How do we fix the Senators

wprager wrote:Anyhow, we're not here to help Yzerman.   We've got less than 24 hours to fix the Sens!

Im afraid that might not happen.

The Blues want a legit top 6 forward for Shattenkirk, not a mediocre defenceman coming back. So it'd be Hoffman or ZBad or something like that.

Also, the #1 thing to help the team would be a new owner.

tim1_2 wrote:The Blues want a legit top 6 forward for Shattenkirk, not a mediocre defenceman coming back.  So it'd be Hoffman or ZBad or something like that.  

Also, the #1 thing to help the team would be a new owner.

I should edit the first post and add that in as an option

tim1_2 wrote:The Blues want a legit top 6 forward for Shattenkirk, not a mediocre defenceman coming back.  So it'd be Hoffman or ZBad or something like that.  

Also, the #1 thing to help the team would be a new owner.

Ya. I'm thinking Hoffman. I think that deal only happens if we trade Ceci for drouin. And then you're basically replacing Ceci with shatts and Hoffman with drouin minus what it takes to squire druoin on top of Ceci. That's a lot of moving parts so it's likely not happening. But I think it makes us better going forward next year. I'd do it. Especially if Melnyk pays up to resign shatts. You pray to hell wier can regain some of his form aired with an experience blueliner.
But again, too many moving parts to ever happen.

I wonder if we could do a McDavid for EK deal.

Oglethorpe wrote:I wonder if we could do a McDavid for EK deal.

Would that fix the Senators? It would fix the Oilers.

Oglethorpe wrote:I wonder if we could do a McDavid for EK deal.

Yknow, that's kind of an interesting scenario, and is likely roughly even in value. Honestly, though, I'd rather keep Karlsson. Imagine our D without him. Yikes. It'll never happen anyway.

wprager wrote:

Oglethorpe wrote:I wonder if we could do a McDavid for EK deal.

Would that fix the Senators?  It would fix the Oilers.

I don't think there is a quick fix for the Sens. Can we fix the current team to make the playoffs, maybe, but we need a reboot to go and get a cup.

I think you can do enough of a quick fix to make the playoffs, which is important for the growth of the team.

If you're gonna tank and start another retool you might as well move Karlsson because it will set the team back another 3 or 4 years.

If Turris wasn't injured and Stone didn't drop off the edge like he did, we wouldn't even have this thread. Fact is that we don't have good depth on this team and injuries have hurt us. But we have a double-Norris winner in his prime, one of the best shots in the league in Hoffman, future Selke winner in Stone, and a goalie who set the all-time season SV% record. Turris doesn't have the size you'd want in a top-line center and Zibanejad isn't there yet, either. What we need to do is trim the fat (Cowen, Wiercioch, Smith, Neil, Chiasson, one of Prince/Puempel), bring in a legit second pairing leftie, and hope to hell that CMac can still play well, and Zibanejad/Ceci/Lazar take another step forward.

Next season we will have Colin White pushing for a spot; he's not going to be a top-line center but he could push Zibanejad a bit. Chabot will likely get a few games on the third pairing but he won't be a big contributor for another couple seasons, at least.

No, we don't need to tank, but missing the playoffs wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

wprager wrote:If Turris wasn't injured and Stone didn't drop off the edge like he did, we wouldn't even have this thread.  Fact is that we don't have good depth on this team and injuries have hurt us.  But we have a double-Norris winner in his prime, one of the best shots in the league in Hoffman, future Selke winner in Stone, and a goalie who set the all-time season SV% record.  Turris doesn't have the size you'd want in a top-line center and Zibanejad isn't there yet, either.  What we need to do is trim the fat (Cowen, Wiercioch, Smith, Neil, Chiasson, one of Prince/Puempel), bring in a legit second pairing leftie, and hope to hell that CMac can still play well, and Zibanejad/Ceci/Lazar take another step forward.

Next season we will have Colin White pushing for a spot; he's not going to be a top-line center but he could push Zibanejad a bit.  Chabot will likely get a few games on the third pairing but he won't be a big contributor for another couple seasons, at least.

