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GM Hockey » Ottawa Senators » Prospecting Prospect - End of Season 18/19

Prospecting Prospect - End of Season 18/19

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Lagoon


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I don’t think he will bust, but if he goes earlier than 8, my opinion is there will 7 better players than him and probably even more because some players like Lundell, Jarvis, Quinn, Amirov, Bordeleau, Gunler, Lapierre and Niederbach will actually hit their upside.

Just imagine what Lundell could be if he starts using his shot and scoring goals. That’s Bergeron.

Stutzle has his flaws and lots of them guys. Not watching film and ignoring them isn’t going to make them go away.

PTFlea


Co-Founder
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wprager wrote:
PTFlea wrote:
Lagoon wrote:We have no business selecting him at 3 or 5.

That’s the last I will say. October is a long way away and I’ve watched all the games and video I can until European leagues start up again.

So...you know something all the pro scouts dont?  Including, I assume, Ottawa's who are one of the best.  We'll see what happens come October, but I think you're mistaken on this player.

No, not October.  I fully expect him to go top-three but to decide whether he should have gone early or out of the top-5 (or top-7) will take a little bit longer.  Like 2 years or more.

I am intrigued by what Lagoon is saying.  There are draft busts almost every year (anyone taken in the 1st round that does not become a full time NHLer while players from later rounds do, is a bit of a bust).  Top-5 busts are more rare but still do happen.  So all those "professional" talent scouts are not necessarily better than so,e of us. There is no college or university degree to teach you how to analyze 17 year olds and project where they will be in 3-5 years.  It's just experience and attention to detail (I don't think there are any scouts out there who have this one extra tool/trick they use to make them better than everyone else).

And, in fact, a hockey fan could very well spot a bust quicker than a paid scout for one simple reason: he could be only looking at the top-10 players and not the top 700.

So, we'll see in a couple years if Lagoon was right.

Maybe, but you screw up a top 5 pick and you're toast as a professional and they know what they're looking for more so than any one of us. In the end, it's still a risk, but if in October he goes for Ottawa at 3, you know they've done their homework and you know that they know they'll be judged on the pick for years to come.

PTFlea


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Co-Founder
I genuinely don't understand what is a negative about Stutzle. He backchecks like a friend, he's best in class passer, he's a decent fore checker, good shot when he uses it. Wins puck battles.

He watches his man from time to time apparently, but that's in a man's league. He'll have time to iron that out.

What are the negatives you've seen?

Ev

Ev
Franchise Player
Franchise Player
I’d you’re talking about a player who could up 90-100 points, as has been mentioned here, then it doesn’t matter how good anyone picked after him is. That’s a true star forward

wprager

wprager
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Administrator
Lagoon has listed his (perceived, alleged) flaws. Just read a few posts back.

However the more important quality is coachability. He has not played on NA ice so, his penchant for playing it side comes from that. He may adjust well to the smaller rink and with good coaching may start playing more toward the middle. Or maybe they play him on the wing. Only time will tell.


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Lagoon

Lagoon
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Let’s just say this. Stutzle will not go 2nd overall, even though the Kings need wingers way more than another C in their pipeline, even though LA has a German Assistant Coach, even if LA has a press conference in the 5 minutes that introduces Stutzle to their fans, and even though Bob McKenzie’s list of 10 scouts and other various mainstream scouts have Stutzle ranked 2. There is a reason for this. Many reasons actually.

There, I said it. That’s as far as my mock will go for now.

I hope I’m wrong, but I’m know I’m not because Byfield is Byfield and Stutzle has a ton of already written flaws in the nature of his game.

Stutzle, as good as he is, not a safe or smart pick at anything lower than 8 in my opinion. Will he go earlier, yes. But you will look back and easily spot 7 better players than him in 4-7 years. Ignoring his tendencies is not wise.



Last edited by Lagoon on Fri Jul 10, 2020 12:19 pm; edited 2 times in total

tim1_2

tim1_2
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Agreed that Byfield will go #2....but what do I know.

Ev

Ev
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tim1_2 wrote:Agreed that Byfield will go #2....but what do I know.

we all know nothing at the end of the day. I have my favourites and lesser favourites, but I will literally be happy with any combo we get at 3 and 5. They have put in years of work into this draft. They will know who to pick.

Lagoon

Lagoon
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Ev wrote:
tim1_2 wrote:Agreed that Byfield will go #2....but what do I know.

we all know nothing at the end of the day. I have my favourites and lesser favourites, but I will literally be happy with any combo we get at 3 and 5. They have put in years of work into this draft. They will know who to pick.

Raymond and Rossi it is.

