forward, but they still lack that main guy on offence. That's why IMO a Kessel offer-sheet makes sense. I don't think they're going to be bad enough to get that main guy via the draft.

132What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:29 pm

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hemlock wrote:I can't for the life of me figure out why Burke would even contemplate an offer sheet for Kessel. First, they are finally in a position where the fans would accept a true rebuild, which is what they ought to do. Giving away a small army of picks for a guy who is very one dimensional seems crazy. Furthermore, Kessel got 36 goals, but he had Savard feeding him the puck, one of the premier playmakers in the league, and Toronto has nothing remotely similar. This just reeks of a bad move all around.

Burke isn't a good GM What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 42360 The talk about being known for "building winners" is always pluralised What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 89286 for no apparent reason. He's been co-architect of one team that won one Cup in extremely controversial fashion. No team since the lockout has come anywhere near getting the officiating help/breaks the Ducks did. What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Suspect

Regardless, Pronger and Niedermayer fell into Burke's lap and he had the benefit of Murray bringing in McDonald, Penner, Kunitz, Getzlaf, and Perry, while Selanne came back home to roost What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 598684

What exactly did Burke do?

133What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:30 pm

davetherave

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asq2 wrote:
davetherave wrote:Hey, what's Nazem Kadri's upside?

Probably at best he's a Derek Roy-esque 1a/1b centreman. Not a forward you can build an offence around, but definitely a good complementary scorer (well, passer).

That's basically what their offence consists of now, although his upside is better than any offenceman on the current roster is now (much as I like Hagman).

He, Kulemin and Bozak all have the potential to be pretty productive guys going forward, but they still lack that main guy on offence. That's why IMO a Kessel offer-sheet makes sense. I don't think they're going to be bad enough to get that main guy via the draft.

B2 will probably make a deal for some more than decent talent up front.

134What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:31 pm

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Agreed. He's terribly overrated, and has left messes behind in both Anaheim and Vancouver. My guess is that he'll finally leave the Leafs at some point, cupless and in worse shape then they are now.

135What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:31 pm

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asq2 wrote:
davetherave wrote:Hey, what's Nazem Kadri's upside?

Probably at best he's a Derek Roy-esque 1a/1b centreman. Not a forward you can build an offence around, but definitely a good complementary scorer (well, passer).

That's basically what their offence consists of now, although his upside is better than any offenceman on the current roster is now (much as I like Hagman).

He, Kulemin and Bozak all have the potential to be pretty productive guys going forward, but they still lack that main guy on offence. That's why IMO a Kessel offer-sheet makes sense. I don't think they're going to be bad enough to get that main guy via the draft.

good point and thats a better comparison than mine...Same idea still, but he has more of that D.Roy flare.

Is Kessel really that main guy, though?

136What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:33 pm

davetherave

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cas wrote:
hemlock wrote:I can't for the life of me figure out why Burke would even contemplate an offer sheet for Kessel. First, they are finally in a position where the fans would accept a true rebuild, which is what they ought to do. Giving away a small army of picks for a guy who is very one dimensional seems crazy. Furthermore, Kessel got 36 goals, but he had Savard feeding him the puck, one of the premier playmakers in the league, and Toronto has nothing remotely similar. This just reeks of a bad move all around.

Burke isn't a good GM What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 42360 The talk about being known for "building winners" is always pluralised What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 89286 for no apparent reason. He's been co-architect of one team that won one Cup in extremely controversial fashion. No team since the lockout has come anywhere near getting the officiating help/breaks the Ducks did. What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Suspect

Regardless, Pronger and Niedermayer fell into Burke's lap and he had the benefit of Murray bringing in McDonald, Penner, Kunitz, Getzlaf, and Perry, while Selanne came back home to roost What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 598684

What exactly did Burke do?

You're just being mean 'cause Brian always leaves his tie half undone.
What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 78253

137What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:34 pm

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hemlock wrote:Agreed. He's terribly overrated, and has left messes behind in both Anaheim and Vancouver. My guess is that he'll finally leave the Leafs at some point, cupless and in worse shape then they are now.

If he pulls off this offer sheet business, that would be a good bet to make.

138What's Next for The Maple Leafs? - Page 9 Empty Re: What's Next for The Maple Leafs? Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:34 pm

asq2

asq2
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cas wrote:
asq2 wrote:
davetherave wrote:Hey, what's Nazem Kadri's upside?

Probably at best he's a Derek Roy-esque 1a/1b centreman. Not a forward you can build an offence around, but definitely a good complementary scorer (well, passer).

That's basically what their offence consists of now, although his upside is better than any offenceman on the current roster is now (much as I like Hagman).

He, Kulemin and Bozak all have the potential to be pretty productive guys going forward, but they still lack that main guy on offence. That's why IMO a Kessel offer-sheet makes sense. I don't think they're going to be bad enough to get that main guy via the draft.

good point and thats a better comparison than mine...Same idea still, but he has more of that D.Roy flare.

Is Kessel really that main guy, though?

Well, he has more potential to be than anyone they currently have. Probably significantly more potential.

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