No, we don't need to tank, but missing the playoffs wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

Holy cow, I agree with most of everything in this post

I think white will need another year on top of what you said but it's all there. I'm not sure how people are thinking we need to start over. There are so many good pieces in this team. We just have some really big holes on D. Som of it will hopefuly grow from the inside like Ceci, some of it need to be addressed like a partner for Ceci. You can hope MacArthur develops but in all honesty it wouldn't hurt to have another LW top 6. So what are we saying? Two guys brought in? Have some youth push some of the other guys out? That only sounds like an overhaul to me. No need for a full scale rebuild.

If I were the owner, I would be trying to target an SC contender to marry up with a new building. EK will be 32 by then McDavid will be 26. Wallowing in mediocrity for the next 3-4 years is wasting both EK's prime and his value contract. I consider mediocrity to be making the playoffs and winning a round or if everything falls right, 2 rounds.

Our current depth at centre is average at best. We have 2 number 2s and a few number 3s.

Going into this season with the D they had they took a lot of gambles on a lot of players.

Cowen showed nothing but being young to believe it improve.

Weircioch they believed would replicate what he did at the end of last season and continue to progress

Ceci they thought was a legit to 4 D based on his part last season.

None of that paid off plus Zibanejad not taking the next step and injuries to CMac and Michalek hurt.

It's obvious. Way too many gambles on way too many players.

Oglethorpe wrote:Our current depth at centre is average at best.  We have 2 number 2s and a few number 3s.  

I would argue that our center depth is fine going forward. I'm quite comfortable with turris and I have faith that Zib will improve. I don't buy into the need to have a point per Game Center down the middle to be effective. I look at Boston around the time they won the cup and see that we could be in a similar position going forward. Zib is still young and will most likely improve. If anything he's doing better than earlier on.

I don't think we are seriously that far away from being a contender, and as long as we don't trade Chabot or white and actually manage to acquire a top 4 D and a top 6 LW I still see out window opening up and contending for years. Key will be on those acquisitions. Frankly if MacArthur isn't shut down then maybe it's all about the D.

It's easy being pessimistic right now but I think we're failing to see that a few players are underperforming right now. Stone will arguably be much better in years to come and we are the victim of being a young team. Meaning that it's easier to suffer incomsistency as a group at this stage then just have a few players here and there. Injuries have been really bad this year. Might have to, as prags mentioned, admit that injuries took too much of a toll this year and accept the fact that we might miss the playoffs and do whatever we need to do to acquire that top 4 D between now and the start of next season.

It might necessitate BM to step down and let Dorion try his hand at it.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:Going into this season with the D they had they took a lot of gambles on a lot of players.

Cowen showed nothing but being young to believe it improve.

Weircioch they believed would replicate what he did at the end of last season and continue to progress

Ceci they thought was a legit to 4 D based on his part last season.

None of that paid off plus Zibanejad not taking the next step and injuries to CMac and Michalek hurt.

It's obvious. Way too many gambles on way too many players.

Economics dictated all the gambles, but I think the next GM will at least have this year to see that a big change of course is required.

And I don't even see Edmonton trading macdavid for karlsson. The hype around macdavid is too high.

Oglethorpe wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:Going into this season with the D they had they took a lot of gambles on a lot of players.

Cowen showed nothing but being young to believe it improve.

Weircioch they believed would replicate what he did at the end of last season and continue to progress

Ceci they thought was a legit to 4 D based on his part last season.

None of that paid off plus Zibanejad not taking the next step and injuries to CMac and Michalek hurt.

It's obvious. Way too many gambles on way too many players.

Economics dictated all the gambles, but I think the next GM will at least have this year to see that a big change of course is required.  

If the GM comes from outside the org he might just pull a chichi and sit on the team once again to "evaluate" what he has. I'm in favour of promoting Dorion as he has first hand knowledge of the team we have. If there's a move to be made, I'm sure he'll do it.