Ev

Ev
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Franchise Player
Lagoon wrote:
Ev wrote:
tim1_2 wrote:Agreed that Byfield will go #2....but what do I know.

we all know nothing at the end of the day. I have my favourites and lesser favourites, but I will literally be happy with any combo we get at 3 and 5. They have put in years of work into this draft. They will know who to pick.

Raymond and Rossi it is.

I mean I'd prefer Byfield and Rossi...

Lagoon

Lagoon
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I’d prefer Lafreniere and Byfield, but

Hobiesens

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I'd be fine with Raymond and Rossi however if we've picked someone else, I think they pick Raymond over Rossi.

Ev

Ev
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There’s very realistic chance of Raymond being there at 5

Lagoon

Lagoon
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Hobiesens wrote:I'd be fine with Raymond and Rossi however if we've picked someone else, I think they pick Raymond over Rossi.

Getting away from BPA and looking at my mock, Raymond and Rossi are so close for me in my BPA, that for my mock, I’d prefer Raymond if we already took a C and I prefer Rossi if we already took a W.

If we haven’t taken anyone yet and both Laf and Byfield are gone, Raymond is my #3

DefenceWinsChampionships


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Ev wrote:There’s very realistic chance of Raymond being there at 5

I don't see the Wings passing on Perfetti given their connections to Saginaw (Osgood part owner, Saginaw was OHL draft base for Wings, etc). They also don't seem to have a problem drafting off the board given how early they drafted Seider last year. I'd also argue that Perfetti isn't that off the board. The only way they pass on him is to take Drysdale IMO.

That leaves Rossi, Raymond, and one of Perfetti/Drysdale available at #5. I also think the Devils may take a chance and draft Askarov with their own pick or with the better of Van/Arizona depending when that is, but I doubt Askarov makes it past Chicago or Buffalo. That said, I could see Buffalo trading their 1st for immediate help, ie: someone to play with Eichel and/or keep Eichel happy.

Speaking hypothetically, Ottawa could flip #5 and the Isles 1st rd pick to NJD for #7 and the better of the Arizona/Vancouver 1st (assuming it makes sense to do so) and throw in a 2nd and a goalie prospect (Gus?) if it's a top 12 pick.

Ottawa could ultimately walk away with Byfield/Stutzle, Raymond/Rossi/Drysdale (which they could likely get at #5 anyway), and move up to grab Sanderson/Lundell/Quinn/Holtz/Schneider depending on what mock draft you look at and what the NJD pick coming back would be.

The Sens also have a good trading history with Columbus. They could ultimately flip the Isles 1st and a couple of 2nds for the Columbus 1st, even if it's just to move up a couple spots. It all depends on the lottery and where the remaining teams place. All I have to say is Go Panthers, and let's hope a team in the West or anyone not named Montreal, NYI or Toronto wins the lottery.

Flo The Action

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DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
Ev wrote:There’s very realistic chance of Raymond being there at 5

I don't see the Wings passing on Perfetti given their connections to Saginaw (Osgood part owner, Saginaw was OHL draft base for Wings, etc). They also don't seem to have a problem drafting off the board given how early they drafted Seider last year. I'd also argue that Perfetti isn't that off the board. The only way they pass on him is to take Drysdale IMO.

That leaves Rossi, Raymond, and one of Perfetti/Drysdale available at #5. I also think the Devils may take a chance and draft Askarov with their own pick or with the better of Van/Arizona depending when that is, but I doubt Askarov makes it past Chicago or Buffalo. That said, I could see Buffalo trading their 1st for immediate help, ie: someone to play with Eichel and/or keep Eichel happy.

Speaking hypothetically, Ottawa could flip #5 and the Isles 1st rd pick to NJD for #7 and the better of the Arizona/Vancouver 1st (assuming it makes sense to do so) and throw in a 2nd and a goalie prospect (Gus?) if it's a top 12 pick.  

Ottawa could ultimately walk away with Byfield/Stutzle, Raymond/Rossi/Drysdale (which they could likely get at #5 anyway), and move up to grab Sanderson/Lundell/Quinn/Holtz/Schneider depending on what mock draft you look at and what the NJD pick coming back would be.

The Sens also have a good trading history with Columbus. They could ultimately flip the Isles 1st and a couple of 2nds for the Columbus 1st, even if it's just to move up a couple spots. It all depends on the lottery and where the remaining teams place. All I have to say is Go Panthers, and let's hope a team in the West or anyone not named Montreal, NYI or Toronto wins the lottery.

i really like Perfetti but i don't know that he's a top 4 guy. even for detroit.

DefenceWinsChampionships


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Rossi had 9 more points on a superior team. Not saying they're the same player but taking perfetti at 4 isnt any different than taking Rossi or Raymond around the same time and the Wings had eyes on him all year

DefenceWinsChampionships


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https://www.nhl.com/redwings/news/getting-to-know-cole-perfetti/c-317168004

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